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Seadog

Sad comment on level of discussion here

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In these forum pages I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

What is the point of negative comments in this forum, especially when they are responses from people who have no use of a proposed/requested feature, or those who cannot understand the utility of a particular feature or control?  

As a reaction to those who prefer to knock very worthy proposals, I offer this suggestion: isn't it better to be positive and support anything that will help program developers produce a superior product? If one cannot be positive, why bother saying anything?  

Being supportive of good ideas, rather than trying to knock them down, can only encourage a win-win. Better software (thus, happy users) and happy developers who will be encouraged to greater heights.


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Affinity Publisher (beta)   Affinity Designer   Affinity Photo

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14 hours ago, Seadog said:

If one cannot be positive, why bother saying anything?

The original post by Seadog is non-positive and therefore, by Seadog’s own reasoning, should not have been posted. In the interests of keeping a positive nature to the forum I suggest that it might be beneficial to the general happiness of the community if the post were removed so that only positive comments can be seen without having all this negativity. Having said that, this post is non-positive towards Seadog’s post and therefore it should also be removed for the same reason. Also, my last sentence is non-positive towards what has been said earlier and so… <repeat ad nauseam>
Note: This is not a serious suggestion. I only mention it to demonstrate a point, a point which I think should be reasonably clear.

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Never noticed the discussions here to be rude or negative (mostly). Of course with a mixed audience there are different opinions what one expects from a software. The needs for those working in an advertising agency may differ from the needs of those who want to make sometimes a flyer for a sports club (no rating here). BUT if someone has an idea should bring some valid arguments for a suggestion, maybe others will be persuaded that it is indeed a good suggestion. I am confident, that the mods and devs are watching our discussions mindfully and have their own discussions if the suggestion is worth to implement. So everything fine here on my side, got a thick fur (german saying) over the years. ;)

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Someone, male, told me years ago, nothing to do with Serif, and as far as I know years before Serif even started, that if someone has put forward an idea that there is more kudos (that was the word he used) for someone else if he (he said 'he') writes opposing it than if he writes supporting it.

Alas, it seems that that is true.

I have put ideas forward ideas in various places and quite often someone replies dismissing the idea, often very quickly.

Alas, if the person doing the opposing is in a senior position and very influential a lot of people either "go by" what that person says or feel that it is best to say nothing.

I remember seeing on television once someone, I think it was a businessman, saying something like "Never turn down an idea unless you have given it serious consideration for at least five minutes."

William

 


Using a Lenovo ideapad 510 running Windows 10 in England

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15 hours ago, Seadog said:

I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

It's not us the users of the software who turn down features proposed by others, it's the developers who tell us that said features won't come anytime soon if it's in their roadmap at all.

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I would imagine that development time is precious for a small team.  If someone proposes something that is of limited or specialised value to only a small amount of people then other people may feel the need to oppose it if they believe time spent by the devs would be better spent on other things.

Is someone wants their ideas to be listened to and subsequently implemented they need to be able to make compelling arguments for its implementation and to be able to counter any objections to the idea that may arise.

In the early stages of a product's development where more globally accepted improvements/functions are needed, it's unlikely that less requested things will be prioritised unless they can be implemented with a minimal/proportional impact on the developers time.

People should not stop requesting stuff but they should understand why other people may oppose "them" or why their ideas never seem to get the developers "immediate" attention.
 
TL;DR

"the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"


Due to the ongoing Brexit negotiations, punctuation, spelling and grammar will be used sparingly until further notice.

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1 hour ago, carl123 said:

"the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few"

No, I disagree with that statement.

When someone has a need, that need is important to that person and should be considered.

It depends on the various needs. 

William

 


Using a Lenovo ideapad 510 running Windows 10 in England

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3 minutes ago, magicdesign__ said:

can we get the ability to open pageplus files in publisher please? :)

Yes, that would be good.

William

 


Using a Lenovo ideapad 510 running Windows 10 in England

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I find this a friendly and beneficial community. I am using Serif products since 2009 now, and they never failed me. Affinity let me do more with my limited talents than what would be possible with the Adobe products. When there is a problem, it is always solved in each other's best interest.

If we agree or disagree with somebody else, a feature request is not the question. In case somebody requests a feature that is of no immediate need for me, and the application looks well thought out, I will support it. If there is no need for me, or I disagree, I simply keep quiet. Let's be considerate to each other and just let Serif decide which requests can be fulfilled or not.

I do appreciate the hard work of the Serif team. Affinity Publisher took a lot of my patience, but I knew from the beginning it was worthwhile the wait. Keep up the good work Serif-Team, at least I am completely relying on your toolset.

Chris

A very satisfied user of the Affinity range.

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2 hours ago, magicdesign__ said:

can we get the ability to open pageplus files in publisher please? :)

That's one of those questions again. Or: "I want to have arrow buttons for the undo function"? Can you please do everything so that it looks like "Word"?

Not only the one who answers, but also the one who asks has a duty of care! ;)


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21 hours ago, Seadog said:

Being supportive of good ideas,(...) can only encourage a win-win.

Not only a win-win, in this regard:

– Repairing bugs is often more positive than implementing new ideas (possibly with more bugs), especially if time and manpower are limited.
– For a first final version not all good ideas can get implemented. Therefore, there is a struggle between good ideas to strengthen one idea over another.
– Features require a user interface, so many features increase complexity or even confusion. Therefore, it can be considered positive to prevent some ideas from being realized.


macOS 10.12.6,  Macbook Pro 15" + Eizo 24"

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There's some good sense talked here, I have been a user of DTP since Timeworks and an enthusiastic user of PagePlus since Version 1.

When Serif first released its DTP as a set of floppy 3½" disks it looked very like PageMaker but did not carry the stupid high price. It was buggy yet easy to use getting better and better until it developed into version X9. It became what I considered the most competent and user-friendly DTP on the market.

Now we have Publisher it looks to me very much as if many are expecting miracles for a first version. Of course I still use PagePlus for my serious work because I know it so well. I will be getting familiar with Publisher as soon as it is released. It will take a great deal of getting used to. I am prepared to wait, I have a great deal of faith in the programmers. Serif have been unique in listening and responding to the suggestions of its users, Serif users have proved to be the most helpful and courteous on any forums I have been part of. Please be patient, this will eventually be better than any of its big competitors, it will take time but I know, from my personal experience I can assure you of that.

John

PagePlus 1.jpg

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On 6/5/2019 at 1:22 PM, Seadog said:

In these forum pages, I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

 

I've been reading and commenting on this forum for a while now and I haven't really seen too many negative responses.  I can't say I've read every topic, but for the ones I've participated in, the responses have been supportive and sometimes very funny.  The responses from the Serif staff may be short in some cases, but I think that's due to the very large volume of comments posted for this beta.  The advanced members and the moderators who reply are always thoughtful and well written.  Even the "this feature is vital to my workflow and it's inexcusable that it's not already in the application..." type comments are met with calm, well-reasoned responses.  

I think @walt.farrell deserves the House Cup for all of the great responses he makes. His current count of postings is 5,037.  Walt--do you eat or sleep?

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On ‎6‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 6:22 PM, Seadog said:

In these forum pages I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

I do agree with this, but, just playing devil's advocate, what is a "good proposal" to one person may be bad or useless to another. Likewise, people may object to something for what, to them, is a very good reason. Disagreeing with someone is not necessarily being negative, often it's just expressing a different point of view.

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2 hours ago, mac_heibu said:

Yes, we should create a „King of Affinity Forums“ trophy and award it to @walt.farrell!

Alfred has 11,424.   


21.5 iMAC Retina 4K display. MacOS Sierra v. 10.12.6 (which I am not changing).  3.1 GHz quad-core Intel Core i5, Turbo Boost up to 3.6 GHz.  Memory 8 GB 1867 MHz LPDDR3.  1TB Fusion Drive.  Intel Iris Pro Graphics 6200 1536 MB.   iPad Pro 12.9, iOS v. 12.3.1, Apple Pencil.  Affinity Publisher 1.7.1,  Affinity Photo 1.7.1, Affinity Designer 1.7.1.   

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It is not the number. It is, in my eyes, the ever friendly, cautious, comprehensible and deeply knowledgeable manner of Walt’s posts. No criticism at all against good ol’ Alfred! :)

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On 6/5/2019 at 7:22 PM, Seadog said:

In these forum pages I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

What is the point of negative comments in this forum, especially when they are responses from people who have no use of a proposed/requested feature, or those who cannot understand the utility of a particular feature or control?  

As a reaction to those who prefer to knock very worthy proposals, I offer this suggestion: isn't it better to be positive and support anything that will help program developers produce a superior product? If one cannot be positive, why bother saying anything?  

Being supportive of good ideas, rather than trying to knock them down, can only encourage a win-win. Better software (thus, happy users) and happy developers who will be encouraged to greater heights.

I think many experienced user here is afraid that Affinity Publisher/Designer/Photo will be too bloated with functions if every good (or bad) idea should be implemented into the Affinity Suite...

If we should keep the speed of this software wonder, we should be careful what we demand... I’m pretty happy with the result so far with the A-Suite...

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29 minutes ago, ErrkaPetti said:

I think many experienced user here is afraid that Affinity Publisher/Designer/Photo will be too bloated with functions if every good (or bad) idea should be implemented into the Affinity Suite...

IMHO - This is what happened with the Plus range that Serif used to produce. More and more "bells and whistles", but failing performance! :(

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On 6/5/2019 at 10:22 AM, Seadog said:

In these forum pages I have noticed lots of good proposals being 'torn down' by others for no good reason, almost before they had the chance to see the light of day. 

What is the point of negative comments in this forum, especially when they are responses from people who have no use of a proposed/requested feature, or those who cannot understand the utility of a particular feature or control?  

As a reaction to those who prefer to knock very worthy proposals, I offer this suggestion: isn't it better to be positive and support anything that will help program developers produce a superior product? If one cannot be positive, why bother saying anything?  

Being supportive of good ideas, rather than trying to knock them down, can only encourage a win-win. Better software (thus, happy users) and happy developers who will be encouraged to greater heights.

There is one person who aggressively attacks when he feels like it. The block/ignore function is very helpful to phase out such negativity. I blocked one such person on my first day here, and didn't have to do it a second time luckily, and it is a blessed feature.

 

What the forum could use is a discussion of future features or re-organization of current features.

One example would be that you cannot embed video or sound like in Adobe In-Design. I think Publisher allows now for active links to be included.

I still hope for a better manual, as the current one is only good if you precisely know what you are looking for. I would like a manual that is process oriented: I want to do this, and what tools would I have to my disposition. 

This would avoid a lot of basic questions that one has to ask in the forum without such an accessible, practically oriented source of information. 

This is particularly useful if you come from other software like Photoshop and are used doing things a certain way, and now this doesn't work, because this is a completely different kind of software.

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