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The functionality to switch between artistic and frame text would be a great addition to Designer... Illustrator's implementation of doing this (double click a specific node on a text object, or right click > convert to...) is a perfect example on how it should be handled.

Here's a thread with a whole bunch of other people wanting this as well.

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I would like that option as well. It's possible to convert artistic text to frame text, but not the opposite. When scaling everything on a design, the frame text shifts away from the proper wrap.


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+1. I'm just switching to Designer and surprised this isn't a feature.

 

On 9/16/2018 at 2:34 PM, Bri-Toon said:

It's possible to convert artistic text to frame text, but not the opposite. 

Is it? How?

 

 

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7 hours ago, Barbasol said:

Is it? How?

It's not really an intuitive way, but highlight the text and cut it. Now take any other tool and make sure nothing is selected. Paste, and you will get a large text frame with that text.


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Again, a topic conjures up fond memories of FreeHand.

FreeHand had just one kind of text object. It could be set to auto-expand horizontally (i.e., becoming functionally equivalent to a so-called "art text" object in other programs) by simply doubleClicking the right middle handle. It could be set to auto-fit its contained text vertically by doubleClicking its bottom middle handle. The text objects could be bound to and released from paths (instead of being treated as a separate "path text" object). They could be threaded, whether bound to a path or not. They could be set to auto-expand when bound to a path, thereby preventing the problem of accidentally truncated text in complex maps, as is so chronically common in maps built in Illustrator.

This is conceptually parallel to the fact that FreeHand also never had any need for two separate selection tools. Its single selection tool enabled you to edit paths at the whole object level and at the node editing level. That elegant interface design made path drawing far less tedious, more fluidly efficient, and more powerful than any drawing program that insists on following Adobe's hideous model of two primary selection tools.

Macromedia finally gave in to ill-advised "demand" from Illustrator users to add a second pointer tool. When added, it provided absolutely no additional functionality. It was literally nothing but an accommodation to Illustrator-habituated users who just refused to learn that it was absolutely unnecessary. FreeHand users simply ignored it. It was not until FreeHand's very last version that its white pointer did anything that the black pointer didn't, and even that was a minor detail that could have been implemented without adding another tool.

Despite Illustrator's two selection tools (three, really, when you include the ill-conceived "Convert AnchorPoint Tool")--actually because of it--Illustrator to this day does not "know the difference" between a path being selected at the object level versus merely having all its AnchorPoints selected. This causes all kinds of silly inconsistencies such as being unable to use the Break Anchor Point command when all of a path's Anchor Points are selected. (You have to unintuitively de-select at least one Anchor Point for it to work.)

Because object selection is so bedrock foundational to an object-based program, its tedious effects "cascade upward" throughout the program's interface. In a nutshell, it's what makes working in Illustrator feel as frustrating to beginners as trying to eat spaghetti with a single chopstick.

It's because Illustrator's white pointer behavior is conceptually "upside down" from intuition. It's the selection tool you have to use to edit a path.  But its first click always selects the most "internal" sub-part element of whatever construct you are trying to manipulate. Rather than intuitively selecting an object of interest and then "digging down" to its subparts with subsequent clicks, Illustrator's scheme first selects some "molecule" of the object of interest and requires use of a modifier key and subsequent clicks to "back out" of it to each next higher level.

It's metaphorically like getting up in the morning and needing a pair of socks. So you intuitively try to open your sock drawer. But your hand passed right through the closed drawer, and the only thing you can grab is a single thread of a single sock. So you have to then use both your hands to select a single sock, and grab again with both hands to grasp the folded up pair. All this "Bizzarro World" behavior instead of simply opening the drawer and grabbing the pair of socks.

The beginning of the end of FreeHand was not the Adobe acquisition. It was when it started to emulate Illustrator's hideous interface.

Unfortunately, because things like selection tools and text objects are foundational to the program built upon them, I'm sure it's too late to back-track the existing conventional-wisdom (i.e. "like Illustrator") in either case. But I say again: If you want to build a better drawing program, Adobe Illustrator is not the program to emulate.

JET

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Elaborate post and all, but it doesn't really help or belong on this feature request... The main concern here is the text tool, not the pointer tool.

The fact remains that there should be a decent way to switch between "artistic" and "frame" text in affinity. Whatever route they choose to add this functionality, as long as it's intuitive, is fine with me.

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On 9/19/2018 at 8:31 PM, Bri-Toon said:

It's not really an intuitive way, but highlight the text and cut it. Now take any other tool and make sure nothing is selected. Paste, and you will get a large text frame with that text.

That's interesting in that it shows the functionality is almost already built it!

The main thing missing is to autosize the text frame. For my purposes, this is mainly what I need (Artistic->Frame Text). Thanks.

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29 minutes ago, Barbasol said:

The main thing missing is to autosize the text frame.

How should the program determine the ‘correct’ dimensions? If you have to supply that information somehow, you might as well make do with the overly large text frame as a starting point, resize it to the desired width and then double-click the bottom centre handle to adjust the height so that it fits the text snugly.


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I get Alfred's point, but the text frame does seem to jump in size a bit much, doesn't it? Well at least there's a way now. I originally didn't even know about the option to convert one to another. It was an accidental discovery.


The website is still a work in progress. The "Comics" and "Shop" sections are not yet ready. Feel free to connect with me and let me know what you like or what can be improved. You can contact me here, on my contact page, YouTube channel, or Twitter account. Thanks and have a great day!

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On 9/22/2018 at 1:20 PM, JET_Affinity said:

Macromedia finally gave in to ill-advised "demand" from Illustrator users to add a second pointer tool.

Designer has also, at least, two "extra" tools:

  1. Node Tool - can be achieved by double clicking on a curve;
  2. Pen and Pencil Tools - can be combined together to work just like in Freehand.

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6 minutes ago, Cristian Dragos said:

Any feedback from the serif team would be awesome! I use this feature all the time in Illustrator and Photoshop so it would be very useful to get it in AD as well.

Serif staff generally do not comment on feature requests, Cristian. They read them, and use them for planning purposes, but unless they have a question about something someone has said, or have an announcement to make, they usually do not post here.


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31 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Serif staff generally do not comment on feature requests, Cristian. They read them, and use them for planning purposes, but unless they have a question about something someone has said, or have an announcement to make, they usually do not post here.

Thanks for the info, Walt! Hopefully they will read and take into consideration some of our requests.


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On 10/10/2018 at 11:48 AM, Alfred said:

How should the program determine the ‘correct’ dimensions? If you have to supply that information somehow, you might as well make do with the overly large text frame as a starting point, resize it to the desired width and then double-click the bottom centre handle to adjust the height so that it fits the text snugly.

Not sure why I never responded to this... but can't it just use the dimensions of the Artistic Text object you are converting from? I just think it's easier for the user if it matches the old text, letting the user expand in the desired dimension (maybe the old width was fine and they just need vertical). Right now when you paste it creates a default sized Frame Text object that will almost always need resizing.

Or maybe you were just talking about the pasting workaround. Well even in this case, it would be great if they just made the new Frame Text object match the size of the text you are pasting in. (Maybe they purposely make it bigger so you realize it's Frame Text vs Artistic Text?) 

 

Right now, to convert Artistic to Frame Text, the steps are:

1. Select text in Artistic Text object.

2. Copy Text.

3. Click on document to deselect.

4. Paste Text to create Frame Text object.

5. Move new Frame Text to old Artistic Text (luckily, snapping makes this less tedious)

6. Resize new Frame Text to match old Artistic Text (admittedly you may want it a different size anyway, but I'd rather it matched the old text and let the user expand, vs extra large and making the user contract.)

7. Delete the old Artistic Text.

So those are 7 tedious steps that are perfectly suited for computer automation! 

I just find it amazing that Artistic Text->Frame Text is almost already built in (via Paste) they just need to match the sizing when pasting text. And possibly formalize it by adding a menu command.

Actually, when you right-click the menu command is already there just grayed out, called "Convert to Text Frame". 😀 Ok, not really. That command is to convert a vector shape into a text frame but it could just contextually work to convert Artistic Text if that is what is selected. (I'm not really thinking this through, maybe a separate menu command makes sense.)

 

Anyway, my main point is this would be a great feature and I don't see how it would be that hard to implement. The conversion doesn't have to be perfect if the two types of text don't support all the features of the other. Just a basic conversion would be so helpful.

 

 

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42 minutes ago, Barbasol said:

Right now when you paste it creates a default sized Frame Text object that will almost always need resizing.

You can avoid that problem by creating the new Frame Text object explicitly at the desired size before pasting, rather than letting the app create it for you at the default size.


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+2 on this request on behalf myself and the other UI designer at my company. Frequently re-creating text boxes using frame instead of artistic has become a dark joke between us.

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On 9/22/2018 at 7:20 AM, JET_Affinity said:

Again, a topic conjures up fond memories of FreeHand.

FreeHand had just one kind of text object.

...

This is conceptually parallel to the fact that FreeHand also never had any need for two separate selection tools. Its single selection tool enabled you to edit paths at the whole object level and at the node editing level. That elegant interface design made path drawing far less tedious, more fluidly efficient, and more powerful than any drawing program that insists on following Adobe's hideous model of two primary selection tools.

....

Unfortunately, because things like selection tools and text objects are foundational to the program built upon them, I'm sure it's too late to back-track the existing conventional-wisdom (i.e. "like Illustrator") in either case. But I say again: If you want to build a better drawing program, Adobe Illustrator is not the program to emulate.

JET

You are my hero. So absolutely right that you deserve a reward. You need to be hired by Serif and carry this fundamental concept to  the world through the vessel of Affinity Designer. I do really like AD but I have to say that my secret hope was that it might be picking up the Freehand paradigm of selection and manipulation of path and text objects.

Boy was that a powerful advantage of Freehand. Any other bells and whistles paled in comparison. Once "getting" Freehand's method it was so painful and infuriating to go back to Illustrator's idiotic ways.  Designer has not copied all of Illustrator's annoyances and is more pleasing to use but I really hope that someone at Serif looks into what you are saying and sees the light. 

Preach it!

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On 7/20/2020 at 11:29 AM, ThatMikeGuy said:

You need to be hired by Serif and carry this fundamental concept to  the world through the vessel of Affinity Designer.

I don’t know if @JET_Affinity might want that, but who knows, maybe feedback sessions and demos via Skype or something? Like when they shared the Designer for iPad Beta with some designers and artists.

Very good things could happen.

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Sometimes I lay down some text with artistic text because I don't like to have to stretch a box first. I just lay it down to see how it looks as one line. Then if I decide it's too long and I would like to wrap it, I would really REALLY like the ability to covert to text frame so I can start adjusting the wrap. Seems like that case wouldn't be difficult.

+1 for this feature.

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4 minutes ago, mediumcheese said:

Sometimes I lay down some text with artistic text because I don't like to have to stretch a box first.

Is it really such a great hardship to stretch out a text frame until you’re sure it’s more than wide enough to accommodate all of the text, and then adjust the width of that box once the text has been added??


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6 minutes ago, Alfred said:

Is it really such a great hardship to stretch out a text frame until you’re sure it’s more than wide enough to accommodate all of the text, and then adjust the width of that box once the text has been added??

Yes. It's an annoyance that could be easily fixed. It's a user experience improvement.
Do you just go look for feature requests that you deem unnecessary by the way you use the app just to argue with people who support it? Everyone's workflow is different, and for a lot of people this feature would improve that workflow. Why are you even in here?

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