We need to talk about artificial intelligence.

[Johannes]

What Adobe does now with Generative Fill in Photoshop beta is impressive and even more useful compared to what Midjourney or Dall-e do.

It is not perfect yet but way better than what I have available right now.

Dear Affinity team do you work on more AI integration into the suite? I hope so.

 

 

[PaoloT]

Why making reality look great, when you can reinvent it?

 

[Johannes]

1 hour ago, PaoloT said:

Why making reality look great, when you can reinvent it?

 

Can you be more specific?

[Pšenda]

10 hours ago, Johannes said:

Dear Affinity team do you work on more AI integration into the suite?

 

[PaoloT]

6 hours ago, Johannes said:

Can you be more specific?

The answer is already clearly exposed in the picture you posted.

 

[PaulEC]

I look forward to the day when the UI just has one button. Load a picture, (or just find one on the internet) press the button and let the AI do the rest, no other input, or artistic skill, needed at all in order to produce a great work of art; just like everyone else’s!

[PaoloT]

AI is much like Guitar Hero. Yes, you can make music with it…

Paolo

 

[Old Bruce]

Sentient Machines are not going to notice us.

Let alone do what we ask them to do. "Give me two pictures of Josef K. from Kafka's The Trial. One as though the photographer was Diane Arbus and the second one as though the photographer was Henri Cartier-Bresson."

[Stun Damage]

Ethics and philosophy aside, most major game studios are currently updating their contracts to prohibit the use of generative AI. The film industry is sure to follow, if it hasn't already. I know this eludes techbros' hype bubble, but generated imagery is in copyright limbo. The law always lags a few years behind disruptive technology, and it is not at all clear yet where it's going to land (and there are already legal precedents of individuals being denied copyright of AI images).

All these images may end up in public domain, or even as property of the algorithm's creator, which would be even funnier. No sane company would risk its IP for a workflow speed-up that it doesn't really need in the first place (and believe me, they don't).

Generative fill seems like a more innocuous kind of AI, but it still constitutes whole portions of your image not being yours. You'd need to prove that your use of it is "transformative", as defined by law. That definition is vague, though, and too dated to cover AI use cases, so the extent of changes needed is unclear. Are a few adjustment layers on top considered "transformative"? A liquify? Good luck with that.

The point is, concentrating on AI would move Affinity away from pro concerns and more towards hobbyist territory.     

[lord darkul]

It all developes too fast somehow ... changes come in ever smaller time periods.

[Johannes]

Maybe we’ll get generative fill through a third party plug-in.

There already are some AI plugins that work with Affinity Photo.

[Old Bruce]

20 hours ago, Red Sands said:

Individuals who roughly deny that significant societal changes are due to factors such as technological advancements, even in the face of factual evidence, can exhibit different characteristics and attitudes. Here are some possible factors that may come into play:

Your list can also apply to those who wholeheartedly embrace the advancements.

[fiery.spirit]

Every artist I know and follow is ardently against generative AI. There are serious ethical concerns in how Adobe and others have obtained the data, as well as legal ambiguity that leans toward being unable to copyright the resulting images.

 

It's gotten to the point that digital artists who grew up on Adobe products are boycotting them completely now. And a lot of those artists are picking up Serif's products to fill that hole. I've personally been recommending the products solely because they don't support AI image generators. This is a serious issue for creatives and it absolutely drives the decision to purchase Serif's products.

 

Even ignoring the Ethical and potential legal issues, it just makes sense for Serif to differentiate itself from the competition hy giving artists what they want-- a program that doesn't actively promote theft.

 

All the crypto/nft/AI grifters can get their  image generators elsewhere. Please keep it away from one of the few good alternatives to Adobe.

[NoLongerHere]

16 hours ago, fiery.spirit said:

Every artist I know and follow is ardently against generative AI. There are serious ethical concerns in how Adobe and others have obtained the data, as well as legal ambiguity that leans toward being unable to copyright the resulting images.

 

It's gotten to the point that digital artists who grew up on Adobe products are boycotting them completely now. And a lot of those artists are picking up Serif's products to fill that hole. I've personally been recommending the products solely because they don't support AI image generators. This is a serious issue for creatives and it absolutely drives the decision to purchase Serif's products.

 

Even ignoring the Ethical and potential legal issues, it just makes sense for Serif to differentiate itself from the competition hy giving artists what they want-- a program that doesn't actively promote theft.

 

All the crypto/nft/AI grifters can get their  image generators elsewhere. Please keep it away from one of the few good alternatives to Adobe.

There's nothing that I've seen that will force Adobe customers to use the AI bits if they don't want to, just use it like you always have. So I'm not sure anyone's boycotting them just because of that, at least I've not read that anyone is.

I think as far as AI goes, generation is a no for most but AI (not that it's really Al as it's not intelligence) for say adjustments isn't a problem.

[fde101]

It's a tool, like any other.  Use it or don't as appropriate for the work at hand.

I think the biggest "bang for the buck" when it comes to current AI tech is going to be in selections rather than in generation of content - using AI techniques to identify things in the picture in order to more quickly zero in on what should be selected to help the user target things they want to manipulate.

[SGFX]

AI tools are not going anywhere and it's clearly a exponential boost in unending areas.

Serif has to adapt to the changing of the goalpost or be left behind. (Well Actually they started from behind.)

There is no question or doubt about it. Still basics gotta be first.

 

[CHKR]

1 hour ago, fde101 said:

It's a tool, like any other.  Use it or don't as appropriate for the work at hand.

I think the biggest "bang for the buck" when it comes to current AI tech is going to be in selections rather than in generation of content - using AI techniques to identify things in the picture in order to more quickly zero in on what should be selected to help the user target things they want to manipulate.

I totally agree! Many don't understand this. Editing is about speed and easy access which benefits an optimal workflow! You don't automatically sell your soul to the devil just because a software now has a new tool.
And like someone mentioned: no one is forcing anyone. And new AI tools will NOT substitute art or handcrafted work. It might seem that way, but as soon as AI has it's own place established you will distinguish between AI art, and handcrafted art. Those are two different things, that can and will function together! 
The image generation business will soon loose it's glamour. And then the handiness of AI will show. 

It has generated a lot of interest. And that is connected with anxiety. "The fear of the new". Take a look at history: how often have things become the standard that were "demonized" by a lot of people.
What do you think people thought about the first digital photo editing software? Analog operators were against it as you can imagine. Or the history of the PC. Or the internet. Do you want to edit your photos on platforms you cannot afford? Do you want to design/write your flyer/cookbook/etc.. by hand or use a typewriter?

If you see a "problem", better make it your own, so you know about it.

I wish Serif would take the opportunity to embrace and explore AI so we all can see and realistically estimate what it is. It will establish itself. Why wait until it's too late? The industry doesn't wait for you.

I can understand that many do not like Adobe's "business model". But speed and possibility will haul them back. Photo and design worlds are extremely competitive. And AI adds a huge tempo. 
So why make a software, when you don't want to be competitive?

[fde101]

2 hours ago, CHKR said:

But speed and possibility will haul them back.

It won't bring me back.  Adobe lost me 100% as a customer when they went subscription-only.  Other companies have since suffered the same fate.  For me this is a matter of principle and I won't compromise it.  "Native" productivity software (anything which does not run "in the cloud" where the company has a *legitimate* ongoing need to pay for bandwidth, servers, etc. to permit usage of the software) equates to no subscriptions allowed.  Period.

 

2 hours ago, CHKR said:

And AI adds a huge tempo. 

For some users and use cases.  Some of us would have zero benefit from this.  I might have *rare* benefit from generative AI, certainly not enough of a benefit frequently enough to jump to a higher-priced application unless it has other things to offer as well.  Definitely not enough that I would ever consider a subscription over it.

I do recognize that it will make a bigger difference for other users.

Selection assistance AI, I would probably make much more use of, but not at the cost of a subscription.

[smadell]

I agree with @fde101 wholeheartedly. There is an inherent difference between a product and a service. A product is something for which a one-time purchase is appropriate; a service could very easily warrant an ongoing contractual payment. The very phrase SaaS (Software "as" a Service) belies the fact that companies like Adobe recognize this; they are desperately trying to re-invent themselves as a "service" rather than a "product" to increase their cash flow and bump up their stock prices. Granted, they have accomplished both, but they have done so on the backs of those who are trapped in their ecosystems. I, too, have an ideological phobia about subscription software, and feel strongly about not compromising that stance. If it comes at the expense of slower development, that's a hardship I'm willing to endure.

[CHKR]

@fde101Generative AI is able to remove objects. Or helps with getting a certain format. For example when I bring an image into balance because the horizon was off, this tool "cuts" edges off, because there's no information. You could fill that areas with new tools. Doesn't change the world. It's a convenience. Why not.
Can look uncanny, but in small doses it's nice.
It wouldn't make me switch either, because I don't rely on it. But Serif is frustratingly slow when it comes to new and innovative things. 

I really would benefit from removing objects in my composition. The patch tool etc.. are "smart" tools. They're reactive. They're intelligent in an artificial way...;).
This and selection tools I'd love to see in Photo dearly!! Cuts away tedious editing time...

@smadellWasn't exactly the core of my post. I think we all here can agree on that, because we chose Affinity (not only) because of that. 
I mentioned this because I know someone who works professionally in the design area and switched back to Photoshop, because apparently it gives her a needed edge in her environment --> makes social media for a company where they want posts every day. It's an example that came to my mind. It just makes sense that more are going to follow. Not only because of work. "Hype" unfortunately is also strong and let's people forget common sense...
Last weeks AI is old in comparison to next weeks. Progress and development are fast. Logically it makes sense if professionals want to stay relevant and others try new gadgets.

Don't actually want to discuss business models. Rather the implementation of intelligent tools and what purpose they could (or couldn't) serve to make working with the Affinity products better and quicker.

[Teo_]

About AI I’d like to see noise reduction improved.

[LCamachoDesign]

I'm just going to leave this here:

GitHub - SysCV/sam-hq: Segment Anything in High Quality

Then tell me AI has no uses in real projects.

[myclay]

This wrapping stuff around with the help of AI looks interesting.

EDIT; not 100% useful when it needs to be accurate and or truthful to reality but for quickly modifying placeholder images it looks interesting.

 

 

[Johannes]

 

[Johannes]

fast times we live in