netsurfer912

[Multi] Linux. Seriously now.

246 posts in this topic

Linux users not spending money isn't strictly true, a few posts up someone mentioned VFX and 3D(not to mention the games industry). Effectively the movie world runs on Linux and there are an awful lot of potential seats out there. BUT (and it's a big but) you need to have certain (incredibly specific) features and a certain degree of pipelineability (python) to get anywhere with those guys, they are very well oiled machines. Interestingly, Adobe must have tens of thousands of seats in this world and there must be a good amount of financial incentive to port their software to Linux. Even then, with all of Adobe's resources, they won't. For consumer accessible software there really is little reason to develop for Linux, the market for day to day users just isn't there. Sad, but true.

Peter Werner, 00Ghz and MattP like this

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Cool, so its going to be a kickstarter campaign. Can someone from the US take this forward, please. If you need help with graphics or 
something else, lemme know at 

mnkyshield@gmail.com

The userbase will increase with more useful apps available on Linux.
We dont want to let this cool off... :)

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I agree there is a huge market for a Linux version. Please keep in mind that 3D industry already exists on Linux - there are many popular applications like Maya, Modo, Mudbox, Mari or even Blender.

The only thing missing are good Linux alternatives to Photoshop and Illustrator. There is GIMP, MyPaint, Krita or Inkscape but nothing can really compete with Adobe's products.

 

Distributions like Fedora Workstation or Ubuntu are perfectly viable for unexperienced users. I'm absolutely sure that many Windows users would switch to Linux to use Affinity products!

peter and Nobody like this

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Linux is definitely a worthwhile consideration. Many people can't switch from windows simply because there is no serious 2D AI/PS/ID alternatives to use. Buying is not an issue here. Just the lack of options. 

 

You are asking if Linux users would buy? Well people coming from other platforms would for sure.

 

I would definitely agree with a kickstarter.


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In fairness, Linux has been "the future" for years - but it still isn't converting many people.  Mainly because most flavours of it have always been so impenetrable for anyone that is not a tech geek.  I think we can be sure that OSX is going to be around a while yet - while it may be Unix under the hood, the user experience is so much better.

 

No offense, but Linux users have been saying Linux is the future for decades and it still hasn't gone mainstream.  There's a reason for that.  It caters to "nerds" who want to fiddle with command lines and things that are simply too out of touch with the common consumer.  Again, no offense, but while I would like to see a Linux version of Affinity, the Linux is the future thing is just not happening.

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No offense, but Linux users have been saying Linux is the future for decades and it still hasn't gone mainstream.  There's a reason for that.  It caters to "nerds" who want to fiddle with command lines and things that are simply too out of touch with the common consumer.  Again, no offense, but while I would like to see a Linux version of Affinity, the Linux is the future thing is just not happening.

 

Notice that I wrote "the future" in quotes.  


post-17-0-98406500-1414161784.pngSerifLabs team - Affinity Developer
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post-17-0-93920600-1414161966.pngiPad Pro 10.5", 256GB

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If companies like Autodesk (Maya), The Foundry (Modo), Chaos Group (V-Ray), Next Limit (Maxwell), OTOY (Octane Render) or even Epic Games (Unreal Engine) and many others all find Linux a worthy investment then why nobody is making a real "Photoshop for Linux"?

 

I'm pretty sure that majority of studios who buy the above products and use it on Linux workstations would also buy Linux versions of Affinity Photo and Affinity Designer. The market IS there, you just have to see it :-)

 

I personally use PC at home, and THE ONLY reason I'm still on Windows is the fact that there is no competition to Adobe on Linux!

peter and Nobody like this

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There's a lot of confirmation bias floating around here.

 

The reason professional design people can't use linux is because the adobe suite (or its equivalent) isn't available on linux.

 

Linux has improved by leaps and bounds in the past few years so most of the old arguments are starting to become outdated.

 

A very popular argument among those who dismiss linux is that games don't run on it, this was true a few years ago but now that Valve has started actively pushing developers to include linux and driver support is better (much better!) Linux has suddenly turned into a very viable gaming OS ( case in point: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/left-4-dead-2-faster-on-linux-than-windows-says-valve/1100-6390089/ ).

 

While it is true that there exist distros for people who like to fiddle with configs it is also true that there exist distros for people who never want to open a terminal in their lifetime. It's gotten to the point where linux enthusiasts are complaining about the OS being too beginner friendly and not having enough 'fiddling' available ( see: http://www.pcper.com/news/General-Tech/Unity-Linux-GUI-Controversy-and-Linux-Mints-Decision-Stick-Gnome-2 ).

 

What does any of this have to do with you guys?

 

There are many linux users who want linux to become more mainstream and therefore would contribute to a kickstarter campaign, even though they don't need the software. More users means more support so if they can pay 40$ and make it so that there is one fewer reason not use linux. Then many of them would do so without hesitation. Now that I think about it the last missing element for linux to become a viable OS is proper graphic design software so it would be HUGE if you guys would make a port.

 

Besides there is no real risk involved in running a kickstarter, worst case scenario it flops and you get some extra publicity. The most likely result is that you get loads of new customers.

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Speaking of money, I think one always has to consider the amount of people cracking the software and using it for free. Even if there was great interest in Affinity products on the Linux market, Linux is full of Geeks  :lol: being able to code, tweak and crack software (I know Linux, so don´t tell me otherwise) you always got to tweak/ hack something to get the system run right and since Linux is Unix based , having more open proprieties when it comes to root-accessing files, Software is much easier to crack. 

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I agree to some extent, but I don't think many design studios would risk using pirated software anyway... IMO crackers are not really a problem as long as there are real customers too - so the real question is "how many companies or freelancers would buy the Linux version?". I guess the answer is that many customers who also buy 3D software on Linux! :)

 

I also think the major cause of "piracy" are high prices. Affinity is extremely cheap when compared to Adobe so I think many people would buy it, even if they can crack it. You know, piracy is kinda part of market competition too - people need to choose between safe, fully supported but expensive product and something free, but without support and often at risk of having a trojan : ) If the price is low enough, they will just pay because it's much easier and safer.

peter and Nobody like this

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Interesting discussion this is becoming. The studios will be interested, altho they will need to be approached, I think. For a while CinePaint was being 
used at some facilities and now Krita is used to some degree. 

As far as the no. of paying customer goes, this is exactly why we need a kickstarter. The price is affordable for people outside US, which is a 

huge factor, I wud buy AdobeCC apps if they were available on linux and I am sure many others wud. So why not Affinity, permanent license for a 

capable software which can be depended upon in production...
Does the campaign need to come from the community or can Serif work on it. 

Do you guys have interns, put an intern on it... ;)

DAN_D likes this

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I used to have this wish for having native illustration, photogrpahy, 3D, video editing apps, games, etc. for Linux. There's many Linux frontend toolkits, but none of them can match Mac OS's.

 

The future for AD or any other app associated with plans to extend cross-platform support will be to run in the browser or a browser wrapper. That way OS platforms don't matter any more. Web technologies already allow for that to be a reality and will make it even more appealing in the near future.

 

When that happens with AD, you'll be able to use in Linux, or BSD, or whatever other OS platform you care about.

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I prefer the developer's strategy of focusing on what they know, and doing everything they can to make the OSX version work as well as it can. Don't get me wrong, I wish there was a windows/linux version myself (easier to build a super computer with lots of RAM), but it's not trivial to port. There are many frameworks and methods unique to OSX.

I think even if you were successful in raising money for the company, the development process wouldn't necessarily improve or speed up. Look at how terrible Microsoft products have been in the last ten years, and how much money they have thrown at them. An even better example would be Google. They have a few brilliant people with many nifty ideas. These people get a prototype working that becomes popular, then the project slowly drifts unusable bloat designed by committee. Every year they add a click to Google Analytics and it takes me longer to do things that in the past that took one click. The irony is that Google became popular because of its simple homepage, now they are noted for consistently making the worst UIs in the business.

 

deeds, MacGueurle and T.A.V like this

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Troll: fish by trailing a baited line along behind a boat.

 

​It's not real food. 

 

Going after Linux users will starve the fish.

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The definition of "Troll" in netspeak is just as I stated.

 

It's been morphed, more recently, to also include anyone criticising or being derogatory in any way. Basically because Facebook and twitter brought a billion people online in a short space of time, and most of them had no idea most people didn't worship the ground they walked on.

 

And then coke tried to tell us all to "get along".

There's nothing wrong with criticism.

 

Most of it is accurate, by the very definition of the word.

 

But saying the Linux user base isn't worth catering for isn't a criticism.

 

It's just an observable, objective fact.

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Linux, even today on 2015, is still light years back on terms of usability and ease of use.

 

It is already difficult concentrate and do well my job, and the need to deal with console and 'su' commands every now and then, is a no-no on my side.

 

Even if AD ported to Linux, I will stay here on Mac, because I'm quite scared to have to deal with a Linux distro to do my job everyday.

 

My opinion, Linux is perfect for machines dedicated to one-specific-task, but to general purpose use, is so far away to even consider it an option.

 

Last but not least, developing on linux is quite an hassle, you have to deal with a number of distros, multiplied a number of user interfaces, multiplied a number of different ways to provide updates. If you choose of all that, the one you want follow, you will go to a niche of an already small market (intended as general purpose paying user base).

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The plain and simple fact is that AP is being developed for the Mac.  What happens (if anything) after an undoubtedly successful launch is up to Serif - there may or may not be a Windows version and there may or may not be a Linux version.  At this point in its development all that the Windows and Linux users who have joined the beta (and must be using Macs ...) can do is be polite, request a version for your OS, and wait and see.  The way that you are expressing yourself in this thread does your case and your credibility no good at all.

MacGueurle likes this

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While I'm not personally interested in Linux (I prefer *BSD), the market might be there:

 

1. Visual effects companies use Linux (Maya, Mari, Nuke etc), almost exclusively from what I've read. That's some seats but as mentioned they're picky.

 

2. Linux users are willing to pay for games.

 

In Humble Bundle sales Linux users pay more than OSX users (around 20% more) and there are less people, but the difference between OSX and Linux is rather small compared to Windows:

Total Payments:$109,110,346.32

Linux Payments:$8,289,554.21
Mac OS Payments:$11,950,170.75
Windows Payments:$81,205,243.13
 
3. About the most serious digital distribution platform for games has had Linux support for over two years. It has had non-gaming apps for around three years. It's market share is estimated to be around 75% for all digitally sold games. It has 125 million active users. It's called Steam. (source: Wikipedia)
 
Of course it is not as ubiquitous as Mac App Store, but there are plenty of graphic artists and some graphic apps on Steam.
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