Forum structure

[mopperle]

TBH, but the structure of the forum is really annoying. We have 3 Affinity products running on 2 different platforms. But all posts are mixed up in one section. There is no way to filter topics for a certain product/platform.

Best would be to have 3 sections for each product plus a general section and a mandatory tag for each post regarding the platform (Windows/macOS).

[walt.farrell]

This has been discussed many times.

The rationale for the current structure is that many functions of the applications are common both across all three applications and at least Windows and macOS. Therefore it makes no sense to separate questions about the applications by platform, except for separating iPadOS (which they have done) as its UI is so different. Similarly, if you have a question about creating documents, or using Adjustments, or Exporting, or <insert long list here> the questions and answers are common to Publisher, Designer, and Photo.

 

[firstdefence]

I still think mandatory tags should be implemented because where files are stored, icloud issues, hardware concerns etc are platform specific and having to sift through piles of window users posts to find a mac specific post is tiresome. I also think it's simply considerate to inform people which platform, which apps you have and when posting a topic which app you are referring to.

 

[henryanthony]

I have often read posts and complained to myself that no platform was included.

LOL, I have been guilty of this infraction as well so, I included technical specs in my signature.

[thomaso]

7 minutes ago, henryanthony said:

I included technical specs in my profile. But, they are not showing in this post.

To make them appear under your posts add them to your Account Settings -> Signature. (not via 'Edit Profile')

-->

[henryanthony]

@thomaso Fixed it, thanks!

[Pšenda]

2 hours ago, firstdefence said:

I still think mandatory tags should be implemented

It was requested a long time ago

 

 

[firstdefence]

I know, but I know it will not be implemented, just an opinion.

[Granddaddy]

10 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

The rationale for the current structure is that many functions of the applications are common both across all three applications and at least Windows and macOS.

The obvious refutation of this ancient argument is that the first response to many posts is:

What Affinity application are you using?
What operating system are you using?

So one must read the first three or four posts on every thread before reaching a point where one can begin to answer the question being asked by the OP. 

This issue has been argued for years. It is always decided in favor of ever more consolidation into a single forum regardless of application, operating system, and goal. Perhaps that is why so few participate in answering questions. It is just too tedious to weed through so many ambiguous questions to find a place where one might contribute a solution. The situation is worsened by the inability of so many to write an informative subject for a new thread.

[loukash]

28 minutes ago, Granddaddy said:

The obvious refutation of this ancient argument is

My refutation of the "obvious refutation of this ancient argument" is:
As a Mac user I don't follow forums sections tagged as "Windows" at all.
So even though I might be able to help in many cases because the issue or the solution might be in fact "platform agnostic", I'll never see those topics.

Hence platform agnostic forums may benefit those who ask for help more.

33 minutes ago, Granddaddy said:

Perhaps that is why so few participate in answering questions.

I don't have this impression here on Affinity forums at all.

And at the end of the day, we're doing it voluntarily. Some because they are bored, some because they are altrustic, others because they can also learn something new at the same time (quite often my case , especially concerning advanced APh techniques).

Personally, I find the current forum structure all right.
The earlier versions with many subforums were rather annoyingly complex and hard to follow.

[Pšenda]

8 hours ago, Granddaddy said:

What Affinity application are you using?
What operating system are you using?

For these reasons, however, there is no need to modify the structure of the forum. It would be quite sufficient if the form for new topic offered the user to fill in the type of application and the type of his OS as an optional item. Thus, he would inform him about the desirability, but not the necessity, of providing this, in many cases, completely necessary information.

As users, we probably have no idea how often admins move topics because they are placed in the wrong/nonsensical category, even with the existing simple structure.

[mopperle]

10 hours ago, Pšenda said:

As users, we probably have no idea how often admins move topics because they are placed in the wrong/nonsensical category, even with the existing simple structure.

Well, as a moderator in another forum (also using Invision software) with many thousand active users, I have a very good idea on how often topics need to be moved: the number of such posts is neglectable, while this forum is by far more detailed.

But yes, introducing tags for each new topicwould be very helpfull.

[lphilpot]

On 1/15/2024 at 5:36 AM, walt.farrell said:

The rationale for the current structure is that many functions of the applications are common both across all three applications and at least Windows and macOS. Therefore it makes no sense to separate questions about the applications by platform, except for separating iPadOS (which they have done) as its UI is so different. Similarly, if you have a question about creating documents, or using Adjustments, or Exporting, or <insert long list here> the questions and answers are common to Publisher, Designer, and Photo.

I've asked the same question and indeed, you've responded to me likewise. I can see the logic but my off-the-cuff experience says otherwise. Multi- / cross-application issues are the exception rather than the rule. Most of what I see is app-specific and given I use only one of three Affinity apps, two thirds of it is basically irrelevant to me. I spend more time finding Photo posts than actually reading. So I, too, would like the forums to be broken out by app. Or at a minimum, as others have indicated, enforce tagging and let us filter on tags.

[Pšenda]

32 minutes ago, lphilpot said:

I spend more time finding Photo posts than actually reading.

This has already been mentioned on another thread - but how do you understand the purpose of the Question forum?
As a reminder, the home page:

 

Personally, I understand that this forum serves "mainly" all beginners who have some problem with Affinity applications. Their knowledge of both the applications and the structure of the forum is often small (often they don't even know that Serif has three applications), so Serif has made this "entry" forum as simple as possible, so as not to discourage users with its excessive complexity.
The fact that many users also use this forum as a source of valuable information, experience and learning (let's call them "readers") is of course good and right, but I don't think we can expect to change and complicate the structure so that it's better for readers read, but on the contrary, it became more complicated for the questioner.

Edited January 16 by Pšenda

[mopperle]

TBH, why shoud it become more complicated for the interviewers (btw. what is an interviewer???). A forum split up in products or at least topics tagged with the product and OS makes it by far easier for everybody. For those searching for answers (by e.g. filtering by tags) and for those answering questions. This is my personal experience as moderator and a user providing help in various forums.

[lphilpot]

2 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

I don't think we can expect to change and complicate the structure so that it's better for readers read, but on the contrary, it became more complicated for the interviewers.

I'm not advocating making it more complicated, but in fact the reverse: If you're having Photo issues, look / search the Photo forum, likewise for Designer or Publisher. That way, the problem resolution process is more efficient. Less irrelevant scanning, reading (whatever) of content that's not directly focused on the solution you're seeking.

To be more direct (?), if a solution is available in Designer, great. But as a Photo user it's not relevant to me unless is also a Photo solution. So why read about it?

[Oufti]

I don't use Photo a lot but in Publisher, I sometimes use the Pixel persona for specific photo tasks. If I encounter a problem there, should I post my question in Publisher, Photo or General section?

Also when in the respective main persona, there are tools common to the 3 apps and others specific to this app. How should I know which are which?

For example, Text styles, Paragraph and Character panels are common to the 3 apps but Text Frame and TOC panels are specific to Publisher.
This means if I have a problem with a coloured text frame in Designer (it happens: [1], [2],…), I'll probably need to use Publisher to correct it. So what? Where to post?

I agree though that better using tags when needed should be helpful.  

[loukash]

2 hours ago, Pšenda said:

often they don't even know that Serif has three applications

Often they don't even know that "Affinity" is the product name and not the company name.

2 hours ago, mopperle said:

This is my personal experience as moderator and a user providing help in various forums

You're obviously not the primary target audience.

My personal experience as an occasional user of applications that are completely new to me, hence me requiring some support at times:
The more complex their support forum structure is, the less motivation I have to dive into it or even join.

2 hours ago, Oufti said:

I don't use Photo a lot but in Publisher, I sometimes use the Pixel persona for specific photo tasks. If I encounter a problem there, should I post my question in Publisher, Photo or General section?

Also when in the respective main persona, there are tools common to the 3 apps and others specific to this app. How should I know which are which?

Exactly. Having to make such decisions may cause lots of extra stress for inexperienced users.

[lphilpot]

2 hours ago, Oufti said:

I don't use Photo a lot but in Publisher, I sometimes use the Pixel persona for specific photo tasks. If I encounter a problem there, should I post my question in Publisher, Photo or General section?

In such a situation, to my mind the (theoretical*) answer is clear - You post it in the section dedicated to the app in which you're having the issue, regardless if it's of a "native" nature or using a cross-app embedded function. If the issue / question happens while using X, post it in the section for X. There's too much shared functionality in most apps these days for the customer to have to figure out, "is this a problem with foo app, or with bar module, or with baz library, or ..." Just post in the app's section.

* I realize all of this is subjective and personal and I'm necessarily not pushing for a change. But I do think if the forums were more streamlined and focused it would make for a more efficient experience. For example, if you call any tech support, you'll get (hopefully!) routed to a group specifically trained to address your specific issue, not dropped in a generic pool.

In general I see no true advantage in catering to a lowest common denominator. We all know more and / or less about different things. We're all beginners at some time (maybe a LONG time) and possibly experts at other times. It's just a matter of asking and learning so either do it or not. If someone is put off by that, it's their loss unfortunately.

[mopperle]

1 hour ago, loukash said:

You're obviously not the primary target audience

Sorry, but you missed something. I‘m new to the Affinity suite and when I needed a solution for a problem I have with app Pub, I would either search for app Pub or post in the section for Pub. As a new user I‘m not aware the a problem/question might apply to the complete suite cause of their similarity. At the moment I have to post a question among a bunch of other posts with the risk that my post got lost.

Just to add: currently the first 2 pages are posts within the last 24 hrs covering everything. Very helpfull for Newbies 🤪

[loukash]

Just now, mopperle said:

Sorry, but you missed something.

I meant you're not the "primary target audience" as in: you're obviously a generally experienced user of support forums.

2 minutes ago, mopperle said:

At the moment I have to post a question among a bunch of other posts with the risk that my post got lost.

That "risk" is pretty low on the Affinity forums. This forum is some of the very best I've experienced in my 24 years being online and participating in user support forums.

[R C-R]

1 hour ago, lphilpot said:

In general I see no true advantage in catering to a lowest common denominator.

Please keep in mind that this is a product support forum, one that for maximum benefit to all should cater not just to all existing customers but also to all potential customers of the Affinity apps. Otherwise, where would whoever you consider to be the "lowest common denominator" people go with their questions about these products?

That is one of the several problems with mandatory tagging -- for instance, if someone wants to ask which if any of the apps they should buy, no product-specific tag would be very suitable, so there would at least need to be 4th tag for that. Likewise, some questions might involve cross-platform compatibility so there can't just be 3 tags for Windows or Macs or iPads. Add in the V1 & V2 permutations & you end up needing way too many tags to cover everything.

The bottom line is, like it or not, it can't be too complicated or require too much if any prior knowledge of the apps to post a question & still fulfill its primary purpose.

[lphilpot]

7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

That is one of the several problems with mandatory tagging -- for instance, if someone wants to ask which if any of the apps they should buy, no product-specific tag would be very suitable, so there would at least need to be 4th tag for that. Likewise, some questions might involve cross-platform compatibility so there can't just be 3 tags for Windows or Macs or iPads. Add in the V1 & V2 permutations & you end up needing way too many tags to cover everything.

Potential customers are one reason why you have pre-sales / general forums as opposed to (or in addition to) support forums. There's no way to perfectly divvy it up to a great depth, but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect even a complete newcomer to think about what they're asking. That's kind of implicit in most things computer and if one is at the level of content creation using relatively sophisticated software, it's reasonable to expect IMO.

Again, it's not the end of the world either way.

[R C-R]

14 minutes ago, lphilpot said:

There's no way to perfectly divvy it up to a great depth, but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect even a complete newcomer to think about what they're asking.

As has been mentioned, many forum newcomers do not even know that there are 3 Affinity apps, or that they can interoperate seamlessly, or are available for 3 different platforms, or have various licensing options, & so on. They should & must be able to use these forums easily, without requiring any prior knowledge of any of it or it defeats the purpose of the forum.

[Pšenda]

12 hours ago, R C-R said:

with mandatory tagging

And that is why no one has ever proposed, requested, and I hope will not introduce mandatory tagging.