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On 5/18/2022 at 8:25 AM, PaulEC said:

I'm quite prepared to be told that I'm completely wrong, but, as I understand it, Android devices are mainly smart phones and tablets. I just wonder how many people are going to want to do serious page layout, photo editing or design work on such small devices? Surely people using these devices are more likely to want simple, one click solutions, rather than trying to use full blown apps like the Affinity trio. The important thing is not how many people use a particular device, or operating system, but how many of those people are likely to want to buy the apps!

So, I‘ve got Affinity on my Mac and my iPad, and if I were to do ‘serious’ editing, I would only do it on my Mac. I think the whole Android route is a blind alley. I guess I am also saying why do Serif prefer iPad over Linux? Must be sheer weight of numbers. And that’s it. 

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The vast majority of my friends, anecdotally, who have Macs also have iPads (a number of my Windows using friends also have iPads). Once you've bought into the Apple ecosystem you may as well continue. I would think that anyone who buys Affinity products for Mac will simply buy a copy for iPad, maybe not to do serious work but certainly to be "cool".

I don't see that same kind of loyalty with Android devices so there probably wouldn't be the cross selling opportunity.

And yes, its weight of numbers which means that Serif prioritises iPad over Linux. I'm on quite a few software forums and they all have a thread like this one. What it all boils down to is that it's not worth supporting Linux; the money just isn't there.

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But why, that's the question. What money could there possibly be from this?

If Serif have any business sense, and I would suggest that they have, they will go after the largest market segment they can: Adobe users.

How many Adobe products are on Steam? How many Adobe users run Linux? You might be able to get Adobe CS working on Linux but it won't be supported. If it's not supported then it won't be used for production in any professional company.

Why would Serif support a gaming platform, which isn't their core demographic, so that they can target the 1.4% of gamers on that platform which run Linux?

I enjoy using Linux as much as the next person but the reality is that without market share software houses won't write, or port, software to Linux.

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2 hours ago, GuernseyMan said:

But why, that's the question. What money could there possibly be from this?

If Serif have any business sense, and I would suggest that they have, they will go after the largest market segment they can: Adobe users.

How many Adobe products are on Steam? How many Adobe users run Linux? You might be able to get Adobe CS working on Linux but it won't be supported. If it's not supported then it won't be used for production in any professional company.

Why would Serif support a gaming platform, which isn't their core demographic, so that they can target the 1.4% of gamers on that platform which run Linux?

I enjoy using Linux as much as the next person but the reality is that without market share software houses won't write, or port, software to Linux.

Pixeluvo is on Steam and it's an excellent, modern photo editor (a Photoshop Elements equivalent) for Windows and Linux.

Links:

http://www.pixeluvo.com/downloads/pixeluvo_1.6.0-2_amd64.deb

http://www.pixeluvo.com/downloads/pixeluvo-1.6.0-2.x86_64.rpm

http://www.pixeluvo.com/buynow/

The 30 day trial version is limited to saving files no larger than 800×600 pixels. It has an excellent, easy to navigate UI and Gimp could learn a lot from it.

 

pixeluvo-image-editor-ubuntu-linux-1.jpg

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15 minutes ago, Snapseed said:

Pixeluvo is on Steam and it's an excellent, modern photo editor (a Photoshop Elements equivalent) for Windows and Linux.

Good. Now to the most important question... did you buy this excellent, modern photo editor?

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30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

Good. Now to the most important question... did you buy this excellent, modern photo editor?

My answers are these:

1. I paid for the full licence for Pixeluvo because it is so good. Indeed, I regard it as the best general Linux photo editor that is currently available.

2. I have been able to completely banish Gimp from my computer and it will never return. While useful progress has been made in recent years, it is still not yet up to the usability level of Photoshop, etc although the PhotoGimp plugin might help some people.

3. Here is an example of the excellent work that this photo editor can do:

4. I do recommend Affinity Photo to Windows and macOS users because l have seen what Affinity Photo can do plus there's no permanent subscription as there is with Abobe Photoshop. I should add that Pixeluvo for Linux is not in any way a competitor for Affinity Photo precisely because Serif Europe does not offer any products for Linux.

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9 hours ago, Snapseed said:

I paid for the full licence for Pixeluvo because it is so good. Indeed, I regard it as the best general Linux photo editor that is currently available.

ice_screenshot_20220524-093000.png

Acer XC-895 : Core i5-10400 Hexa-core 2.90 GHz :  32GB RAM : Intel UHD Graphics 630 : Windows 10 Home
Affinity Publisher : Affinity Photo : Affinity Designer (latest release versions) | Affinity Photo for iPad

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10 hours ago, Snapseed said:

Pixeluvo is on Steam and it's an excellent, modern photo editor (a Photoshop Elements equivalent) for Windows and Linux.

Links:

http://www.pixeluvo.com/downloads/pixeluvo_1.6.0-2_amd64.deb

http://www.pixeluvo.com/downloads/pixeluvo-1.6.0-2.x86_64.rpm

http://www.pixeluvo.com/buynow/

The 30 day trial version is limited to saving files no larger than 800×600 pixels. It has an excellent, easy to navigate UI and Gimp could learn a lot from it.

 

pixeluvo-image-editor-ubuntu-linux-1.jpg

Confirm the pixeluvo - it's work.

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8 hours ago, IanSG said:

According to Pixeluvo's website there isn't a Linux version!

 

7 hours ago, PaulEC said:

ice_screenshot_20220524-093000.png

1. The direct download links from the official Pixeluvo website for the Debian/Ubuntu .deb version and the RedHat/Fedora/SUSE .rpm version as provided above are all still working so they can still be downloaded and can then paid for.

2. The reason for the temporary public withdrawal is technical. There are issues with Pixeluvo fully working well with Linux distributions where the Wayland display server protocol is set as the default.

3. Wayland* is still effectively in beta stage and so there are problems with gaming, Nvidia chip sets, Electron apps and so on. If anyone using Linux + Wayland is having any issues with Pixeluvo or other software then the options are to switch back to the Xorg display server or to enable XWayland (check the instructions on how to do this for your own installed Linux distribution).

*Since the RedHat/Fedora/Gnome interchangeable crowd currently and regrettably has too much (malign) influence over desktop Linux these days, they have been able to put out second rate crapola like Wayland that is at beta stage, that has numerous not addressed bugs and that causes significant problems for users.

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This is the problem. The Windows version just runs, the Linux version means you have to jump through hoops to get it running. I use Linux but this just puts average users off and any kind of commercial deployment becomes a nightmare.

Basically the software house says, "It's not ou fault, a group of unnacountable people have made changes to some distros of Linux and broken it!"

I'd be happy to tinker around with this but a lot of people wouldn't/couldn't.

I don't like proprietary software or OSs but at least they're generally focussed and someone is accountable when it goes wrong. That's what professionals are after.

 

 

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1 hour ago, GuernseyMan said:

This is the problem. The Windows version just runs, the Linux version means you have to jump through hoops to get it running. I use Linux but this just puts average users off and any kind of commercial deployment becomes a nightmare.

Basically the software house says, "It's not our fault, a group of unnacountable people have made changes to some distros of Linux and broken it!"

I'd be happy to tinker around with this but a lot of people wouldn't/couldn't.

I don't like proprietary software or OSs but at least they're generally focussed and someone is accountable when it goes wrong. That's what professionals are after.

1. Pixeluvo works 100% well on Xorg, period.

2. The issue is those behind the Wayland project who are pressing ahead with that project without addressing multiple hundreds of outstanding bugs with applications and desktop environments that have been reported to them and that otherwise work perfectly well on Xorg on Linux. The Pixeluvo matter is only 0.01% or so of Wayland's issues so it is very unfair to in any way blame the developer concerned.

3. Just go to Google, type in "Wayland bugs" and see the resulting sh!tshow of results. Neither Microsoft nor Apple would get away with foisting something as bug-ridden as Wayland on their own customers and Linux users deserve better. That is where both the fault and blame lies.

 

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27 minutes ago, Snapseed said:

Just go to Google, type in "Wayland bugs"

This in a nutshell is THE problem for Linux. If I want to install a graphics app I might have to Google for Wayland bugs. That is not my problem. If Wayland becomes the standard for Linux then this app will not work.

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I didn't blame the developers, their statement is correct. It's an issue with the nature of open source projects once they get to a certain size. There are always vying factions.

The fact that you agree that Microsoft or Apple would not get away with this behaviour speaks volumes.

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1 hour ago, GuernseyMan said:

I didn't blame the developers, their statement is correct. It's an issue with the nature of open source projects once they get to a certain size. There are always vying factions.

The fact that you agree that Microsoft or Apple would not get away with this behaviour speaks volumes.

Again, that is being more than a little unfair to Linux in general. The issue here is that this particular set of developers is taking a cavalier attitude and releasing and promoting their new display protocol prematurely while it is unrefined and still not fit for purpose.

Ideally, l would like to see the Linux Foundation taking a greater role in the development of desktop Linux so that situations like this one are less likely to occur in future.

In the meantime, anyone looking for alternatives to Serif Europe and Adobe products can use the Alternativeto website to find Linux-friendly options and examples are presented below:

https://alternativeto.net/software/adobe-photoshop/?platform=linux

https://alternativeto.net/software/affinity-photo/?platform=linux

https://alternativeto.net/software/affinity-designer/?platform=linux

https://alternativeto.net/software/affinity-publisher/?platform=linux

 

 

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I'm not being unfair to Linux. Linux is a piece of software, just a tool to run other software. Don't anthropomorphise it. 

I pointed out that any given community, when it gets to a certain size, creates factions within that community. The "Wayland Project" is just a faction within the Linux community that wants their view to take precedence. The "Anti Wayland" group resists that.

Youve said as much yourself with your comment about the Linux Foundation taking a more active role in guiding and focussing development.

It's human nature, and always will be. Certainly not an insult and definitely not unfair.

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On 5/24/2022 at 2:41 PM, LondonSquirrel said:

This in a nutshell is THE problem for Linux. If I want to install a graphics app I might have to Google for Wayland bugs. That is not my problem. If Wayland becomes the standard for Linux then this app will not work.

If you're worried about things not working in Wayland, then just use Xorg. It's still a few years until Wayland becomes the exclusive standard, and any app that ends up not working on it probably won't have been updated for years by that point anyway.

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4 hours ago, Renzatic said:

If you're worried about things not working in Wayland, then just use Xorg. It's still a few years until Wayland becomes the exclusive standard, and any app that ends up not working on it probably won't have been updated for years by that point anyway.

Given the statistics being reported from Phoronix from only a few months ago, it's going to be quite some time before Wayland becomes mainstream:

Less Than 10% Of Firefox Users On Linux Are Running Wayland

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Firefox-Wayland-X11-Stats

I also like this comment taken from one of the senior commentators over on the Phoronix forums:

"You failed to read the fine print at the bottom of all the wayland promises over the past 12 years:
"It will improve your performance. Next year. Or the year after that. Or maybe the year after that. If you have the right hardware. And the right desktop. On certain tasks with certain apps. Maybe. Depends on the alignment of the stars and the moon, and if Jupiter is in the 2nd house"."

In other news, Nomacs is a good, basic image editor for Linux:

https://nomacs.org/

For image editors on Linux with more capabilities, there are other softwares such as...

https://photoflare.io/

https://apps.kde.org/en-gb/showfoto/

https://kornelix.net/fotoxx/fotoxx.html

fotoxx-021_orig.jpg

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None of this has convinced me that my primary OS should be Linux and, anecdotally, that goes for most of my friends.

I have a distro running ATM, Mint as it happens, which I use to tinker around with for "fun".

However all my "real work" is still done on Windows. The software just works and I don't need to worry about what display protocol I'm using or needing to tweak Wine or any other esoteric settings. It also means that I can get support from the developers that I've paid good money to. Even if something works under Wine most Devs are of the opinion that you're on your own when something goes wrong.

People I know who run small businesses are generally not tech-minded. They're very good designers or architects or business consultants but just need an OS that works out of the box with the minimum of setup. They don't even want to decide on a distro as it's too much of a hard choice, especially as my Linux evangelist friends all recommend something different.

I also don't need to worry about a "particular set of developers" screwing things up for me.

Both OSs have their faults and their benefits. For work, at the moment, Windows is the lesser of two evils.😉

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Serif Affinity can choose to support or not to support the platform. Regardless of what is said here. Right now they have no plans to support it. I paid for all three on Windows. If was an option on Android or Linux I'd likely pay for it all again.

Wine communities may some day bring support to Linux. Affinity Photo is #2 on WineHQ as their most request app page.

You can swap back and forth on Wayland and X11 as a menu option once it's enabled from the login menu on most distros. 

Flatpaks and Snaps ship with their dependancies included. Distro doesn't really matter. Use Whatever tickles your fancy. I like Pop!_OS for desktops because it is the easiest out of the box setup and has fantastic Nvidia support out of the box.

Alternatives for Linux for Affinity Photo and Designer.

1) Inkscape - latest update version 1.2 has made it my primary vector program even on my windows desktop. Check and see if it meets your needs. In my opinion Inkscape is equal to Designer with some small pros and cons on both sets of software. Designer lacks trace, Inkscape has work arounds CYMK support.

2) Krita - was a fork of GIMP. Primarily painting app. With surprisingly decent photo editing tools likely left over from GIMP. Nondestructive and supports CYMK. Likely the best option with a good UI/UX experience. 

3) GIMP - has some great photo editing capabilities hampered with crap tier UI/UX experience. No nondestructive editing or CYMK support. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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