Canva

[PaulEC]

I would think that all aspects of this presentation were professionally produced (including music, dancers, etc.) and very carefully scripted.

[HCl]

.

[William Overington]

3 hours ago, loukash said:

My goodness, I feel too old watching all this [insert favorite expletive here]. 

All this "hey hey" music and Affinity adverts. Is this "well-known" modern music or something especially for Affinity?

Not the same ambience as when a perfume company used part of one of Beethoven's symphonies.

William 

 

[loukash]

2 hours ago, Return said:

cringeworthy

A nice word – not yet in my active or passive vocabulary so thanks for that! – that sums it up.

[wonderings]

On 5/22/2024 at 4:58 PM, albertkinng said:

The bitter truth. My 24-year-old nephew approached me with a remark that struck a chord within me: "Uncle Al, why haven't you subscribed to Adobe? As a professional graphic designer, shouldn't you be using Adobe, the ultimate tools for the trade?" Without hesitation, I responded, "Son, I spent 20 years working with Adobe until they made the switch to a subscription-based model. In 2014, I decided to transition to Affinity because I believe in owning my tools." Oblivious to my perspective, he urged, "Uncle Al, it's time to modernize your mindset. That monthly payment will pay off itself through your services. Plus, you can deduct it from your taxes and effectively have it reimbursed. Just embrace Adobe and work with the right tools." In that moment, I couldn't help but share an important lesson that I have learned throughout my 50 years of life, a lesson that will guide me until the end of my days. I declared resolutely, "Well, my dear nephew, with age comes wisdom. And with wisdom, I have realized that investing in my own future is a smart move, whereas investing in the futures of others is not. Take heed of how you spend your hard-earned money, for it will undoubtedly speak volumes about you in the years to come."

While the wording is not great using "ultimate tool for the trade" there is real benefit when working in an industry and using software that everyone else uses. Working in design and print, it is super helpful when dealing with designers and design houses to all be using the same software. Adobe is not perfect, they have software issues, but the fact that the vast majority are all using the same software makes life so much simpler. The cost of a subscription is probably a little cheaper then it was upgrading every 2 years to the next Adobe CS that was released. Where this does not work is for the retired person who still wants to do some hobby stuff, but not generate an income with it. This is the majority of people who hate subscriptions in my opinion, because this model is not made for hobbyists. Adobe is focused on the pro community, and I use pro by meaning those who make their living using the software. If I were to no longer be in the industry there is no doubt I would stop using Adobe and go 100% with Affinity as it is powerful software without a subscription. So the wisdom as I see it is not that subscriptions are bad, but they are not for everyone.

 

[PaoloT]

5 hours ago, loukash said:

Is this Canva thing some kind of a cult?

I've got an impression of a meeting of motivators and salespersons. For a digital, brave new world. I'm still wondering what is Affinity doing there, and since the most stunning example they had to offer was a zoom on a vector work, maybe they also know that they are something not immediately easy to explain.

My hope is that Affinity is needed by Canva to complete their vertical offer, and to be taken even more seriously by the companies ("Take that: we have something for your heads of division wanting to motivate the team, but also for your designers having to create the quarterly report!"). And that they will let them work undisturbed, doing what they know how to do.

All considered, their new boss is a Cat. She should be in empathy with the Nottingham team.

Paolo

 

[SallijaneG]

34 minutes ago, wonderings said:

While the wording is not great using "ultimate tool for the trade" there is real benefit when working in an industry and using software that everyone else uses. Working in design and print, it is super helpful when dealing with designers and design houses to all be using the same software. Adobe is not perfect, they have software issues, but the fact that the vast majority are all using the same software makes life so much simpler. The cost of a subscription is probably a little cheaper then it was upgrading every 2 years to the next Adobe CS that was released. Where this does not work is for the retired person who still wants to do some hobby stuff, but not generate an income with it. This is the majority of people who hate subscriptions in my opinion, because this model is not made for hobbyists. Adobe is focused on the pro community, and I use pro by meaning those who make their living using the software. If I were to no longer be in the industry there is no doubt I would stop using Adobe and go 100% with Affinity as it is powerful software without a subscription. So the wisdom as I see it is not that subscriptions are bad, but they are not for everyone.

 

I hear what you are saying, but with an outright purchase, one can choose when to upgrade; I occasionally skipped a version, but made sure to get the last one that would keep my upgrade discount intact; only bought my first laptop when the upgrade of InDesign would no longer work on my G4 desktop, etc.  Yes, corporations with big budgets that get paid big bucks from customers who can afford it can subscribe to anything without care—but that creates a 2-tier industry—and a “moat” for them that some of us resent.  Frankly, my career has been what it is because I deliberately eschewed anything like that career path, a values-based choice for me that I realize is not for everyone—but the wider the gaps, the less good for society overall, in my opinion.
Sometimes I’m glad I’m old.

[SallijaneG]

4 hours ago, William Overington said:

I wonder if the dancers are Canva staff whose normal roles are in software and such and when the company asked who would like to take part as a dancer for the day chose to volunteer or whether they are dance professionals who just do the dancing and know nothing about Canva.

William

 

my guess would be professional dancers

[PaoloT]

I was testing Canva, and had to notice the incredible amount of very basic grammar errors in the Italian translation of the texts.

This doesn't make me think that humans with elementary linguistic competence are still needed. On the contrary, I'm thinking to how the language is continuing to evolve. Exactly as it is testified by the gradual passage of the stone inscriptions from the early Roman Empire to its final years.

Paolo

[William Overington]

20 minutes ago, PaoloT said:

I was testing Canva, and had to notice the incredible amount of very basic grammar errors in the Italian translation of the texts.

What exactly was the testing that you were doing please?

What are "the texts" to which you refer please?

Is there a machine translation part to Canva or what?

William

 

[R C-R]

5 hours ago, Return said:

I find that American over the top Hollywood looking Style very cringeworthy to say the least.

That isn't just an American or a Hollywood style. It is just an example of one kind of the relaxed "business casual" dress increasingly favored by businesses around the world, particularly those with younger employees.

But more to the point, it has nothing to do with Canva's purchase of Affinity or its plans for those apps so I have to wonder why it has been mentioned.

[wonderings]

2 hours ago, SallijaneG said:

I hear what you are saying, but with an outright purchase, one can choose when to upgrade; I occasionally skipped a version, but made sure to get the last one that would keep my upgrade discount intact; only bought my first laptop when the upgrade of InDesign would no longer work on my G4 desktop, etc.  Yes, corporations with big budgets that get paid big bucks from customers who can afford it can subscribe to anything without care—but that creates a 2-tier industry—and a “moat” for them that some of us resent.  Frankly, my career has been what it is because I deliberately eschewed anything like that career path, a values-based choice for me that I realize is not for everyone—but the wider the gaps, the less good for society overall, in my opinion.
Sometimes I’m glad I’m old.

I can understand the reasoning and even practice, used to do that myself. With that came fragmentation though, once or twice we had to upgrade just to keep working with a customers file because they had a newer version of Adobe CS. 

The profits from one job a month easily covers the monthly subscription. We would have to have a serious look at our business if the software we are using became a burden monthly. I come from 2 areas of looking at things, the small family business that was built up over 65 years and now in a larger environment as we merged into a larger company that operates very differently then we did as a small family shop. So I do understand making every penny count, I do also understand the value of good tools and how a monthly subscription for Adobe really stands out compared to everything else coming in and out. 

I do wish the subscription model was a bit different though, I think that after a full year of a subscription if you decide to cancel you can keep the latest version you had, but no more updates. This leaves you with something at least. I can't remember if Adobe did this when the subscription came out or if it was some other company. 

 

[loukash]

3 hours ago, PaoloT said:

the most stunning example they had to offer was a zoom on a vector work

Yeah, while watching this part, my first thought was: "Zooming in 5000000%? Impressive but meh. Now try to export your 600000 layers to PDF. Or print them." 

3 hours ago, SallijaneG said:

I occasionally skipped a version, but made sure to get the last one that would keep my upgrade discount intact

Same here. Skipped CS1, CS2, CS4, CS5.0 & CS6 (except for Acrobat X). And beyond, of course.

[William Overington]

23 minutes ago, R C-R said:

But more to the point, it has nothing to do with Canva's purchase of Affinity or its plans for those apps so I have to wonder why it has been mentioned.

But it does.

That is how Canva management has chosen to publicly present Canva.

William

 

[R C-R]

20 minutes ago, wonderings said:

The profits from one job a month easily covers the monthly subscription.

But non-profits also use apps like Affinity. The market for non-subscription purchase models isn't just all amateurs & hobbyists.

[loukash]

27 minutes ago, R C-R said:

an example of one kind of the relaxed "business casual" dress

"Casual" is one thing. "Embarassingly silly" is another thing.   

[Affinityconfusesme]

I do think the bright blue Jacket is a little silly

[albertkinng]

11 minutes ago, wonderings said:

The profits from one job a month easily covers the monthly subscription.

That's not true. My agency has been successfully operating for over 30 years, with more than 20 companies under our umbrella. When Adobe introduced its subscription model, it significantly increased our annual expenses. We faced a choice: reduce salaries or switch tools. In 2014, we began transitioning, using Adobe alongside alternatives to ensure our survival without Adobe. Today, I'm proud to say our agency runs on the Affinity suite and Pixelmator Duo for graphics, and Sketch and Penpot for UI design and prototyping. This shift has allowed us to raise salaries and regularly upgrade our equipment. So, when I hear someone say, "the subscription pays for itself," it’s either a freelancer with a few clients or someone who doesn’t understand business. The only ones who justify the monthly payments are the ones who offer them. I can share privately the yearly expenses difference if you still have doubts. Don’t believe everything you read on the web. 

[PaoloT]

31 minutes ago, William Overington said:

What exactly was the testing that you were doing please?

What are "the texts" to which you refer please?

Is there a machine translation part to Canva or what?

I was creating some dummy projects (curriculum vitae, brochure, document, and so on). There is some sample text inserted in the template. I could find things written in something that pretended to be Italian, but was an alien language. And there were basic spelling mistakes, like "academico" instead of "accademico" or "ingegnieria" instead of "ingegneria". Since dictionaries wouldn't make errors like these, I suspect the AI at work to replicate the spelling competence of the currently average university graduate.

Yes, I would say that these are AI-generated translations. All considered, this is at the basis of Canva offering.

Paolo

 

[PaoloT]

32 minutes ago, R C-R said:

It is just an example of one kind of the relaxed "business casual" dress increasingly favored by businesses around the world, particularly those with younger employees.

Yes, I'm sure one can see Ash wear pastel blue moccasins in the pubs of Nottingham!

Paolo

 

[R C-R]

1 minute ago, William Overington said:

That is how Canva management has chosen to publicly present Canva.

It is how they chose to preset it to a specific audience that at the live event appears to be mostly younger people who liked their attire & the entertainment portion of the presentation. By extension, I think they are also trying to appeal to younger people who will go for the free licenses soon to be available for educational users.

[R C-R]

2 hours ago, loukash said:

"Casual" is one thing. "Embarassingly silly" is another thing.   

Once, people said the same thing about Steve Jobs & his trademark black turtlenecks because they thought that if CEO's did not dress "business formal" for public events they would project a frivolous image that would prevent people from taking the company seriously.

But maybe more to the point, from a theatrical standpoint the presenters needed to stand out from those busy colorful background images & not clash with it, so their garb was probably something that had been coordinated with the production designers, as is usual with this kind of big budget production.

[loukash]

7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

from a theatrical standpoint

… no one can ever beat Steve "Monkey Boy" Ballmer jumping around in sweat soaked shirt, hysterically screaming "developers! developers! developers!".
Ah, fun times…  

[SallijaneG]

1 hour ago, R C-R said:

But non-profits also use apps like Affinity. The market for non-subscription purchase models isn't just all amateurs & hobbyists.

If that is the only subscription needed, fine—but there is also Internet access, everything that goes into one’s office, any other apps one uses, one-time purchases of font licenses (those can be subscriptions, too), etc.  Freelancers may have a huge job for 6 months, then almost nothing for the next 2 or 3, so generally one would rather stay in control of expenses than have a constant drip.  Corporate employees do not have such worries, as the companies usually have big enough budgets for subscriptions to be covered.

[bayustudio]

In my country, students can get Canva Pro for free, and now they'll probably also get free Affinity. There's no better way to attract future users and lock them into the ecosystem. Good thing that Affinity will be more mainstream.

However, i'm pessimistic that Affinity will improve interoperability with other industry-leading apps, eg: better PSD export or supporting Figma.
Hopefully, they will keep plugins and a scripting API in their roadmap to make the app extensible for everyone, rather than aiming to lock them into Canva walled garden ecosystem.