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[Poll] Do you need a DAM? And what should it be like?

Do you need a DAM-program by Serif? And what should it be like?  

331 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you need a DAM?

    • No thanks. I'm just fine with the OS native File Browser / I happily use a 3rd party program for browsing my assets and RAW editing.
      52
    • Yes. I would like to have an Asset Browser. It should provide reliable Preview of all Affinity filetypes and of other popular file types. I do not work with RAW files / the current RAW editing implementation works well for my needs.
      56
    • Yes. I would like to have an Asset Browser, but it needs to have a powerful RAW processor built in. I often work with numerous files which need common base-corrections as well as individual tweaking – therefore the Develop Persona and working on single files one at a time doesn't cut it for me. I would appreciate better interchange with 3rd party RAW editors, hence sidecar files were very helpful. Affinity still could embed the RAW file along with its settings for compositing with other artwork – but in a way that one can return to the DAM for further tweaking of the input RAW file. Note: This implementation should work equally well for those who voted for 2).
      223


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I don't need a new DAM. I have Daminion Server to manage all kind of files (photos, videos, audio, documents, etc.) You can set in the preferences what kind of file type you want to import in the catalog(s) and can tag them (EXIF, IPTC, XMP)  also with custom defined XMP tags. In Daminion I have the open with function to set a link to any program that can handle the file. In my case the default is still Photoshop CS6 but on the second place is AffPhoto (second place for AffPhoto because still I lose some XMP metadata from the source file to the exported file using AffPhoto). I can decide which program I want use at this moment to work with.

 

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3 hours ago, UweN said:

In my case the default is still Photoshop CS6 but on the second place is AffPhoto (second place for AffPhoto because still I lose some XMP metadata from the source file to the exported file using AffPhoto).

That's very interesting. I hadn't noticed that. Can you be more specific in what is being lost? And I wonder if the latest Photo beta has corrected this? 

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4 hours ago, Ulysses said:

That's very interesting. I hadn't noticed that. Can you be more specific in what is being lost? And I wonder if the latest Photo beta has corrected this? 

Agree.  That should NOT be happening with the latest AP beta, I did some testing, it was carrying through all common metadata field properties on a file. 

ETA:  OK I see in other thread this is talking about certain IPTC properties, I was testing XMP.  That is not good--hopefully next beta gets this added.  

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Not desperately myself, but I do see the need for a professional workflow. Most useful for me is full-screen review and detail zoom (can't beat seeing it up-close). I've used both bog-standard Windows and FastRawViewer with comfort.


Dave Straker

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13 minutes ago, dmstraker said:

Not desperately myself, but I do see the need for a professional workflow. Most useful for me is full-screen review and detail zoom (can't beat seeing it up-close). I've used both bog-standard Windows and FastRawViewer with comfort.

My wife and I both use FRV for culling. Hard to beat the cost for how we use it and how well it works.

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I just came on here to suggest some sort of DAM (actually image management and RAW processing) to be able to lose Lightroom - another missing link to avoid CC completely for a large number of people - and then I found this poll, so I chimed in. 

Mostly I'd love to be able to view, metatag and process batches of RAW files. The file browser of macOS is getting better at stuff like that, but still to change EXIF data, I'd love to be able to stay in the affinity environment. I do most of my image corrections on the RAW file itself, so that I don't need to create another psd/tif or whatever file. Of course this is not always possible, but being able to save most of the basic changes in the RAW file, XML or DAM database is a huge help.

I've used Lightroom, Aperture and Capture One in the past and each one always felt like they were missing something. Since I'm paying for CC anyway, I'm currently using LR but I don't really care for it. One thing I do really like about it, which has nothing to do with the development process, is the ability to create an online gallery and have people vote, pick or download images. But since this is also missing a lot of features, it's nowhere close to perfect for as long as it has been around.

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If am perfectly happy  with  free open source RAW therapy  for RAW processing  even if it's a bit slower  comparing to Lightroom  and   iMatch, kind of a "true"  DAM  instead of those small bits of it  Lightroom has.

If Affinity would manage to make a quicker RAW therapy alternative  able to export non clipped  floating point exr  out of camera DNGs    and some AI based  automatic keywording  working at least same brainless   Lightroom does .  Or maybe just one of those two things,   I would buy it.

Still rather prefer they would focus on making  APhoto same non-destructive  Photoshop is.   A true replacement .

Lost my hope on Designer already.   

And then would improve beyond it .    Access to to other layers in procedural filter  with node based interface  maybe.   

 

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On 2/23/2020 at 4:31 PM, davidg2020 said:

I have had it over several different MacBook Pros and many different Mac operating systems. I thought it may be a conflict with a third party piece of software but have completely erased my hard drive and installed only Mac OS and CC apps and it still persists.

It doesn't seem to occur on my Windows machine, fortunately.

Bridge was unstable on my Mac as well...  Kicked it to the curb ages ago...


iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2017) Mac OS 10.15.4 | 4.2 GHz Quad Core Intel-Core i7 | 48 GB 2400 MHz DDR4 Ram | Radeon Pro 580 8 GB

Affinity Designer 1.8.3 | Affinity Photo 1.8.3 | Affinity Publisher 1.8.3

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On 2/27/2020 at 12:16 PM, shootingpandas said:

 DAM database is a huge help.

Not database please, just XMP files near the raw files.
It will make it compatible with third party applications (such as LRtimelapse that operate with XMP files data).

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The database for DAM does not contain the editing information that is stored in xmp files in the Adobe system. The LR database keeps track of where files are stored and information about them that we want to add in order to find them. It also tracks duplicates which are made for further processing.

In an affinity installation, should a DAM be produced, I would also expect it to keep track of files being used in other documents. For example photographs being used in publications. A database is an essential part of a DAM.

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On 3/7/2020 at 3:33 AM, KC Honie said:

Bridge was unstable on my Mac as well...  Kicked it to the curb ages ago...

Did you ever find a suitable replacement?

Lots of people have advocated photo-centric applications but I'm still looking for an app that previews other graphics type files (i.e. PDFs, vector files, etc).

I'd love to find an app that previews Affinity documents rather than showing a generic app icon as the preview.

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4 hours ago, davidg2020 said:

Did you ever find a suitable replacement?

Lots of people have advocated photo-centric applications but I'm still looking for an app that previews other graphics type files (i.e. PDFs, vector files, etc).

I'd love to find an app that previews Affinity documents rather than showing a generic app icon as the preview.

Have a look at ACDsee Photo Studio for Mac.

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On 3/20/2020 at 7:02 PM, davidg2020 said:

Did you ever find a suitable replacement?

Lots of people have advocated photo-centric applications but I'm still looking for an app that previews other graphics type files (i.e. PDFs, vector files, etc).

I'd love to find an app that previews Affinity documents rather than showing a generic app icon as the preview.

I am presently trying out Fast Raw Viewer...  It is great for doing culling but that is as far as I am taking it right now, AND, It really makes Catalina unstable...

You might take a look...

https://www.fastrawviewer.com


iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2017) Mac OS 10.15.4 | 4.2 GHz Quad Core Intel-Core i7 | 48 GB 2400 MHz DDR4 Ram | Radeon Pro 580 8 GB

Affinity Designer 1.8.3 | Affinity Photo 1.8.3 | Affinity Publisher 1.8.3

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On 4/5/2020 at 9:58 PM, KC Honie said:

I am presently trying out Fast Raw Viewer...  It is great for doing culling but that is as far as I am taking it right now, AND, It really makes Catalina unstable...

You might take a look...

https://www.fastrawviewer.com

FastRawViewer is a useful tool for quickly sorting through a batch of raw files before submitting them to Affinity Photo's develop persona. It is not a DAM and its authors do not claim that it is. Thanks for mentioning it. It is useful.

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I think if the DAM emulates Adobe Bridge they would be well served. Bridge is highly customizable and is what I'm using currently. I just set it to open relevant Affinity apps instead of Adobe apps. 

The huge RAW downfall is that Affinity's RAW processing is set up to edit one file at a time. This isn't helpful at all for the types of shooting I do where I often need to edit multiple files similarly during the same session. I'm using Capture One Pro for this at the moment, (I've found it to be a superior processing engine vs. everything else I've tried). I'm comfortable with having a dedicated RAW processor part of my workflow, but it would be a bonus if you could batch edit RAWs with both it and Photo.

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Affinity batch process works on raw files. Sometimes with a long list you will get a not responding as they load; just give it time.

The running of the bath process has been reliable for several releases.

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5 minutes ago, Amateur John said:

Affinity batch process works on raw files. Sometimes with a long list you will get a not responding as they load; just give it time.

The running of the bath process has been reliable for several releases.

Yes, you can run a batch of raw conversions to JPEG . However, to @Phojoegraphy's point, one cannot make adjustments to those individual raw files and then preserve those settings for batch conversion. Having such an ability would be a huge leap forward for Affinity Photo.

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I vote in favour of having a separate DAM application.  I would prefer something simple which contains no 'processing' functionality (these are already contained in the apps) but is very much superior to a 'file manager'.  I find the trouble with Lightroom is that its functional scope isn't well defined and it blurs the boundary too much between processing/editing and file management.  In my view it does too much editing and not enough file management.  Other applications e.g. Capture One are superior in this respect.

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Posted (edited)

I wouldn't dream of running a batch of raw to jpeg. I run a batch of raw to afphoto. then edit and export to whatever format and size that I need.

 

Edited by Amateur John

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I'm not a photographer so I'm not sure how well this solution will work, but apparently Adobe Bridge is (and always has been) free. Here's a YouTube video about using it with AP

 


Windows 10 Pro, XP-Pen Deco 03, AP & AD

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12 hours ago, casterle said:

I'm not a photographer so I'm not sure how well this solution will work, but apparently Adobe Bridge is (and always has been) free. Here's a YouTube video about using it with AP

 

Thanks very much for the YouTube video. It's a good set of tips.

I'm a pro photographer, and thus far, I stick with Adobe Bridge CC as my file manager pretty much 95% of the time. For now, it IS the best FREE file manager available for its broad feature set. But to be honest, its still not satisfactory for use with Affinity products. A huge reason for this in my opinion is the lack of thumbnail previews. In the video he describes a sort of workaround, but there are problems with this approach: a) it's too time intensive for a pro studio where you need an efficient and smooth workflow; b) even if you establish the small JPEG at the top of the stack he describes, you won't necessarily know whether or not you've actually saved an AFPHOTO version of a given file without opening the stack. What we need is native previews for smoother operation. 

So whenever I really need a preview of my Affinity Photo and Designer files, I use XNViewMP on my Mac. I'm really hoping to streamline this process down the road when the right file manager comes along.

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On 4/8/2020 at 6:34 AM, Amateur John said:

FastRawViewer is a useful tool for quickly sorting through a batch of raw files before submitting them to Affinity Photo's develop persona. It is not a DAM and its authors do not claim that it is. Thanks for mentioning it. It is useful.

I understand that FRW is not a DAM, it is an intake tool, a reasonable DAM does not exist for the MacOS environment.

I am curious why you would submit a batch of raw files to Affinity Photo?  Capture One Pro or Lightroom (or one of the lesser competitors) would be the typical environment to develop raw files and then use Affinity Photo like you would Photoshop.  Neither AP nor PS is suited to developing a great deal of raw images.

An example, I did a wildlife shoot this afternoon (with the proper social distancing, there was no one within miles).  I shot about 500 images, culled about half with FRW in about 15 minutes and then imported the rest into C1P to further cull the images.  Then I develop the remaining images in C1P, a handful will require additional work in AP.  There is no way I would even consider using AP as a primary develop tool.  That is not what it is designed to do...


iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2017) Mac OS 10.15.4 | 4.2 GHz Quad Core Intel-Core i7 | 48 GB 2400 MHz DDR4 Ram | Radeon Pro 580 8 GB

Affinity Designer 1.8.3 | Affinity Photo 1.8.3 | Affinity Publisher 1.8.3

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