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Cmb5104

Why I am NOT supporting the Affinity range of software

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Re :  @AtelierCunha what would you do if Affinity didn't exist? :)

 

 

 

Haven't checked in here beside the day created this account to ask about the improved tables which Miscrosoft Publisher 2000 and Serif PagePlus X9 STILL DOES NOT HAVE!!.

Today I was going through my inbox which lead me check on the progress of Affinity Publisher and frankly when I see a post like the one made on 14 Decemember 2017  - I see red and had to step away from my desk I am so offended.

I am going to reply - as briefly, but in detail -

I 45 years old. Serif.com has access to all the software invoices  I have bought since my Microsoft Office 2000 CDs went faulty and I stumbled across Serif PagePlus and ordered it via airmail way back between 17 to 18 years ago. 

My family has been in the computer and tec industry since my parents met in 1978.

I was around 8 or 9 when  I firsted started teaching myself how to code when the people who worked from my parents weren't using the computers over the weekends or the evenings. This was on a CANON AS100 which did not have a hard drive but two floppy disks. At the stage I think MS DOS was not even commonly used back then here is what I do know

S E V E R A L - and I mean thousands if not hundered of thousands, small families and business peoples have used all sort of computer over a great number of years. Like myself we have bought new purchases of products like

 

  • ·         Microsoft Money
  • ·         Microsoft Office
  • ·         Microsoft Works
  • ·         Adobe Photoshop.
  • ·         Visual Basic 6
  • ·         Visual Studio
  • ·         Microsoft FrontPage
  • ·         all sorts of software.

 

I still use Drawplus, my version of Serif MoviePlus still work - not very well I have to admit and yet in all the past years that I have been supporting Serif.com I wish to go on the records as to say the following :

 

Not once have I ever received a letter from anybody at SERIF.COM to my email address which I still keep up to date at serif.com along the line of :

 

Dear Christopher.

 

We noticed you have been using our products for a number of years. In fact you have bought every edition of Serif PagePlus since your purchased Serif PagePlus X2 from us in 19XX except PagePlus X8.

Since we have never offered you an upgrade price or a discount on behalf of Serif.com, as we transition to moving our software over to a new range which will fall under a different brand we would like make you aware that we are in fact working on a whole new range of software you already own and if you haven't already heard from anybody at Serif.com please send me or one of colleagues a reply to this email so we can get your feedback on our software as we strive to improve our new AFFINITY SOFTWARE for all our existing users and as well as new users who could benefit from it.

 

Hardy har har  - never gonna happen though is it ?

When I see this :

what would you do if Affinity didn't exist?

As far as I am concerned Affinity DOES NOT EXIST despite many years of paying a ton of good money to use newer versions of Serif software with not one penny or cent discount !!!

 

In fact yesterday I was working in Serif PagePlus X9, and PhotoPlus and Drawplus and Panorama Plus all of which run perfectly well across the 4 computer which I have connected around my desk using Windows 10 Enterprise, Miscrosoft Mousewithout Boarders, Microsoft Money Business ( now totally a free b t w as is Visual Basic 6) 

and yet the ironic thing is this : I can still not create a decent table in  Pageplus X9 with cells that split  diagonally which Microsoft Publisher 2000 can do ? To do this I have to creatre the table in Publisher, export it as a graphic and then embed that in my Pageplus publication ?

I have seen screenshots of the Affinity Products on YouTube and I cannot stand the new look and Serif.COM  OR  affinity.serif.com

Has got a LONG LONG LONG LONG WAY to go before I will seriously consider even spending US$25 on Affinity Publisher

Thanks but my software is functional to some degree and I will keep it that way At least with Office 356 I am getting some cloud storage and other people can develop add-ons for Microsoft Software, best of all I do not have to go and pay $11 for a workbook not to mention shipping to ?

I take exception to be exploited and new versions of the same software with no real improvements that justify it and this exactly what Serif is and has been doing to many loyal customers – like myself – over a number of years, in my own opinion.

 

Thanks

PS : How do I give myself a 10 000 warning points ?

 

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I'm confused as to why you are upset. Is it because they never offered you a discount before or that you don't like the direction the software is moving? No offense but your post is rather rambling and incoherent in places. Serif has moved in a different direction with their Affinity software and I'm sure that some users of their previous software might not be thrilled with the new direction, but it is something that they will have to get used to. While I've never used any of their previous titles, I'm impressed with the power and ease of use that their current titles offer, especially considering the incredible price. No offense but Microsoft Publisher is the worst of the worst, I'm sure that Affinity Publisher will be more than Microsoft Publisher could ever hope to be. 

best of luck,

Hokusai

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As a longtime Mac user I had never used Serif's legacy apps because, well, they were for Windows. I think that you have to appreciate that over time, it becomes increasingly difficult to keep up with old legacy code, to add new features, to keep up with the changing Operating systems, etc.

If Serif wanted to increase the number of customers by also including Mac OS, how were they going to do that easily by porting their old code? To take advantage of new hardware and technologies, modern APIs, etc, they had to literally start over from scratch with a new slate, and this allowed them to develop for both Windows and Mac and iOS. They have said they aren't developing for Android or Linux but if they were at least it would be possible now. This is not something that is unique to Serif, I have seen many software companies over the years having to eventually rewrite their apps at some point, it is just a fact of life.

You may find yourself patting yourself on the back, proud that your old Serif apps work right now but there is no guarantee that they will continue to do so. I had bought many Adobe CS apps before they went to their CC cloud. On the Mac, on the latest MacOS, it becomes problematic trying to install older software. I keep an old Mac Pro with MacOS 10.7.5 so that I can run some of these older apps. You may find that Microsoft makes some OS changes in the future that suddenly make your Serif apps not run as smoothly. It is just the nature of the beast.

I must say that buying software, and each user's different views on what they expect, what they think they are entitled to, what they think they deserve, has always been fascinating to me. I have the utmost respect for software developers, the coders, etc. It seems like such a thankless job though, with far too many people ready to dismiss your efforts. Everybody seemingly wants everything for free. I don't understand that logic and never will.

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Is it the software you don't like or the fact that you don't get discounts? It's not very clear.

As far as pricing goes, Affinity products are very competitive rather than extortionate and what they offer represents good value for money. There is no obligation for a company to offer discounts across any of their product ranges, none at all. If it were the case that product loyalty is rewarded then were does it begin and end? I could argue that, because I have been a loyal fan of the writer Steven King, and bought most of his books over the years, then would I be right in expecting a discount when I buy one of his books? I also own several Gibson guitars which I have collected over the years, and as an identical example, have I the right to expect a loyalty discount if I buy another one?

It doesn't really matter if the product is physical or virtual, the company producing it must survive in order to grow and adapt to modern times, even if it means changing or modifying their products.


Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe.

These are not my own words but I sure like this quote.

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On 6/29/2018 at 11:46 PM, Cmb5104 said:

many years of paying a ton of good money to use newer versions of Serif software with not one penny or cent discount

If you purchased and registered every version of PagePlus from X2 to X7 inclusive, you qualified for the maximum upgrade discount on each new version. Having skipped X8 you disqualified yourself, but if you own a registered copy of WebPlus X8, PhotoPlus X8, DrawPlus X8 or MoviePlus X6 you would still have qualified for a 20% discount on the purchase price of PagePlus X9.

When the Windows versions of the Affinity apps were announced, registered users of DrawPlus X8 or PhotoPlus X8 were promised a discount on purchases of Affinity Designer or Affinity Photo, respectively. In the event, that exclusive discount never materialized, but instead a generous discount was offered on all purchases for a limited time.


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 1.7.2.471 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.2.153 • Designer for iPad 1.7.2.6 • iOS 12.4.1 (iPad Air 2)

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Egads, Christopher, the original purchase price of an Affinity license is about 30% (or less) of the typical price for a mere version upgrade of most mainstream graphics applications.

For just the most obvious example: Because I will not rent business-critical graphics software, Adobe's arrogant move to entrap all its long-time customers into its Cloudy Captives licensing scheme effectively freed up ~$1200-1500 of software budget from the chronic upgrade cycle for keeping my copy of the so called Master Collection bundle current. That pays for the whole collection of the Serif Plus applications, the Affinity programs, and others, too.

Corel is about to do something similar. As I read the release of its 2018 versions, Corel has announced that version upgrade discounts will no longer be offered to its perpetual license customers (i.e., the ones who pay most per version) unless we also pay a flat per-year "maintenance" fee. A single payment of that "maintenance" fee pays for a perpetual license for both of the Affinity apps.

Times have changed. The monolithic old-world graphics software vendors are desperately clinging to their inflated pricing models, remnants from when desktop graphics was a paradigm shift. It's just not anymore. This stuff isn't rocket science, and Serif is proving that an efficient company can thrive by offering great products at affordable prices.

So while you're as entitled to state your case as anyone, I seriously doubt you're outrage is going to drum up much of a movement; at least not among those of us who have been making our livings with softwares that typically cost five to six times (and more) per upgrade than the price of an Affinity app.

If there's one thing no one should be complaining about regarding the Affinity line, its value per dollar.

JET

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Rather drastic post. I use Affinity Photo and yes, some features may be lacking in comparison to Photoshop, but in some ways it's actually superior, especially in concept (which bodes well for the future). And I only paid $20 for it. I've paid more for meals that made me throw up.

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Purchased Microsoft FrontPage ??  Ouchhhh ! That pile of...I'm a web developer (knowing code inside out, as well as  these point and click editors), and I can tell you , that spitted anything but clean or organized code. Amazingly bad for SEO and editing code directly by other team members or whoever. Very poorly featured, too, with many issues.  And Works and Money are pretty basic, if one is complaining about some features lacks, these are kings at that.... 

Incredibly  enough, the OP is complaining about Serif's pricing ! I can't believe that post could be serious... Plus, all software he speaks about is from MS or near to be abandoned....

CS 6 costed a lot of more money, PS was around 800, it got to be 2k for shipping to some countries... If he had been purchasing CS 1, ...to CS6, then we could talk about money, lol.... Even a single app of one single version might be more expensive than all of his purchases together...

 

<Original contents put back by moderator PJC>


Affinity Designer and Affinity Photo licenses, Windows 7, i7  860 (2009) 2.8 GHz,  8 GB RAM, GTX 1050 2 GB, HD 7200 RPM.  Wacom Intuos 4 XL.

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@Hokusai I am confused at your rudeness - can you please suggest how you can compare the cost of all the money I have spent of my SERIF software since 1999. Not to mention downloading files was not readily available to most users in South Africa until the end of 2002.  Then fact in the costs of extra fee is the download setup images is corrupt or because the South African equilvant of Vodafone is too busy and they limit the numbers used allow on during certain hours of the day.

 

Now please factor in the exchange rate between my local currency and the British poud and USA dollar. Honestly I am insulted by word reply to this my topic.

On 6/30/2018 at 8:48 AM, αℓƒяє∂ said:

If you purchased and registered every version of PagePlus from X2 to X7 inclusive, you qualified for the maximum upgrade discount on each new version. Having skipped X8 you disqualified yourself, but if you own a registered copy of WebPlus X8, PhotoPlus X8, DrawPlus X8 or MoviePlus X6 you would still have qualified for a 20% discount on the purchase price of PagePlus X9.

When the Windows versions of the Affinity apps were announced, registered users of DrawPlus X8 or PhotoPlus X8 were promised a discount on purchases of Affinity Designer or Affinity Photo, respectively. In the event, that exclusive discount never materialized, but instead a generous discount was offered on all purchases for a limited time.

@alfred thank you for this information. I wonder why nobody at Serif headoffice or customer support has ever informed of these discounts ? I own a lot more Serif products than this to. Do you think it is strange the Serif do not offer existing customer a trial version of their updates software to see if they want to pay for a new version. Say you have Serif PagePlus X7 and you are unsure if you want all the new feartures of Pageplus X8 - sorry this is not an option and if you email customer support at serif head office - you get a generic reply from a template based archive which is merely copied and pasted and no further replies are given to follow up emails.

 

As I explain - I have never heard annoucment of the Affinity apps today and only stumbled across them when I was tring to if I could figure out how to do something on Youtube.

 

@JET_Affinity I fully understand the points you are making.

Did you ever use word processing applications such as WordStar 2000. One day my father who started learning to code on punch cards - yes we actually still have 90% of his orginal code in a box in storage got hold of a copy of Windows 2 or the 2.1 upgrade and he was finally - a WYSIWYG interface.

My parents single handly run a comprehensive software suite which my father started developing at university. When he implement the activation feature that was brought in Windows XP I think 80 % of his users were using illegal software. Sure times have change. Unfortunately not ever business has an entire development dedicated to coding different parts of a software suite.

It takes years of dedication and also buy products such a WIndows 95 through to Windows 8 Professional. Microsoft Office purchases and upgrades.

 

I seriously doubt you're outrage is going to drum up much of a movement; at least not among those of us who have been making our livings with softwares that typically cost five to six times (and more) per upgrade than the price of an Affinity app.

 

- I am sorry you feel this way. I am glad you are making your living with these apps. In my person experiences - dealing with family memembers, friends and people who come into the family offices and do not even know which version of Windows they are using, how defrag their hard drives or even uninstall software - I can say that a ton of people do not have your skills with technology today as you or other users in this forum may have.

@SrPx interesting comments -

 

CS 6 costed a lot of more money, PS was around 800, it got to be 2k for shipping to some countries... If he had been purchasing CS 1, ...to CS6, then we could talk about money, lol.... Even a single app of one single version might be more expensive than all of his purchases together...

 

do you have a degree major in business management ? how about one with an additional major in accounting ? have you also paid a qualified accountant to take all the factors of running a business into account since 1975 ?

If you can't believe my post is serious then please talk to me about the cost of software developed by Autocad ?

 

 

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19 minutes ago, Cmb5104 said:

@Alfred - thank you for this information. I wonder why nobody at Serif headoffice or customer support has ever informed of these discounts ? I own a lot more Serif products than this [too].

I’m surprised you haven’t had a steady flow of upgrade offers into your email offers over the years. I lost count of the number of emails I received about the ‘Plus’ products, often urging me to take advantage of a discount on upgrading to a version that I already owned!

Patrick posted his comprehensive reply while I was typing the above paragraph. What he has written is entirely in line with my expectations.


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 1.7.2.471 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.2.153 • Designer for iPad 1.7.2.6 • iOS 12.4.1 (iPad Air 2)

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@Patrick ConnorThanks so much for the update.

 

You have no right to what kind of email address I may or may not be using. Nor do you have the right to inform people on a public formy how may purchased when I have a valid ticket in place on the Serif itself.

As a moderator - what give you the right to quote personal customer information on an opinion express in a public forum ? You haven't even PM at all ?

 

If you are so keen to talk about my personal data with Serif itself you should have no problems with me issuing a complaint about you directly to Serif Head Office itself

 

 

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