Please consider Linux as a viable platform - Microsoft is bleeding users to Linux because of their choices.

[maxoakland]

On 5/11/2024 at 3:54 AM, - S - said:

I wish you luck, as I agree with your comments regarding Microsoft.

However, as I'm not sure it will happen given the previous responses, wouldn't it be more worthwhile trying to aim for more organisation and focus in the FOSS community and to come up with a plan to fill the holes where creative-focused software is lacking on Linux?  The first step would be to have a clear plan of what's needed on Linux, the next step would be to discuss methods of obtaining grants and other funding to make it happen.

 

Not a bad idea. GIMP is FOSS that has an incredibly powerful backend but a bad interface. It probably has more features than Affinity and has been under development since the 90s

All it needs is more focus on improving the UI and bringing it up to modern usability standards

[yesreallylinux]

3 hours ago, maxoakland said:

Not a bad idea. GIMP is FOSS that has an incredibly powerful backend but a bad interface. It probably has more features than Affinity and has been under development since the 90s

All it needs is more focus on improving the UI and bringing it up to modern usability standards

Here's a recent mockup for what GIMP could look like: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gimp/-/issues/11025

[Alfred]

15 hours ago, TylerCode said:

Affinity seems pretty goated so far and really seems like the last piece I needed to ditch Adobe.

PS - Affinity
Illustrator - Affinity
Audition - Reaper
Premiere - Resolve

For completeness:

Photoshop - Affinity Photo
Illustrator - Affinity Designer
Audition - Cockos Reaper
Premiere - DaVinci Resolve

[maxoakland]

8 hours ago, yesreallylinux said:

Here's a recent mockup for what GIMP could look like: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gimp/-/issues/11025

WOW that would be an improvement. It actually looks like a real application

[LinuxMint]

Man, this flash sale has me wanting to buy affinity even though I can't use it on Linux... I wonder if there's any hope for it to one day work. 50% off is such a deal.

[rparmar]

On 6/11/2024 at 8:36 AM, Alfred said:

For completeness:

Photoshop - Affinity Photo
Illustrator - Affinity Designer
Audition - Cockos Reaper
Premiere - DaVinci Resolve

For further completeness:

Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve

(They do like long names down under!)

[Frozen Death Knight]

I would also recommend Ardour for audio production, especially for those who are on Linux. You can compile it from Git and run the latest version completely for free on that OS only. There are also tons of plug-ins that are free on Linux like Calf and Linux Studio Plugins that are not supported in the Linux version of Davinci Resolve. Tinkered with it since yesterday and it's not that complicated to do after finding a video showing off how to install it and run it. Just from my short time using it it seems pretty powerful with a solid GUI that I honestly preferred over Reaper after testing it out for a bit. Plugins work there as well.

[wout]

12 hours ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

I would also recommend Ardour for audio production, especially for those who are on Linux. You can compile it from Git and run the latest version completely for free on that OS only. There are also tons of plug-ins that are free on Linux like Calf and Linux Studio Plugins that are not supported in the Linux version of Davinci Resolve. Tinkered with it since yesterday and it's not that complicated to do after finding a video showing off how to install it and run it. Just from my short time using it it seems pretty powerful with a solid GUI that I honestly preferred over Reaper after testing it out for a bit. Plugins work there as well.

For audio production, I would also recommend Bitwig. It's made by ex-employees of Ableton Live, and from version one, they offered a Linux version. I bought version one and every major update after that.

I still secretly hope one day, Affinity/Serif/Canva will decide to take the leap. I know so many people who would make the switch to Linux if would happen.

[fde101]

There are several good DAWs on Linux by now: Ardour is the main "open source" one, but commercially there are Bitwig Studio, Reaper, Tracktion Waveform, Harrison Mixbus, just for a start...

Interestingly Reaper (which is low-cost but commercial) actually beat out Ardour in terms of votes for who is using it under Linux on a poll I found on some random web site.  It probably isn't statistically accurate though.  Bitwig Studio came in third, but would probably be my pick also if I had to choose just one (hopefully not as I also have licenses for Waveform and Mixbus - I don't use Reaper - and evidently there has been some success within the community getting the Windows version of FL Studio to work under Linux as well...).

[Frozen Death Knight]

2 hours ago, fde101 said:

There are several good DAWs on Linux by now: Ardour is the main "open source" one, but commercially there are Bitwig Studio, Reaper, Tracktion Waveform, Harrison Mixbus, just for a start...

Interestingly Reaper (which is low-cost but commercial) actually beat out Ardour in terms of votes for who is using it under Linux on a poll I found on some random web site.  It probably isn't statistically accurate though.  Bitwig Studio came in third, but would probably be my pick also if I had to choose just one (hopefully not as I also have licenses for Waveform and Mixbus - I don't use Reaper - and evidently there has been some success within the community getting the Windows version of FL Studio to work under Linux as well...).

I think one reason for that is that Reaper is just more popular on Windows as well, so that will naturally spill over into Linux. After trying both on Linux I vastly prefer Ardour in terms of looks and usability, but learning how to do a Git install took some time and I made a bunch of mistakes that luckily I got incredible support for on the Ardour forums. Plus, I found an excellent tutorial on how to set the source code up. Now after taking the time to write some scripts I have an incredibly easy time to update the software once updates come out. Besides some issues importing videos with audio it's been a very nice experience so far after trying it for a day.

[RNKLN]

This conversation started with the position that Windows was bleeding users to Linux. I'd be curious to know what source was used. I've checked with Statcounter. Linux on desktop has gone up a little bit, in the past year, but not as much as Windows (which certainly isn't bleeding), according to Statcounter. Even if you assume that what is reported as Unknown in real life is Linux the market share is well below 10% and not really going up. 

[pixelstuff]

11 hours ago, RNKLN said:

This conversation started with the position that Windows was bleeding users to Linux. I'd be curious to know what source was used. I've checked with Statcounter. Linux on desktop has gone up a little bit, in the past year, but not as much as Windows (which certainly isn't bleeding), according to Statcounter. Even if you assume that what is reported as Unknown in real life is Linux the market share is well below 10% and not really going up. 

A finger prick is still considered bleeding, right? 

[Frozen Death Knight]

Well, even if hundreds of thousands switched it wouldn't leave much of a blip on the radar compared to the billions of computer users today. Also, Windows 10 is still very much usable for the foreseeable future, so even the people interested in switching will either learn to dual boot or stay with Windows 10 until it becomes too much of a hassle.

The fact of the matter Is that a lot of people will stay with Windows in some way just because people are used to it. As Linux improves it will become more popular, but it is going to require a significant push and initiative for it to grow exponentially. FOSS have been able to do so sometimes like with Blender, but that took years of planning and dedication to bridge the gap between it and its users to make it user friendly.

After trying Linux Mint I can at least say that I was pleasantly surprised by how user friendly it was, but even then there were pain points along the way like messy audio drivers for audio production and problems finding certain alternatives to software I use daily. It's definitely getting there, but it will take time to make Linux the go to OS for power users. For casual use I would say that Linux Mint is practically there. It did not take long at all to install and download the basic drivers and programs to get a solid base experience.

[oliiix]

+1 for a Linux version as well from my side!

I'm not going back to Windows, too much is too much, I have a game engine, 3d software, 3d painting software, coding tools, EVERYTHING but a decent photo software.

[yesreallylinux]

On 6/14/2024 at 8:06 PM, RNKLN said:

This conversation started with the position that Windows was bleeding users to Linux. I'd be curious to know what source was used. I've checked with Statcounter. Linux on desktop has gone up a little bit, in the past year, but not as much as Windows (which certainly isn't bleeding), according to Statcounter. Even if you assume that what is reported as Unknown in real life is Linux the market share is well below 10% and not really going up. 

Don't forget ChromeOS, which is Linux too; it's not a separate platform. 3.77% + 2.55% = 6.32%. If you assume all of the "Unknown" is Linux-based, then you get 11.18%. But it's unrealistic to assume all of the "Unknown" statistic is Linux. A good portion of that is just Windows and macOS users not being detected correctly (see back in May 2023 for example). That's worldwide, of course; you get a different story if you check just the US for example.

6.32% is a significant market share, though. I don't think Windows needs to fail for desktop Linux to succeed.

If we want to get into more domain-specific data, the Steam hardware survey has Linux at 2.32% for last month while macOS is at 1.47% and Windows claims the rest. And obviously the StackOverflow survey has Linux, macOS, and Windows share divvied up pretty evenly.

If you want some more "feelings-based" data, just have a look at how many users are coming into this thread putting their hand up for Linux support.

[RoseTinted]

I am sure this topic has come up before but this is the one I have been reading. My interest comes from needing to deal with scanned photos and documents, although I have Macs running Lightroom I use a big Linux machine to handle my scanners.

Lightroom is my tool of choice for archiving as it is easy to use, has all the metadata tools I need and the parametric processing which does not touch the Master files. Having said that I use Affinity Photo for retouching and for going beyond what Lightroom can manage. Notice that I use Affinity rather than Photoshop for this as I find it quicker and easier and, well, it is an old friend that I enjoy using. If only I could find something to replace Lightroom I could leave Adobe and if I could switch to linux too I would.

Back in the distant past I worked in the computer/IT business, first as a programmer and then as a Global Marketing Manager (mmm big titles on my business cards). I remember the "killer apps" which took users to different platforms. Does anyone remember Lotus 1-2-3 and Supercalc? I think we are at a point now where there is an opportunity for a commercial software developer to make Linux the platform of choice.

Linux has GIMP of course and the new version 3 has promise. But even if all the things being added come to pass it will not be as good as Affinity Photo. Scribus cannot match Affinity Publisher and Inkscape does not compare to Affinity Designer. But the danger here for Serif is that GIMP is good enough, remember that it can be used on Mac and Windows as well. I can see a scenario where Serif is squeezed between open-source and Adobe.

There is an opportunity here and now to be the kings of Linux and to build a new user base. The technical problems are real and I have no doubt it would require solid commitment to solve them. But we should not be looking at existing market share for making that decision. Probably it is best to support one bistro and work with them to produce something viable. The vast number of Windows computers out there do not run Affinity software and many of the Mac users are hooked on Adobe. Competing with Adobe in this space is going to be difficult. Existing Linux users are not the market either. Many Linux users are of what I think of as "purists" who will user Arch Linux and never let commercial software sully their machines. But there are many others who dabble with it who would jump to Linux full time if only decent software were available.

And there is other opportunity as well. Affinity lacks a Lightroom killer. In the open-source world we have Digikam and Darktable. It might be easier to integrate into these (across multiple platforms) than to develop something new. And bring Canva along for the ride! It is easy to just look at usage stats and decide that Linux would not be cost effective. But this may be a time when vision is needed.

[hidemat]

Dear Serif,

With the recent Adobe and Microsoft privacy policy changes, and their uncanny plan to spy on their users, a lot of people want to move to Linux and Affinity products. Please help use break free of their shackles!

Sincerely yours,

Hide

[Laura Ess]

I may be mistaken here but I read earlier that the big obstacle to having a Linux version of any of the Affinity apps (if you're going to do Designer, you really should do Photo and Publisher) that which distro to use. So why not package these as a FlatPack? I've sure there would be plenty of volunteers ready to work on the dependencies.

[FdelS]

+100 for linux version, flatpack or whatever.

I bought affinity suite + books + updates since their first version, but not going to pay anymore as bit by bit I'm more use to other software that runs on linux. and Affinity suite keeps on the virtual machine just for occasional use.

Hope some day they change their mind and work on a linux version.

[fde101]

On 6/17/2024 at 6:51 PM, Laura Ess said:

the big obstacle to having a Linux version of any of the Affinity apps (if you're going to do Designer, you really should do Photo and Publisher) that which distro to use.

It is likely to be a contention point but in and of itself is not a major obstacle.  As you pointed out, Flatpak is one way to get around that; there are others.

One example of a bigger obstacle is likely to be training support personnel on a platform that many people customize past the point of recognition, such that support personnel trying to help people find their way around may have no idea where to tell them to look for things.

[yesreallylinux]

2 hours ago, fde101 said:

One example of a bigger obstacle is likely to be training support personnel on a platform that many people customize past the point of recognition, such that support personnel trying to help people find their way around may have no idea where to tell them to look for things.

Could you expand on that? Support personnel for Affinity? And what is an example of something users would expect support to help them with that doesn't involve Affinity?

Flatpak already ensures that the Affinity applications themselves are the same for everyone who uses them, but obviously that does nothing for the desktop.

In the worst case, you can do what Jetbrains does and only support GNOME or KDE.

[Edward Borland]

I have moved our machines from windows to pop os (a variant of ubuntu). 

It is working really well for us and we are delighted to be free.

We'd like to use Affinity software but are reluctant to fiddle around with wine.

We're hoping to buy all of the Affinity suite when it is available on Linux, like many others i'm sure!

[Laura Ess]

On 6/19/2024 at 9:00 AM, fde101 said:

One example of a bigger obstacle is likely to be training support personnel on a platform that many people customize past the point of recognition, such that support personnel trying to help people find their way around may have no idea where to tell them to look for things.

How is that relevant? So far Affinity Apps still have main menus and options which are mostly the same regardless of OS? Most of the help for apps is the same for Win and Mac,  except for referencing keyboard shortcuts which differ, isn't it? It would just be an extra row of help on the help pages, and standard in-app help on the Linux versions even if one ran on OpenSuse and another on Arch, wouldn't they?  Could you give a more explicit example of where they wouldn't be?
 

[Nerve]

I would also like to request Linux support, with the caveat that it be prioritized through Wine/Proton. It is an exceptionally capable translation layer and I've been able to use many desktop applications and games via Wine/Proton. This would minimize the workload on Affinity by providing a well-defined set of system dependencies, in the form of what is essentially a stable Windows VM target, which would take a minimum of extra legwork beyond the current Windows compatibility. If you wanted to go the extra mile, you could package a preconfigured Wine prefix together with the Affinity applications and throw that into an AppImage that will work on just about any Linux distribution with no fuss.

Edited June 20, 2024 by Nerve

[fde101]

18 hours ago, Laura Ess said:

How is that relevant?

Where are your preference files?

Where is the downloaded content from the Serif site, and how does support instruct you to navigate there to fix something when they suspect it has become corrupt?

If the application itself has become corrupt, how do you remove and reinstall it?

 

Online help is generally useful within the application, and I agree that it is not a big deal there.  The problem is that support sometimes needs to work outside the application using tools provided by the operating system to deal with issues that the application itself might not address, and the available tools, how to find them in the menus, and so on, can vary quite a bit depending on the distribution, on what version of what desktop environment is being used, on user customization of the environment, and so on.  Users can customize closed-source platforms somewhat as well, but not nearly to the same degree.  Even at the command line, depending on the user's $PATH, custom shell functions and aliases, and how such things might have been modified, not to mention which shell is used (bash, tcsh, fish, etc. all have different syntax from each other), there could be differences - again, possible in Windows or macOS, but much less common.