How to delete what's inside a selection?

[BLine5]

@MEB

Could you have this documented somewhere in the help files? I spent an inordinate amount of time trying to figure this out, gave up, used a different photo editor to delete a selection and then brought that back into AP. The whole modality of different layer types (pixel, image, etc) is a bit of a bear to figure out, especially if you're experienced with any other editor. There should also be an explicit section on layer types—limitations, etc.—in the product docs.

Thanks.

(Edit: Running v1.6.7 of AP (macOS). Just checked the in-app help file. Under the Layers section there is no mention of an Image type layer. A pretty significant oversight.)

Edited December 18, 2018 by BLine5
Checking Help File...

[fde101]

24 minutes ago, robinp said:

 Your point is interesting and yes, switching to marquee having created the lasso selection does indeed enable the contents to be deleted.

ok, so it seems the delete key is being handled inconsistently between tools - that is very likely a bug

 

20 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

That confuses me a bit, as Windows has both Delete and Backspace keys.

The original Mac keyboard had a "backspace" key: https://www.macworld.com/article/2090522/unboxing-a-30-year-old-macintosh-128k.html#slide19

It was replaced with a "delete" key with the switch to the ADB connector: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Apple_Macintosh_ADB_Keyboard.jpg

When the "extended" keyboards started coming out they added a "forward delete" key to do basically what the "delete" key does on Windoze-type keyboards.

All of Apple's documentation for a long time now has called them delete and forward delete, not backspace.

This is also in keeping with the Apple II series: https://www.flickr.com/photos/jean-paul-margnac/3800713644

 

 

[MEB]

1 hour ago, firstdefence said:

Ok, drawing a rectangle and pressing backspace I can delete every time, drawing with the lasso I can delete using Cmd + X but backspace just deselects the lasso selection. Backspace for the lasso appears to be Undo, draw 2 or three selections with the lasso and press backspace it will take you to the previously drawn selections, until it deselects the first selection drawn.

This is a bug that was already fixed in Photo Beta 1.7. Pressing backspace always deletes the contents of the selection for the active layer.

Pressing backspace with an object/layer selected (no selection active), deletes the object/layer instead (which is how most editors behave as well).

[robinp]

1 minute ago, MEB said:

This is a bug that was already fixed in Photo Beta 1.7. Pressing backspace always deletes the contents of the selection for the active layer.

Pressing backspace with an object/layer selected (no selection active), deletes the object/layer instead.

Great that the lasso bug has been picked up. 

I really really don’t like deleting the layer via backspace / delete key. It is horribly dangerous. 

At the very least, can we make it so that the shortcuts are controlled separately. It seems to me that conceptually deleting the contents of a selection is very different to deleting a layer. That they are controlled with the same shortcut just seems wrong. 

[MEB]

Pixelmator, Photoshop etc also delete the layer when you press backspace. We are not doing something out of the ordinary here.

[R C-R]

2 hours ago, robinp said:

I really really don’t like deleting the layer via backspace / delete key. It is horribly dangerous. 

Maybe it is just me but the only interactions I consider horribly dangerous are ones that are not immediately obvious & can't be undone. If, for whatever reason, the entire layer I am currently working on is deleted as the result of an action, I am pretty sure I will notice that immediately....

[Alfred]

45 minutes ago, R C-R said:

Maybe it is just me but the only interactions I consider horribly dangerous are ones that are not immediately obvious & can't be undone.

No, it’s not just you!

[firstdefence]

Loving the Santa hat @R C-R 

[Alfred]

9 hours ago, firstdefence said:

Loving the Santa hat @R C-R 

Just as an FYI, @R C-R borrowed my spare elf hat and dyed it!

Nice wreath, BTW. Are you planning to give us a lecture?

 

[R C-R]

2 minutes ago, єℓƒяє∂ said:

Just as an FYI, @R C-R borrowed my spare elf hat and dyed it!

I did no such thing! Elf hats are far too small to fit over my skull, pointy as it is. If I had done that, it would have looked something like this:

[robinp]

On 12/18/2018 at 8:59 PM, MEB said:

Pixelmator, Photoshop etc also delete the layer when you press backspace. We are not doing something out of the ordinary here.

It's interesting because I've never noticed it being a problem in Photoshop etc. I wonder if there is something different about the way it works? Maybe it's just because I was hitting delete so much trying to get the contents of the lasso tool to delete.

Anyway, my point about the keyboard shortcut being the same for deleting the contents of a lasso / marquee and for deleting a layer being peculiar seems valid still. If we are going to have control over shortcuts (which is great) it would seem sensible that two different actions could be controlled with different shortcuts (or disabled individually).

[LES1466]

On 5/6/2017 at 7:49 PM, OlaHaldor said:

I feel really stupid for asking but I can't find anything in the help file or find any menu item for this.

 

It's pretty basic: I make a rectangle marquee selection, and intuitively press DELETE or BACKSPACE. Both will delete the LAYER, not what's inside the selection.  :rolleyes:

 

How do I remove the selected part of the image?

 

(I'm not talking about cropping, just removing pixels from a layer)

 

 

OR how can I copy what's inside the selection and paste into a new layer?

Nothing stupid about this question!!! Its the most simple and obvious thing to do, make a square or shape around something you want to delete and delete it, or edit it. Ive never heard anything so ridiculous that you have to rasterise it first!!! Why??? I dont always want to rasterise something!!! Why are there 2 types of layer??? A pixel layer and an image layer??? I never had to mess around like that in a famous other brand editor. I just really cant get my head around this... This is supposed to be the best alternative to that other software and the fact that you just cant delete something so simple inside a selection is just absolutely stupid!!! 
Just bought this software and am instantly gutted that its not self explanatory and obvious!!! 
Im pressing command and x and the layer keeps disappearing... WTF!!! 

Can I modify my own command so it works to my preferences rather than the step ones put in by the designers of this software??

 

Les

 

 

[walt.farrell]

58 minutes ago, LES1466 said:

Can I modify my own command so it works to my preferences rather than the step ones put in by the designers of this software??

Welcome to the Serif Affinity forums.

You cannot change that behavior. If you continue to use the Affinity applications you will need to get used to Image layers, and how to deal with them.

[robinp]

4 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

If you continue to use the Affinity applications you will need to get used to Image layers, and how to deal with them.

I understand your sentiment of being realistic and providing advice, but part of the point of these forums is to communicate with Serif about problems and feature requests. 

The behaviour as it is currently is terrible. So it’s reasonable to hope that it might be fixed one day. Yes, I realise others might be OK with it as it is, but even after several years I still find it incredibly bad. 

[Jowday]

There is also another option; Serif hires a user experience designer and gives especially Photo a usability overhaul after user testing and massive customer input and adjusts Affinity to what people would expect and prefer. It would certainly lead to more satisfied customers and more creative customers.

A World War II Plane That Kept Crashing Helped Lead to Steve Jobs's Biggest Innovations

https://www.inc.com/minda-zetlin/steve-jobs-boeing-b-17-wwii-paul-fitts-alphonse-chapanis-code-shaping-ergonomics-design.html

[LES1466]

6 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Welcome to the Serif Affinity forums.

You cannot change that behavior. If you continue to use the Affinity applications you will need to get used to Image layers, and how to deal with them.

Thanks for your reply but, I can see people's instant responses, and previous responses to the "PROBLEM", that I am not alone, instantly, with my purchase of the software.... Its one of the main functions that many people when editing a picture, just a quick snip here and edit there.... I only purchased the software yesterday, installed it, tried it and instantly had search on Google because, "why the hell does the whole layer delete when I click command X", or delete on PC".... Even though a very cheap and cost effective, and no stupid subscriptions, like on that other "brand", I am just instantly wound up about using it because of what you have to do with layers, and types of layers.... Whats even worse, this is AP's choice to be like this, its not because of some copy right or something daft that this is like that as; I was trying another brand, aside from the big obvious one and THAT, which I guess I cant name, worked exactly the same as the really big popular one.... In fact, there is only AP that I have ever seen do this silly thing with the layers. 
As for "If you continue to use the Affinity applications you will need to get used to Image layers, and how to deal with them", I seriously don't think I will be mate!! This issue is enough to make me uninstall and get a refund. It really is that big a deal.... You expect certain types of software to act and behave in certain ways and this is one of them. Its a annoying as, every single key on your keyboard doing a completely different thing than you expect it to.... Imagine pressing the delete button and every time you did a new page opened, or every time you pressed the space bar instead of a space it deleted your last 10 edits..... Yes, sounds ridiculous!!! Thats how ridiculous the stupid layer thing is!!! 

I never go on forums and complain about anything.... Until now.... Can you please fix this problem Affinity.... I'm just one of, "imagine how many millions", this could of pissed off and went elsewhere because of something this daft!!! 

 

Les Whingebag!!  

[pferrel]

I have the 2024 version and ran into the same problem, I had to rasterize the layer, which was placed as a jpeg, is the only layer, and the one selected in the layers palette. Then "delete" or cut worked.

None of this nonsense is required in Photoshop!

Also why doesn't shift or command allow you to add to a selection? You have to hit some button in the title bar area? Jeez, this is the most basic of operations in an image editor and so should be dead simple. Ok you might have a more powerful select but hide that not the simple use case. I'm kind of flabbergasted.

 

Edited January 31 by pferrel

[R C-R]

18 minutes ago, pferrel said:

I have the 2024 version and ran into the same problem, I had to rasterize the layer, which was placed as a jpeg, is the only layer, and the one selected in the layers palette. Then "delete" or cut worked.

It is odd that for you neither Delete nor Cut worked on an Image layer, which as has been explained is the expected layer type when placing a bitmap file into an Affinity document. It's odd because for me & I'm reasonably sure for most other users either one works as expected. Are you sure you were working with an Image layer?

22 minutes ago, pferrel said:

Also why doesn't shift or command allow you to add to a selection? You have to hit some button in the title bar area?

By selection, do you mean a 'marching ants' pixel selection or something else? Note that the buttons I think you mean are on the Context toolbar & that there are tooltips displayed in the Status bar at the bottom of the document window that allow you to add or subtract from a selection without having to use the Context Toolbar.

[Komatös]

19 hours ago, pferrel said:

None of this nonsense is required in Photoshop!

 

Photoshop does not work non-destructively either!
In Photoshop, image layers are always rasterised when they are resized; and here is the subtle difference. In Photoshop, in the worst case you have to reload the image layer if, for example, you have reduced the size of an image and realise that the image should be larger after all. In Affinity Photo/Designer/Publisher you scale the image to the original size if necessary, without any loss of quality.

[R C-R]

1 hour ago, Komatös said:

In Affinity Photo/Designer/Publisher you scale the image to the original size if necessary, without any loss of quality.

@pferrel, as the help topic explains, an Image layer retains both the pixel resolution & color space of the placed image. It also retains the original size info, so even if it is placed at a different physical size, it can be returned to the original via the menu in the Context Toolbar, or set to different values. (See https://affinity.help/photo2/en-US.lproj/pages/Media/placeImages.html for more about this.)

Since it is non-destructive, any of this can be changed at any time, even weeks or years later if need be. It is a very useful layer type, well worth learning how it works.

Edited February 1 by R C-R
Added Place help topic reference