Keith Reeder

Why does it seem that the folks with 1 or 2 posts (brand new users, I presume) are more likely to be the ones telling Serif (and all of us) that their products are crap? Why is it that the same users don't seem to want to read a Help file, ask a civilized question in the Forum, or simply accept that this program is not Photoshop? Why do newbies seem to be more likely to rant in ALL CAPS?
 
It gets old, doesn't it?
 
Also - a shout-out to R-C-R for his consistent mild temperament and reasoned responses. We should all be so calm...

Hi Vega,
One reason you may be having problems with this is Affinity Designer is not a paint program. It is a vector creation app that includes a limited number of pixel based ('paint') features that can be used with rasterized (also known as bitmapped) images. Raster & vector formats have very different properties, which is why Affinity Designer offers separate Personas for working with vector (Draw) & raster (Pixel) objects.
 
Understanding their differences is fundamental to understanding how AD works & why it is designed as it is. Once you get that out of the way, the rest should be much easier.  :)

I know it is a hybrid app. My point is if someone is not aware of the differences between vector & raster based items, then a lot of how it works will seem illogical & be very difficult to understand. Good examples of that are the difference between pixel & vector brushes, & why some tools are available only in one Persona but not the other.

Oval, "hopefully" is not a guarantee or promise of anything. As for "image" they have been very forthright in explaining why the delays have been occurring & continue to keep us informed about that. What other commercial software developer does that?

I have enough trouble dealing with my own issues to take on the responsibility of caring about another's "image."

Even if that were true, who cares? When one of us starts paying the bills at Serif we can call the shots.
 
Just use something else and revisit APub if and when it ever comes to beta/market. That is unless ya think all the cajoling will somehow persuade Serif to change course (rhetorical because it ain't gonna happen).

I don't dispute that it would be a useful thing to have, but my point is that you seem to expect that it should already have this ability, and that's clearly not Serif's current design ambition.
 
There are other Raw processing priorities that Photo needs to square away before I'd argue there's a case for bulk Raw conversion capability:
 
1 Vastly improved conversion speed. At the moment it takes many users tens of seconds to just open one Raw file in the Develop Persona: this is clearly something that need to addressed and significantly improved upon before we can speak seriously about batch-converting hundreds of files; and
 
2 Conversion quality. Photo's conversions aren't bad, but they're a very long way from being a match for established converters like Photo Ninja and Capture One: it'd be madness for Serif to concentrate limited development resources on creating a batch conversion function before its conversion results match those of current conversion solutions.
 
So - as I say in the reply above - call this a feature request, but don't be surprised that it's not currently part of Serif's design intentions for Photo.

I think 10 days is plenty of time if you're already comfortable with photo editing.  On the other hand, if you're new to it it's a lot to take in.  My recommendation would be to watch a couple of the introductory videos on YouTube to get past the initial hurdle of not knowing where to start.  "Drippycat" has produced some very good ones - they assume little or no experience and are aimed at "ordinary" snappers rather than people who can't press the shutter without working out the hyperfocal distance to 5 decimal places. 

Are you a software developer, or are you just guessing? :unsure:
 
 
Whether you charge by the hour or not (or even if you don't charge at all) makes no difference to the amount of time that this useful feature would save! ;)

I think the title for this thread is wrong, it should be "Please add the ability to save workspaces" as you can already customise it. I too would like the feature, but it isn't something that is pressing as I only use Affinity stuff on one computer and so once I rearrange things, they stay that way. While it would be nice to have, there are other things more pressing. 
 
Hokusai

I can't speak for the company but this just my view.
 
You know  back in the day  people complained about  having to pay for for software for their individual OS and then complained that they had to pay twice for upgrades for two different operating systems. Companies like Adobe said hey we got a great answer to solve your problems and your gonna love it! We sell you the license to use the software and you never have pay to own the software and we call it a subscription. Then you can run your software on any computer you want. Well look where that lead us... lol
 
Correct me if I am wrong: Software is still a product that not tangible like hardware but still tangible for the what its code produces. I guess this why they call it a digital product. I am assuming much of the code and functionality of the coding required is still bonded by the agreement of the OS ( as in Operating system - Apple, linux, Microsoft Android, IOS, and etc.)  it utilizes to function. The code requirements is different for each OS differs therefore, making the software product actually two different products. The time it takes to code and the physical resources required for each come at a cost and that cost is tied into the value and price point of the product.  So, in my opinion and this just my opinion so don't  hunt me down to burn me, but it seems to me giving away products that go cross more operating systems would be costly and bad business for a company. I own both mac and PC Platform and if the cost of this application was to expensive I would probably make on a decision on wich OS is most important for me to run this software on. 
 
I mean its a debatable topic, but personally I really don't want to go back to a subscription and I only want to pay for the about as much of application functionality as I need. When  the IOS version of it hits my IPAD pro I will buy that version too but I wont be buying a version for Another tablet operating system. 
 
-Ramble 2 cents  completed lol

That's clearly not what he said. 
 
It is a fact that Mac OS is a far more locked-down, closed - limited - environment than Linux.
 
No debating that, and it's true of Windows, too.

Even if Linux desktop was growing "extremely fast" (and I don't think your link proves that at all), what proportion of that growth involves photographers? And of that number, how big a subset is actually interested in changing their current solution? And of that subset, how many would actually buy Affinity Photo?
 
I'm not anti-Linux: I've got a couple of ex Windows laptops that I've had Linux on for years, and I dabble regularly: but I'm a photographer first, and an OS fanboy not at all (I also have devices which use Android and Chrome OS, and appreciate them all): but I use what I need to use to achieve what I want to achieve. 
 
And for me, that means Windows when it comes to photography.
 
It strikes me as utter madness that anyone would wear the hair-shirt of OS zealotry to the extent that they would choose to deny themselves the benefits of Photo simply because of their self-inflicted hang-ups about the OS' on which Photo works.
 
What's your priority? An efficient, effective photography workflow which includes Affinity Photo? 
 
Or a masochistic obsession with wilfully denying yourself what you clearly want - which is Photo - simply because you're unwilling to accept the the reality of the situation, and refuse to use an operating system which will give you access to Photo?
 
Here's the thing. The very fact that some of you will not use Photo unless it's on your narrow terms sends a really clear message that you're not really interested in Photo per se, but in winning an argument about operating systems.
 
That screams "no real market", to me...

https://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=8&qpcustomd=0
 
(According to the same site posted... or we could find a new meaning for "extremely fast" (I've seen that , ehm, fast growth since my first experiences with that OS in early 90s...). Because if 2.27 % is huge ...What adjective could we use for the 91,41 % of Windows ? Edit: A 2 % of a big number IS a big number. My point is that with that proportion, makes a lot of sense that a small company does focus on what have more chances of sells... my 2c. )
 
PD: I never am very sure to trust at all these stats sites... it all depends on how they took their measures and data, that counting on not there being some interests or third party companies gaming the system. Usually mostly depends on the type of users from which they are collecting the data, and how they are doing it.
 
 
That said, sometimes for a particular product a niche can be extremely profitable. But I guess they'd need some full proof of that in their case (a generic statement and the best intention is not anything solid), which is really difficult to know beforehand. At least, something, as is such a big risk. Something like that can sink a company.

The issue is...time and resources.  The way you are describing it sounds as if it were all about just posting a blog article explaining the possible project asking people to donate. A crowd funding campaign is a constant work of promotion, creation of marketing material, and most of all, showing a proof of concept, so, doing a a very solid part of the project. At least a functional alpha prototype ! Getting 500k without doing that? :o ... I would be amazed... Even more, a quite advanced stage of the project. You need resources and time, employees' hours for making the promotion material, and also for the prototype or project till certain stage, for people to actually care for backing... The company is already crushed with milestones, with a small team, from what I could read in an old post. (and many others, later on)
 
Unless you mean just making a blank, empty campaign, not doing anything else than the initial post/explanation. And get 500k so ? Well nothing is impossible, could happen. Still, I've seen too many campaigns failing even doing the best effort. And BTW, nothing beats working in several ones, as talking is cheap (hey, not meaning it harshly neither directed to you ;) , is a figure of speech. ), but once working for one, you face a lot of issues. The people is also very variable in trends and at the time to give feedback, and this is an added issue, we suffered that...
 
The possibility always exists, of course. 
 
But then... in case it fails....how would that look? Not to you and me, or any other geek user.  But to the mass, the global opinion. You seem to see no risk neither potential loss.. Any failure is dangerous (been at SEO and marketing for a bunch of years)... If the crowdfunding gets nothing near to the 500k, that's bad promo for the whole Affinity (IMO ! )...  Anyway, I am not saying it's 100% impossible.
 
Then there's another bad side, more in the technical side (in case the campaign is successful, or... even quite before). We get to find out the possible issues just casually, thinking randomly, but am sure they know these very well, since quite long. Even if they don't do nothing until funded, just the announcement, you need at least some research, some rough prototype (of an app as complex and deep as AP and AD are! ) to actually know beforehand that the code base "could" be translated to Linux flawlessly. Otherwise, it could be , again, bad promo for Affinity. Google results bad promo of any product is to be avoided by any company...IE : Imagine the case... people donate, and all, and then all the hassle of telling the backers that the project is not doable, once campaign ended successfully, after finally doing a real prototype, as the systems do not translate well in terms of graphic libraries, or that the engine is not very compatible with Linux code. Or there do not exist certain kind of graphic libraries in Linux, or not performing at the level required, or not as complete as in Mac or Win, as simply has not been the need or focus of anyone.  Great selling slogan for the whole A. line. Heck, even more. Not every one can code in every OS. I've worked very long years inside software (be it applications and games, decades) and found out programmers (seen by the graphics guy, externally) tend to be more based on a particular system. Specially at very high end matters. (IE, Windows graphic libraries, people knowing deeply how to handle kernel stuff of a certain OS, etc). maybe that's not a problem for them, at all (I don't know). But what i experienced is they tend to specialize in an area. AND... not easy to find the ones you need, with the specific experience you need, meaning pro veterans in that specific matter.
 
The point also is: if was that easy (the 500k whole thing and  port all to Linux).. Don't you think they would have made so already ? I mean, if it is all advantages... they have been with the affinity line for a while.. Wouldn't have we already see at least an announcement? Not only we haven't, they have said they are not planing even something like that. So, IMO, cut them some slack, maybe they know what they are doing...   :)
 
And I insist am not anti-Linux. Quite the opposite. And if it 'd be as simple as to put a campaign title and wait for the backers to rain, and reach 500k in 28 days, and then, profit for decades of linux versions! hey, then am all for it. I just am not too fond of basing projects in a not 100% realistic base. You can destroy a company or team if you do it wrong...

Even more, is the matter of the user base. They probably can't be sure if numbers like that (2.27 % against a 91.4 % of Windows (even if that data could be very wrong) ) can make it worth a Linux version in the long run. Yep, you manage magically to pull everything and even develop the whole line in Linux. Can you imagine the big issue if then there are note enough sales to maintain that over time, over the years ?  Not only the culture of free of charge is well installed in Linux (a lot of Linux users are ready to pay for good applications, I know... but how's that % ? ) , is the other fact that over  that already complex perspective, there are already great 2D products in Linux, very, very good, I know them well (Krita, Inkscape, MyPaint, Sk1, Scribus, Gimp, etc) . Yet another risk.
 
Indeed...Who knows. Maybe the main reason is not even related to the campaign matter. I worked at a company developing a pair of applications as its main focus (less complex!). And probably the number of seasoned professional dedicated to developing it was close to identical. Support of a different OS takes the focus of a great key developer, (or a team) at least. Being resources medium/small (I suspect mostly small), they probably know it wouldn't be sustainable over the time, being such a time eater, then yep, would be a high risk/error.
 
My very personal 2c... ---> They'd better off first take some solid gained territory to the huge big names dominating by now the field (and in only Mac/Win). Once solidly installed there, Publisher also released, so you get a kind of a pro suite at a very attractive purchasing option, you are established, can after the good success/impact get new ambitions/fronts, like (but not necessarily that) a Linux version... (But Adobe PS or Max, they never did, and man, are they profitable... You need to convince the men and women (investors, marketing experts, etc) handling the numbers...)
 
My very fear is that they'd end up loosing strength and capability to deliver fast (and time is key...) diverting so much the resources....
 
As always, I could be completely wrong in every detail, though.

I understand people want to add a lot of cool and nice new features.
I say it's time to make only two requests: stability and performance.
 
I know devs are already working in this area, but here's the problem.
They have been working on improving in those two areas for months now, at least on the Windows side (that's how long I have been following the developments).
Nonetheless, there have been requests to add this or that thing, and part of these requests have been filled, taking out precious time to improve in the two main areas above.
Now, I don't know how many of the frequenters here are using (or trying to use) Affinity's products in a professional production environment.
I'm personally trying and when it comes to work fast and get things done, colored layers, pen's improvement or whatever other request is filling these forums, don't matter one single bit. What really matters is: working fast (hence a fast program that can keep up) and stability.
It's like a building's foundation, without it adding windows, doors and so on, it's like building on top of a precarious wire frame.
 
I never complained about stability and performance, and I'm not certainly starting now. I know it takes time and lot of work. But since people keep requesting new features and, one way or another, a part of these have to be taken into account, this can only slow down other areas.
 
Let's get Affinity Photo and Designer working with no major issues first, then let's embellish it.
 
This comes after hours spent working (especially with Photo) and getting consistent crashes, odd behavior (my other post Brush doesn't work) and being forced to either restart Photo or re-open the documents. I know I have to deal with this, there are many reasons why this has to be expected (these are young software, resources are limited and that's all fine, especially considered how much I spent for them!). But when I read to add this or that other feature when the programs are not even stable and fast yet, it really sounds counter intuitive.
 
So, I would personally take a break, let them take AP&AD to a more stable stage, and then let's make our requests again.

If you can wait a (little?) while, Serif is working on its own DAM/cataloguing/file management solution.

Hi DC,
 
note that I didn't actually say "proper" DAM (although that would depend on personal requirements anyway) but in Windows Explorer, one can display pretty much any Exif or IPTC metadata tag attached to an image file:
 

 
It follows that once you have access to these data (this isn't remotely an exhaustive list of the headings available - you can display IPTC notes too, for example) it is a simple matter to use the search in Win Explorer to (for example) find all of the files processed by Photo Ninja; or all the 5-star rated images (you can actually rate your images from within, and with, Explorer); or every image taken with my Canon 7D Mk II; or all the files of 1000 ISO; or all the files tagged in the metadata with the word "eagle"; and so on.
 
What can be done is pretty much only limited by the imagination of the user; and for my DAM requirements (which may or may not be simpler than those of other photographers) this approach (tweaked a bit to play in Excel and VBA as a one-stop control layer over this functionality) it works every bit as well as commercial offerings.
 
To display these tags, simply right-click on the column header and select "More..." from the context menu.

That's because you're not thinking about Lightroom in the right way.
 
Although some people use it this way (and are severely limiting themselves), it was never originally intended as a one-stop workflow solution: from v1 the idea was to use it for your conversion and basic adjustments and then hand off further post-processing to PhotoShop or similar solution, pushing a lossless-format converted file to the pixel editor.
 
The fact that Lightroom's adjustment capabilities have been substantially increased over the years doesn't change the logic here: and you can do this right now, even if you decide to drop Lightroom - just export your files as full-sized 16 bit tiffs, or whatever other format you want to use, then you can do whatever you want with them in Photo, going forward.
 
Photo is analogous to PhotoShop, not Lightroom.
 
 
You "rent" pretty much any software, including Photo. All you're granted is permission to use it, and you no more "own" Photo than you do Lightroom, and if you want to stay current on an ongoing basis, you'll be giving money to Serif for the long haul, just as you would Adobe:
 
https://affinity.serif.com/en-gb/license/
 

Agreed - I've had more than one experience of someone insisting they "need" a DAM, when all they actually needed is a proper understanding of what their OS can do for them.
 
(Not saying that's true of DC, but it's a conversation I've had quite a lot...)

I totally agree Keith
 
For me the MAC OS keeps me away from Adobe products completely and for me at least measures up to LR.
 
I would be interested DC what specific features you consider to be included within a 'proper' DAM that the Windows & MAC OS (Plus of course AP) can't do? I am very happy to be persuaded otherwise :)
 
Cheers

Yep, you can do the same in Windows - and (if it's your thing - it is mine) - you can also do a lot of Exif/IPTC-based management too, as Windows can display/sort/search by pretty much any Exif or IPTC field you can think of..

Impossible for anyone else to answer that for you, Rowena (thought doubtless people will try) because only you know what you need from an image editor.
 
I will say that for my purposes - as a bird/wildlife/motor sport photographer - Photo does everything I need, even though I'm a big fan of PhotoShop.
 
But whether my experience chimes with your needs - who knows?

This - let's have the bugs, performance and plugin compatibility issues sorted out first...

An in-Affinity DAM/cataloguing solution won't help with that any more than would sorting "like" files into a folder using your computer OS, and then bulk processing the files in that folder...