Does anyone here have access to the Pantone metallic chips book please?

[William Overington]

Does anyone here have access to the Pantone metallic chips book please?

https://www.pantone.com/uk/en/metallic-chips-book

If so, could you possibly say something about the general look of Pantone metallic inks when printed please?

For example, is the effect almost like a mirror, or is it more like a gold effect car, not some gold plated car out of a movie or the like, one of the metallic cars that are production models in everyday use. Is the effect like gold leaf on a manuscript, or is it more like the gold blocking on the spine of a book?

Does the range include gold, silver, bronze and copper please?

If so, could you possibly quote a few numbers please so that I can look at them in Affinity Designer please and try to include them in some experimental artwork?

William

[firstdefence]

From some of the images online they look more satin than gloss, so closer to the sheen of gold leaf.

[William Overington]

On 6/2/2021 at 12:04 PM, firstdefence said:

From some of the images online they look more satin than gloss, so closer to the sheen of gold leaf.

 

Thank you.

From the image I found that Pantone 8363 C is a gold colour. It is the one next to the thumb in the picture.

Here is a jpg using Pantone 8363 C.

William

 

[Alfred]

11 minutes ago, William Overington said:

From the image I found that Pantone 8363 C is a gold colour. It is the one next to the thumb in the picture.

Here is a jpg using Pantone 8363 C.

That looks distinctly green on my screen! (The background to your default ‘W’ avatar looks closer to a gold colour than that JPEG.)

<off-topic>
You can change your avatar here.
</off-topic>

[William Overington]

2 minutes ago, Alfred said:

That looks distinctly green on my screen! (The background to your default ‘W’ avatar looks closer to a gold colour than that JPEG.)

 

Green!?

William

 

[walt.farrell]

22 minutes ago, William Overington said:

Green!?

Yes.

[William Overington]

1 minute ago, walt.farrell said:

Yes.

Oh!

William

[thomaso]

On 6/3/2021 at 2:52 PM, William Overington said:

Green!?

Wouldn't a comparison on your screen show a difference, regardless of perfect calibration? Like so, do you see here a difference …?

On 6/2/2021 at 10:59 AM, William Overington said:

is the effect almost like a mirror,

Inks for/on paper print are always less glossy than for other surfaces (like RAL etc) but can get an additional clear, glossy varnish printed as separate color. Vice versa a satin varnish can reduce the shinyness of a glossy surface.

If you want a mirror effect then not ink printing but foil "printing" (hot stamping) works better. Depending on the foil it is more reflective than ink. Different to ink hot foil print can't get rasterized and so it doesn't do halftone or gradients.

[Alfred]

[Alfred]

28 minutes ago, thomaso said:

If you want a mirror effect then not ink printing but foil "printing" (hot stamping) works better. Depending on the foil it is more reflective than ink. Different to ink hot foil print can't get rasterized and so it doesn't do halfone or gradients.

I suggested a particular kind of hot foiling in another recent thread, although for some reason I didn’t think to refer to it by that commonly used term.

 

[thomaso]

1 hour ago, Alfred said:

refer to it by that commonly used term.

I guess I lack in proper english terms and didn't look it up in a dictionary. The german would be "UV-Lack" and "Heißfolienprägung".

I know your sample in the linked topic also in a version for do-it-yourself at home. In small foil rolls (~5 cm width) and to either apply with an according machine (an electrically heated rubber roll with a handle) or with an iron.

@William Overington, concerning greeting cards & low budget this manual foil option could be the most satisfying for your needs. Though it is manually tricky if you want to apply it to small areas only and not just as stripes. Then the industrial applying method is more suitable. – (click to enlarge:)

[Alfred]

9 minutes ago, thomaso said:

I guess I lack in proper english terms

On the contrary, Thomas! I was acknowledging that the term you used is not only proper English but also commonly used, leading me to wonder why I didn’t use it in the post that I quoted.

[firstdefence]

I think part of the problem with the Pantone metallic 8363 is, it's an RGB version of Pantone metallic 8363 but in all likelihood the Pantone colour wouldn't be printed like that. RGB and CMYK are approximations of the Pantone colour not the colour the Pantone metallic ink would produce. 

[William Overington]

19 hours ago, William Overington said:

Green!?

William

 

https://modeleng.proboards.com/thread/11835/stroudleys-improved-engine-green

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-idIaBajtc

William

 

[firstdefence]

21 hours ago, William Overington said:

https://modeleng.proboards.com/thread/11835/stroudleys-improved-engine-green

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-idIaBajtc

William

 

Interesting article. In all probability Shroudley had Protanopia or Protanomaly...

Protanopia

 

Protanomaly

[William Overington]

@firstdefence Thank you.

https://www.bardoptical.com/color-blindness-protanopia/

William

 

[William Overington]

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/colour-vision-deficiency/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ishihara_test

William

 

[William Overington]

Here is a copy of the second stage of development of an image using Pantone 8363.

The image is from page 8 of the following thread.

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/138654-artwork-for-greetings-cards/

As the background is white, clicking on the image shows the whole design more clearly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

William

 

[lepr]

19 minutes ago, William Overington said:

Pantone 8363

Some people seem to think it looks green when simulated on a display, but it looks a dirty yellow to me.

[thomaso]

49 minutes ago, William Overington said:

the second stage of development of an image using Pantone 8363.

Not sure if I understand your goal. If it is to simulate a golden ink or foil as an reflective or glossy surface, you could support such an impression by varying brightness in this golden area, e.g. as gradient. Otherwise, as long the area has a plain, straight color only then there is nothing which will make us see, think or feel "gold". Just because it shows only its hue, saturation and brightness (yellow, brownish, greenish etc). But metal or any reflective surface reacts with the light's / viewer's angle + with colors in its surrounding, the light source included.

Such a simulating gradient can have different complexity. The simpliest is just 2 colors, color X to a brighter tint of X. Such is often used to make a software button or a photo of a screen (e.g. smart phone) appear glossy. A simle gradient in the sake not to disturb the actual button or product details.

The gradient can also have different hues (greenish, reddish) and midpoints of different brightness (white). But it will be a simulation only. That's why in catalogs often mirrors don't look like mirrors – they may have a gradient but lack in a surrounding on their surface.

[R C-R]

2 hours ago, thomaso said:

Not sure if I understand your goal.

I definitely do not. An actual reflective surface reflects light from the environment, so at best a simulation would show what it looked like in just one environment & only when viewed from one angle.

[thomaso]

2 minutes ago, R C-R said:

so at best a simulation would show what it looked like in just one environment & only when viewed from one angle.

… whereas "one" (any?) can vary in real live showing its gloss (reflectance) more or less or even almost not at all – the simulation, because it is static (does not change with angle etc), must be a specific "one" which literally illustrates the gloss.

 

.

 

 

[William Overington]

19 minutes ago, R C-R said:

I definitely do not. An actual reflective surface reflects light from the environment, so at best a simulation would show what it looked like in just one environment & only when viewed from one angle.

In the artwork for greetings card thread to which I provided a link, there are artwork designs that I have produced.

I found a business that supplies personalized greetings cards. There are various such businesses: many f them supply a glossy card. The business I use supplies them matt.

There are various templates available to use. Some have a fixed image, and one just changes the greeting on the inside using text. Yet others allow one to customize the front of the card, mostly by adding one or more photographs to a preset template. Yet two of those templates allow total customizatiom using a full field image - one portrait format, one landscape format.

Although the business advertise it all as photographs, the image does not actually need to be a photograph, as long as it is a jpg file that their system can treat in the same was as a photograph. Their staff have advised me on what I needed to do.

Thus far I have got cards printed for eight different pieces of artwork. Seven ar now framed using frames that I get delivered with the grocery.  The eighth has been received here and is awaiting framing. I already have the frame.

The artwork is based on things that I have produced in electronic format over the years. Some relate to one of my inventions.

I suppose it is what is termed 'outsider art'. I have not trained as an artist, I do not need to convince anyone that my artwork is worth printing. As long as the image is legal and I pay the fee, the image is printed for me.

The present image is a confluence of several topics. I am hoping to produce a pdf, publish it on the web, and legal-deposit it with The British Library, then reference that legal deposit in the greeting text of the printed CMYK card.

William

 

[R C-R]

I think you need to contact the British Library & find out what they suggest you do, particularly about any design that in physical form cannot be accurately reproduced in electronic form.

[William Overington]

7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

I think you need to contact the British Library & find out what they suggest you do, particularly about any design that in physical form cannot be accurately reproduced in electronic form.

Can you clarify that please, as I was thinking that as the pdf file would contain the Pantone 8363 information that that would do the job.

I am thinking that at a later date that file could be use to produce the desired metallic print.

William