can't horiz flip filled shape

[Wordsnob]

Hi, I don't get to use my software very often to learn the ins and outs.
I drew and filled a shape and want to see a mirror image of it. When I flip it, the colour disappears, and it won't let me re-fill the shape which seems to be still there. It's like flipping a piece of paper over. Blank!

I've read the fill modes lesson and looked for tutorials, but haven't found this issue. 

Thanks in advance if anyone can clue me in.
 

[R C-R]

Which Affinity app & version are you using?

How specifically are you trying to flip it horizontally?

What kind of shape did you create using what tool to do so?

[Wordsnob]

8 minutes ago, R C-R said:

Which Affinity app & version are you using?

How specifically are you trying to flip it horizontally?

What kind of shape did you create using what tool to do so?

Sorry, brain dead today. ADesigner 2.

Please see attached. The shape I flipped horizontally is to the right, but invisible.

I used the rectangle & rounded 2 corners to make a leaf. 

I've tried the blue & grey triangle icons for flip h & flip v.

Thank you

leaf flip horiz.afdesign

[Return]

After flipping press the add button and the color will be there.
As to why, I don't know.
 

 

 

[Wordsnob]

Oh my god! Things like this just slay me.

I should have asked the forum sooner, but try to DIY as much as I can.

Thanks very much. I owe you a cyber case of whatever your toxin of choice is!

[Return]

I like to push some buttons😁
So I did.

[R C-R]

42 minutes ago, Return said:

As to why, I don't know.

Has to be a bug, right? Maybe something to do with the new Auto-select feature because when I disable that & select the two objects clicking anywhere else does not deselect them -- it's stuck until I (for instance) select the Node Tool & then click somewhere else to deselect those objects?

[Wordsnob]

"feature", LOL. 
Bug: agree.

[firstdefence]

Something else happens with this document, If I use the nested object technique to accurately flip the duplicated object it displaces the triangle, I'll mention the steps and maybe this will help debugging it.

1. For ease of flipping I nest the triangle in the object.
2. I create a vertical guide, snapping it to the top right node of the original object.
3. I duplicate the original object with the nested triangle.
4. With the pen tool, I draw a simple curve line/path vertically using the guide to snap to, (This is a easy method of flipping something accurately away from the original)  
5. I nest the duplicate object under the curve line/path
6. I rotate the curve line 180º and then flip Vertically (In the Transform panel it reads 90º and after rotating it will read -90º)
7. I remove the duplicated object from the curve line so hierarchically it's a parent layer.
8. I use @Return Add solution to bring the fill back and notice there is no triangle.

The triangle has been displaced and it is much larger but still nested in the object.

[GarryP]

8 hours ago, R C-R said:

Has to be a bug, right?

I would say so, unless I’m missing some very important information.

Try rotating the shape. If you use the Layer menu Rotation functionality the same ‘fill disappearing’ problem sometimes happens but rotating with the rotation handle has some interesting results.

Also, try changing the stroke width.

See attached video for an example of both.

[NathanC]

I do agree with the consensus that this is a bug with the curve fill, so I'll be logging this with the developers.

@Wordsnob How did you go about creating this curve originally, was it done from scratch with the pen tool or did it start out as a shape which was converted to curves and manipulated the nodes?

@Return's workaround doesn't work for me in the latest beta which is also a concern.

[Return]

@NathanC I could not do my trick on the beta 2.2.01903 either.

There's another solution though;
Copy the original.
Edit>Paste Special>Scalable Vector Graphics.

Make sure the "Copy items as SVG is ticked in the settings.
 

[Pšenda]

Transparent Tool

Edit: The problem with Affinity is that the Layers panel doesn't show the use of the Transparent or Gradient Tool on the layer.

After delete Transparent Tool.

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Pšenda

[Return]

Ah yes.
I don't use the transparency tool, don't even have it on my toolbar so didn't think of that.
I usually use the fill/gradient tool for transparency.
I always thought these 2 tools were connected.
One applying only transparency and the other color/bitmaps/gradients and transparency.
 

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, Pšenda said:

Transparent Tool

Nice catch - that accounts for both of the problems that I was seeing.

I agree that it might be nice if use of the Transparency Tool or Gradient Tool on a layer was shown somewhere in the UI. It would certainly have helped on this occasion.

[Return]

35 minutes ago, GarryP said:

I agree that it might be nice if use of the Transparency Tool or Gradient Tool on a layer was shown somewhere in the UI. It would certainly have helped on this occasion.

It could be represented like the brush icon in the layers panel.
This could also be when using the fill/gradient tool.
And just like the brush button clicked to open the designated tool options.
 

[GarryP]

14 minutes ago, Return said:

It could be represented like the brush icon in the layers panel.

Sounds good to me (but with icons to ‘match’ the FX and Lock icons).
I’m pretty sure that this has been requested before.

It might also be nice if this sort of thing was ‘rolled up’ with another request – which has also been made before, somewhere in the forums – to also show an icon if the layer’s Blend Options are non-default – another good tool for problem diagnosis.

(Having said that though, that gives six possible icons, which may be too many to have in a row, so maybe they could be stacked in a little 3×2 grid. I’m sure there will be a good way to do it.)

[Pšenda]

1 hour ago, GarryP said:

I agree that it might be nice if use of the Transparency Tool or Gradient Tool on a layer was shown somewhere in the UI. It would certainly have helped on this occasion.

This is a big shortcoming of the Layers panel concept. The only way to find out the use of the Transparency and Gradient Tool (as well as the change of Opacity, Blend mode and Blend Range) is to click through these tools/options for each layer in turn, if they are not set by chance. And imagine opening this document in APhoto (for example via Edit In...), which doesn't even have a Transparency Tool, so you'll never come find this problem and even fix it.

 

1 hour ago, GarryP said:

that accounts for both of the problems that I was seeing

However, it still looks like a "bug", because the rotation/flip of the layer with the applied Transparency tool should not have such an effect.

[Pšenda]

12 minutes ago, GarryP said:

that gives six possible icons

Personally, I would like a "cogwheel" (like the Blend options) which, when clicked, displays a list of applied adjustments (Opacity, Blend Mode, Blend range, Transparency tool, Gradient tool). Either something like list in fx or just a bar (context menu) with icons.

Edit: and Fill Opacity in Fx, which does not set the fx icon!

Edited July 27, 2023 by Pšenda

[GarryP]

10 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

And imagine opening this document in APhoto (for example via Edit In...), which doesn't even have a Transparency Tool, so you'll never come find this problem or even fix it.

That sounds like another good reason for having the icon, even if the user can’t do much about it if they don’t have Designer or Publisher. (Or if they can it’s probably not an ‘easy fix’, I'd have to think about it.)

11 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

However, it still looks like a "bug", because the rotation/flip of the layer with the applied Transparency tool should not have such an effect.

Yeah, it looks like the transparency has somehow become ‘semi-detached’ from the layer but still sort of there. (I think I vaguely remember having this kind problem myself a while back but I could just delete the layer and start again so it wasn’t too much of a problem in that case – I will have assumed that I did something wrong.)

[Return]

12 minutes ago, GarryP said:

but with icons to ‘match’ the FX and Lock icons

Was just a quick mockup😉
The cogwheel is a good option as it now is just one button above the layers but you can apply it to all layers except masks.
And it has its own panel where there is plenty of room to add such features.
At least Serif should think of a way to make things show a bit better to what is used on a given layer whether it's;
Transparency, fill type, blend range, fill opacity, brush, style, etc.

[Pšenda]

5 minutes ago, GarryP said:

even if the user can’t do much about it if they don’t have Designer or Publisher

If the application of the Transparency tool (list/icons of applied tools and modifications/adjustments) were displayed in the Layers pane, this tool could be launched after selecting/clicking on the relevant item/icon. APhoto has the Transparency tool buildin, because it can apply this effect to the layer.

[v_kyr]

39 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

This is a big shortcoming of the Layers panel concept. The only way to find out the use of the Transparency and Gradient Tool (as well as the change of Opacity, Blend mode and Blend Range) is to click through these tools/options for each layer in turn, if they are not set by chance. And imagine opening this document in APhoto (for example via Edit In...), which doesn't even have a Transparency Tool, so you'll never come find this problem and even fix it.

Well the layers panel visual icon indication concept has it's limitations here. It would probably make more sense to have the ability and an option, for selecting a layer and then on demand popup an info list of all the applied attribute settings for that layer.

[Pšenda]

40 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

Well the layers panel visual icon indication concept has it's limitations here. It would probably make more sense to have the ability and an option, for selecting a layer and then on demand popup an info list of all the applied attribute settings for that layer.

But if you have thousands of layers, finding the right layer will mean thousands of clicks. The visual marking of the layer in which there is something "non-standard/non-default" is thus much easier.
For example, in my IDE, the non-standard/non-default option is marked with bold versus non-bold text.

It is thus very easy and fast to find out the items that have been modified - just swipe the panel with your eyes.

[v_kyr]

10 minutes ago, Pšenda said:

But if you have thousands of layers, finding the right layer will mean thousands of clicks. The visual marking of the layer in which there is something "non-standard/non-default" is thus much easier. ...

What has the finding of a specific layer, instead with the aspect of showing up on demand some concrete selected layer's related attributes information to do here? - That are functionality wise then two different pairs of shoes. - In any better IDE with some build-in UI builder and therein some created project with a setup of many nested structured widgets (let's say on some panel etc.), you can traverse to the widget of your interest and inspect it's applied option settings.