Affininity photo opening raw files too dark

[chubbycherub]

Hello, I didn't find anything on this in the forum. I shoot with a Canon R5 in raw. When I open the raw file in affinity photo, it opens too dark and any adjustments I make end up way too bright when developed. Is there a fix? Also you only have 2 lens profiles for RF lenses?

The image is of the jpeg before any edits and the raw file open in affinity.

[NotMyFault]

54 minutes ago, chubbycherub said:

Hello, I didn't find anything on this in the forum. I shoot with a Canon R5 in raw. When I open the raw file in affinity photo, it opens too dark and any adjustments I make end up way too bright when developed. Is there a fix? Also you only have 2 lens profiles for RF lenses?

The image is of the jpeg before any edits and the raw file open in affinity.

 

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Sorry to hear about your issue.

There are 3 possible reasons:

1. Develop Assistant, "Exposure Bias" and "Apply Tone Curve" might cause this issue. Try different settings. If happy, you can save them as default in Affinity Photo.
   https://affinity.help/photo/English.lproj/pages/Raw/raw.html#anchor_assistant
    
2. Affinity Apps cannot read the "Picture Profiles" used by Canon cameras and Canon DPP software. If you set a picture profile in Camera or by "Profile Editor" App from Canon, the settings will be used to create a JPG in Camera, but ignored by Affinity.
    
3. As the R5 is a relatively new model, with frequent firmware updates by Canon which could change the RAW format, Affinity could stay a little behind interpreting new features correctly.

Regarding Lens Profiles, Affinity simply uses the free Lensfun library which seems to run out of volunteers uploading new profiles. New Affinity Releases will include what is available at the time of Photo release. You may try to update manually any time later, or measure you lens and create your own profiles.

[v_kyr]

The Affinity Canon R5 libraw support is relatively new in APh (as can be seen here) and might not be perfectly adjusted yet. - If you are using APh on a Mac, you can alternatively try the Apple RAW engine in APh (switchable in the Develop Assistant) which supports the Canon R5 since >= MacOS BigSur.

[Jörn Reppenhagen]

Plus, a JPG usually gets heavily processed in-camera before saving. Usually it takes quite some effort making a RAW look as good as the JPG. That's why I always set my camera to save RAW and JPG - to get a JPG I can use immediately, and a RAW I can really play with.

You've got some harsh contrasts in your image, pure white to pure black. For not overexposing, the shadows need to become quite dark in the RAW. But still, it seems to be a bit overdone.

If you post the original RAW file, we could check and compare the RAW development with other RAW converters.

Comparing highly processed JPGs and pristine RAWs just doesn't work.

[chubbycherub]

Yeah mine is set to both too but using affinity properly is still ideal. I've been using the Canon software and that seems to be decent for now until Affinity gets it together. And some of these lenses have been out over 2 years. Odd that they aren't added to the program.

[v_kyr]

14 minutes ago, chubbycherub said:

And some of these lenses have been out over 2 years. Odd that they aren't added to the program.

AFAI recall (if it hasn't changed in the meantime) Affinity Photo uses the lens datas from Lensfun.

[Alfred]

1 hour ago, v_kyr said:

Affinity Photo uses the lens datas from Lensfun

It does indeed, as confirmed recently here:

 

[v_kyr]

1 hour ago, Alfred said:

It does indeed, as confirmed recently here:

You can find out easily by looking into the apps supplied/dependent libs and resources, or via using some third party tools like DIE etc.

[Majadero]

Looks like a linear gamma response, probably no gamma curve ready for that camera.

[ronwise]

This is not an issue with only new cameras. I'm dealing with the same frustration with an X-Pro1, X-T2 and all of my lenses. I don't know what the deal is with Affinity and RAW files but I'm really disappointed. Everything I shoot is easily needing 1+ stop boost in exposure. 

[Ron P.]

Welcome @ronwise to the forums,

In the Assistant Manager, there's two settings that are probably disabled. The Tone Curve and Export Bias. Enable those, and your RAW images should open lighter.

From the Affinity Photo Online Help

Quote

To change initial develop settings:

On the Toolbar, do the following:

1. Click the Develop Assistant to open its settings dialog.
2. Choose from the following settings:
   • Lens corrections: Enable or disable automatic lens correction for supported camera lens profiles. Lens profiles are installed with the app. If a camera is not included (perhaps a new model), you can include it by adding its profile—a downloaded Lensfun XML file or Adobe Lens Correction Profile (LCP)—to the database by using Preferences>General.
   • Noise reduction: Automatically enables either color noise reduction, color and luminance noise reduction, or disables any initial noise reduction. Color noise reduction is recommended for the vast majority of camera raw images.
   • RAW output format: Choose between RGB (16 bit) or RGB (32 bit HDR) output when developing a raw image. Choosing RGB (32 bit HDR) allows you to maintain a full 32-bit float environment from initial raw development to export and take advantage of extra precision.
   • Tone curve: If the default 'Apply tone curve' option is active, your raw image is adjusted using a suggested tone curve. The 'Take no action' option makes no tonal correction; the image can be altered within the Basic panel later.
   • Alert when assistant takes an action: When checked, a pop-up message appears on loading the RAW image to indicate that adjustments have been applied automatically.
   • Exposure bias: Choose whether to apply exposure bias value if stored in the raw image's EXIF data. Like Histogram stretch, both 'default' and 'initial' give the same results but reports zeroed or actual values, respectively. The 'Take no action' option ignores the exposure bias value.

 

[ronwise]

Hi @Ron P., I appreciate the quick reply! I have looked at all the documentation I can find and have played with all of those settings. Nothing seems to change the way they import. When I turn those settings off, the images just get more flat — and they're still underexposed. I've even tried using Iridient X-Transformer to create DNGs out of the RAFs. I'm not ready to give up on AP yet but I need a different way of opening the raw files before doing any serious editing. 

[walt.farrell]

21 hours ago, ronwise said:

I don't know what the deal is with Affinity and RAW files but I'm really disappointed. Everything I shoot is easily needing 1+ stop boost in exposure. 

Affinity Photo (unlike some other RAW development applications) leave most of the development decisions up to the user. Some others may read more of the in-camera settings, but for the most part Affinity Photo just presents you with the RAW data (which does not have any of those in-camera settings applied).

[ronwise]

2 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Affinity Photo (unlike some other RAW development applications) leave most of the development decisions up to the user. Some others may read more of the in-camera settings, but for the most part Affinity Photo just presents you with the RAW data (which does not have any of those in-camera settings applied).

Thanks for your reply, Walt. It still seems weird to me that I can open these files in any other program that supports RAW and the exposures are good. It was my understanding that RAW files don't have in-camera settings applied to them (like JPEGs would). But then, I'm wrong a lot. Until this gets ironed out, I'll have to use a different RAW processor. 

[walt.farrell]

1 minute ago, ronwise said:

It was my understanding that RAW files don't have in-camera settings applied to them (like JPEGs would).

They don't. But they can contain information about what the in-camera settings were, and some other programs will read that information and try to reproduce those settings as a starting point. Affinity Photo basically doesn't do that.

[Muffindell]

Any update to this problem, my Canon 5Dmk2 and R6 has the same problem, it's seems to look like the gamma is all wrong?

[NotMyFault]

Did you follow the tutorial videos, or the advise given in this thread about develop assistant?

There is no know issue with the good old 5D, and if both give same results, its probably related.

https://affinity.serif.com/en-us/tutorials/photo/desktop/video/331997643/

https://affinity.serif.com/en-us/tutorials/photo/desktop/video/331997853/

 

If this doesn't help, we would need CR2/CR3 test images to check, and screenshots of your assistant settings.
 

[R C-R]

6 hours ago, NotMyFault said:

There is no know issue with the good old 5D...

Does that also apply to the 5D mk2?

[NotMyFault]

7 hours ago, R C-R said:

Does that also apply to the 5D mk2?

All are very long time on market, i would be surprised. All create CR2 format, issues are mainly for newer models using CR3 format.

5D 4 in 2016

5D 3 in 2012

5D 2 2008

5D 2005

 

Edited May 12, 2022 by NotMyFault
Typo

[R C-R]

8 minutes ago, NotMyFault said:

5D 2095

Typo, I assume? Anyway, I did see the Canon EOS 5D Mark II mentioned here, so assuming @Muffindell is using a current version of AP, it should be supported by the Serif RAW engine.

[NotMyFault]

7 hours ago, R C-R said:

Typo, I assume? Anyway, I did see the Canon EOS 5D Mark II mentioned here, so assuming @Muffindell is using a current version of AP, it should be supported by the Serif RAW engine.

The list contains all Canon models incl. R6 mentioned by Muffindell.

But we know that there are some limits in case of compressed RAW files, or Cameras released in the past ~2-3 years.

[Muffindell]

17 hours ago, R C-R said:

Typo, I assume? Anyway, I did see the Canon EOS 5D Mark II mentioned here, so assuming @Muffindell is using a current version of AP, it should be supported by the Serif RAW engine.

You would have thought so, CR2 was released in 2004 and CR3 in 2018, however Affinity just doesn't cope with it out of the box and I don't know why such a longstanding file format is not automatically accommodated, let alone the newer CR3 format; it surely can't be an oversight. I find it difficult to believe that there haven't been loads of complaints, is everyone using JPG's for their work? I'm a professional photographer and have accumulated plenty of knowledge since 1986 when DTP started to make a move against traditional hand litho methods and drum scanning, I remember using the first Digital cameras where batteries would last no more than 20 shots, hopefully Serif customer services will come up with the goods rapidly 

[R C-R]

29 minutes ago, Muffindell said:

CR2 was released in 2004 and CR3 in 2018, however Affinity just doesn't cope with it out of the box and I don't know why such a longstanding file format is not automatically accommodated

What info & how it is stored in CR2 RAW file varies by camera model -- IOW, it is not exactly the same for all of them. That's why there is a list of supported models, & of supported camera/lens combinations.

It is also why Affinity (among others) relies on the Lensfun project for its RAW processing engine.

[Muffindell]

7 minutes ago, R C-R said:

What info & how it is stored in CR2 RAW file varies by camera model -- IOW, it is not exactly the same for all of them. That's why there is a list of supported models, & of supported camera/lens combinations.

It is also why Affinity (among others) relies on the Lensfun project for its RAW processing engine.

As I understand it, Lensfun is solely used for lens correction data, it is not a RAW processing engine, but I am happy to be corrected on this

[R C-R]

13 minutes ago, Muffindell said:

As I understand it, Lensfun is solely used for lens correction data, it is not a RAW processing engine, but I am happy to be corrected on this

Yes, I think you are right about that, but the point is how image sensor data is stored & what & how image metadata is stored in the CR2 format varies by camera model, so it is the combination of camera & lens that determines if or to what extent a RAW engine can process it.

IOW, supporting one Canon camera model that outputs CR2 RAW files does not mean all others are automatically supported.