Confusing Color Picker behavior

[jc4d]

Hi all,

Often I have to get the hex code from sampled color, for this we can use the Color Picker or by double clicking on the Color Chooser, the problem with any of this methods is that to show the hex info the color is applied to the layer and I just want to get the hex code without being applied the color to the layer/image.

Is there a way to do it?

Cheers,
Juan

[GarryP]

In Photo (only) you can use the Info Panel, change the Colour Model of a Sampler to RGB Hex and then you can us the Sample from Location tool.
See attached video.

[jc4d]

Thank you for the video, really appreciated, sadly there are couple of drawbacks with it 😔.

Firts issue is that it seems I cannot control the sample radius and the second issue is that I'm not able to copy the hex value.
 

Cheers,
Juan

[GarryP]

You’re welcome.
There’s at least one existing feature request to add a user-controlled sample radius: https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/139588-color-sampling/
There may be one for being able to copy the value also; you can look for one if you wish to add to it.

[lacerto]

You should be able to use the Color Picker Tool (with optional sample radius) and then copy the hex value, in each of the three apps, without applying the color to anything, if you do not have anything selected when picking the color:

 

[jc4d]

Thanks, it is working for a pixel type layer which samples correctly but if you sample it on a Image type layer, the layer will be recolored.

Not sure if this is a "feature" or a bug.

[Ron P.]

32 minutes ago, jc4d said:

Thanks, it is working for a pixel type layer which samples correctly but if you sample it on a Image type layer, the layer will be recolored.

Not sure if this is a "feature" or a bug.

Using the Color Picker Tool, which is on the Toolbar along the left side, it does not recolor the layer. Do not have the layer selected in the Layer Panel. I just tried this using 1-Image type layer, and 1-Pixel type layer.

Edited November 1, 2021 by Ron P.
Add Screen Recording

[lacerto]

2 hours ago, jc4d said:

Thanks, it is working for a pixel type layer which samples correctly but if you sample it on a Image type layer, the layer will be recolored.

I updated the video (they come absurdly large for some reason, I have my remote desktop environment somehow confused at the moment) that shows the pixel, image and shape layers so you should be able to use the color picker on any type of layer.

[carl123]

32 minutes ago, jc4d said:

but if you sample it on a Image type layer, the layer will be recolored.

Not sure if this is a "feature" or a bug.

That depends whether you have the option "Apply to Selection" ticked in the context toolbar or not

So, it is not a bug

[jc4d]

Thank you both for your reply.
@Lagarto thanks to your video I found the issue, if you have the Image type layer selected in the layers panel and start sampling the color, this layer is recolored which it doesn't happens if you have a pixel layer type selected.
 

[jc4d]

Just now, carl123 said:

That depends whether you have the option "Apply to Selection" ticked in the context toolbar or not

So, it is not a bug

But if you uncheck the Apply to Selection then the Color panel is not updated and you cannot take the hex number.

[Ron P.]

That's correct. Plus using the Color Picker Tool, you have control of how much of an area is sampled.

They could certainly improve this.

[jc4d]

If a moderator/dev can take a look at this topic and comment if this is the expected behavior or a bug then this topic can be moved to bug reports of feature request.

[N.P.M.]

N.P.M.

 

[jc4d]

I understand, the thing is that the Color tab UI is not updating if the apply to selection is unchecked, and why this happens only to Image type and not Pixel type, hence the confussion about the usage of this tool.

[carl123]

6 minutes ago, jc4d said:

I understand, the thing is that the Color tab UI is not updating if the apply to selection is unchecked

It is updating the swatch next to the colour picker in the Colour Panel - that is how it is designed to work

7 minutes ago, jc4d said:

and why this happens only to Image type and not Pixel type,

If you read the Help File, it tells you that "Apply to Selection" is only designed to work with Vector objects

 

If you want to copy the hex values using the Colour Picker Tool just ensure you have no object selected when you use it, so that it does not change that object's colour

[lacerto]

27 minutes ago, jc4d said:

why this happens only to Image type and not Pixel type

Only (Image) kind of raster objects (which, too, in Affinity apps are a bit confusingly called "vector" objects) will have, the fill color assigned to them, any change in their visual appearance. A pixel layer can have a color assignment but it does not appear to have any effect. I am not sure if the assignment could have an effect in some specific context, but if it is e.g. converted to an image resource in Publisher (Layer > Convert to Image Resource), the assignment is not retained.

[R C-R]

5 hours ago, Lagarto said:

Only (Image) kind of raster objects (which, too, in Affinity apps are a bit confusingly called "vector" objects) ...

Some users refer to them as "vector" or "vector-like" objects, but AFAIK the documentation does not. For example, in this help topic, there is this:

Quote

An image layer has a container which retains the placed image's original color space, resolution and physical dimensions (when placed at native resolution).

So technically I suppose we should be calling them container objects.

[R C-R]

6 hours ago, jc4d said:

I understand, the thing is that the Color tab UI is not updating if the apply to selection is unchecked...

As @carl123 mentioned, the small color swatch next to the dropper icon in the Color panel is updated when you use the Color Picker Tool.

It is a bit of a workaround, but if you want to copy the hex code of that color swatch, you can do so by first making sure either no layer or only a pixel layer is selected (so the color will not be applied to anything in the document), clicking once on that small swatch to set one of the large color swatches to its left to that color, & then double-clicking that large color swatch to open the Color Chooser window, where you can copy the hex value shown there to the clipboard.

This would be a lot easier to do if double-clicking on the small color swatch in the Color panel opened the Color Chooser window with that color preselected. So maybe add a feature request for that?

[lacerto]

23 minutes ago, R C-R said:

So technically I suppose we should be calling them container objects.

I am not sure what they should be called. In many ways pixel layers (objects) are similar to image layers (objects), the former, too can retain information on "original" DPI and physical dimensions (separately from the canvas), and a pixel layer can certainly be a container, and can also accept a fill color in a non-destructive way (even if not as a regular fill color). Raster brushes are called vector brushes in Designer because they have object-like properties or behvior so perhaps that's why "image" kind of raster containers are called by some users as vector objects.

 

[walt.farrell]

21 minutes ago, Lagarto said:

and a pixel layer can certainly be a container,

I would not call the pixel layer you showed a "container". It is a parent. A container hides its internals, and is a self-contained single object as far as the document is concerned. For example, if you have an embedded or linked file you cannot see the layers within it. All you see is one layer in the Layers panel. The same applies to an Image layer; only one layer in the Layers panel, and you cannot operate on its contents (pixels) directly. Your example has 3 layers, not one.

[R C-R]

1 hour ago, walt.farrell said:

I would not call the pixel layer you showed a "container". It is a parent.

That is what I would call it. But I would never call an Image layer a vector object.

[lacerto]

27 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

would not call the pixel layer you showed a "container".

Personally I think that it is ok to use "natural language" and call something that contains a container. Whether it is "self-contained", or something else (e.g., a kind of an organizing container similarly as a group layer, or a layer layer, the function of which a pixel layer in Photo in many ways has) is once again only vaguely defined in the documentation. Calling it a "parent" is pretty much as informative as calling a clipping object or a mask a parent. Affinity apps are full of such confusing terms, starting from "layer". This is how the documentation "clarifies" the terminological confusion:

 

 

[lacerto]

13 minutes ago, R C-R said:

But I would never call an Image layer a vector object.

I used the term because I have seen it been used in context of specifying which kind of raster objects can have tints and shades. But I agree that is not proper use of the term "vector". Similarly as it is improper in context of raster brushes.

[R C-R]

16 minutes ago, Lagarto said:

Calling it a "parent" is pretty much as informative as calling a clipping object or a mask a parent.

I think what is meant by a parent-child object relationship is reasonably clear. I see no problems using it to describe the difference between some object & whatever other object(s) might be indented below it in the Layers panel, or hiding behind the disclosure triangles in the panel.