Eye Dropper help

[Slotcar Bob]

Photo on a Mac. I don't understand how the eye dropper works. Can anyone help with that? Thanks.

[walt.farrell]

The first question needs to be, which eye dropper do you mean?

1. The Color Picker Tool:

Or
2. The eye dropper in the Color studio panel (and similar panels):

 

[Slotcar Bob]

yes, I should have been more clear. This one...

[Vicente Bermúdez]

There are two types of droppers in Affinity Publisher. One of them only takes a sample of any part of the screen, including objects outside the Publisher work area. The other, the one in the toolbar, applies the color of any element to the object you have selected.
Look at the video.

 

[Slotcar Bob]

Got it!! Wow. Thanks.

[Pšenda]

11 hours ago, Slotcar Bob said:

This one...

"Using the Colour Picker"

https://affinity.help/photo/English.lproj/pages/Panels/clrPanel.html

[spinhead]

@Vicente Bermúdez SO very helpful. Was driving me mad. Glad I found this thread. Thanks for asking, @Slotcar Bob

[GregoryCCB]

Can I just point out how horrible the usability is in this software, where you have two identical tools with opposite functions in different locations?  UX anyone?

[R C-R]

1 hour ago, GregoryCCB said:

Can I just point out how horrible the usability is in this software, where you have two identical tools with opposite functions in different locations?

They are not identical tools. As @Vicente Bermúdez mentioned, one is just a sampler (not a Tools panel tool). The other is a regular tool (which may or may not be present on the Tools panel depending on how that panel is customized). Like most regular tools has a number of context toolbar options, including choices for averaging, source, & if it just samples or pushes colors onto selections.

The second tool was added around version 1.6 (or so) because a lot of users requested it.

[Pšenda]

3 hours ago, R C-R said:

They are not identical tools.

Yes, tools isn't identical, as is described in help, 

https://affinity.help/photo/en-US.lproj/pages/Clr/samplingClr.html

but then why do they have identical icons? This certainly does not contribute to easy and user-friendly operation.

[GregoryCCB]

Sorry I wasn't clear.  As Psenda mentioned, it's the icons that are identical.  It's a UX no-no to put the same label on two different functions.  Icons serve the same function as labels.  So PRINT in one location shouldn't be a different implementation than PRINT in another location.  Likewise, an Eye Dropper icon in one location shouldn't have a different implementation than the same Eye Dropper icon in another location.  If they worked exactly the same, it would be fine.  But as it stands, the user needs to memorize their different functions, with little on-screen support in that memorization effort.

To be fair, Affinity isn't the least usable graphics program out there - one reason I bought it is that the Adobe stuff is among the least usable SW ever produced.  But I do think we should hold ALL SW to much higher standards of usability than we currently do.  As a human factors engineer, it is my job to design my company's user interfaces so that they are intuitive and memorable, and it angers me to have to use SW that is clearly lacking in that department. 

[R C-R]

9 hours ago, Pšenda said:

but then why do they have identical icons?

Do you have any suggestions for how they should differ? 

[GregoryCCB]

I don't really understand the actual function well enough to advise on an icon, but from I see in this thread, it's more of a fill function.  Eye dropper has such a strong convention for sampling, and the bucket such a strong convention for filling, that it seems more suitable for a bucket icon than an eye dropper.  To LondonSquirrel's point, their functions in the real world are almost moot at this point.  The only place I have ever used an eye dropper is in SW; not the real world, so we have to look to SW conventions rather than real world function to determine what is most intuitive to users.

BUT, if the fill function in the color panel is different from the fill function in the toolbar, then you can't use the same bucket icon in both places.  But a variation on the bucket might work.  That's where my lack of understanding of the finer details of the function prevents me from helping further - I'm not sure how the buckets would differ to provide maximum information to the user on their specific purposes.  But a small visual difference may be enough (rainbow bucket?).

[R C-R]

10 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

How about a bucket icon for the fill function, as is often seen in other applications.

There is already a bucket icon for the fill function in the Affinity apps, so it would be just as confusing if one of the droppers used that same icon.

Personally, I do not find it particularly confusing that an item on the Tools panel uses the same icon as one that is not on that panel. For me, it is enough that if I click on the tool in the Tools panel, the contextual toolbar changes, just as it does with other selected tools, while dragging the dropper in other panels does not.

What might help for those that do find it confusing is if the dropper in the other panels included some indication that it is the combination of the dropper & the small color well that is the icon, so they are not really using an identical icon, but maybe that would not be enough of a distinction.

[R C-R]

10 minutes ago, GregoryCCB said:

I don't really understand the actual function well enough to advise on an icon, but from I see in this thread, it's more of a fill function.

The Color Picker Tool (the item on the Tools panel) has multiple functions. When "Apply to Selection" on the context toolbar is enabled & there is a selection, then it both picks a color & fills the selected item with it. Optionally, it can also add the picked color to the document palette (via a modifier key -- see the status bar to see what it is). There are also contextual options to set the source for the picker (global or current object), & for picking from a single pixel or the average of several pixels (via the radius setting on the contextual toolbar).

Like the dropper on the Color & Swatches panels, it also adds the picked color to the small color well next to the dropper icon in those panels, which by itself does not fill anything with color. That small color well can be used to set the fill color of a selected item by clicking on it, so taken together with the eye dropper next to it, it also has two functions, one to pick a color (via a drag) & the other to fill an item (via a click).

With that many functions & behaviors to choose from, it can take a while to sort out how best to use them all, but if you take the time to do that you will probably find each of them useful.

[R C-R]

4 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

And what does the bucket icon do in those apps? Does it pick or does it fill?

It fills, just like it does in most other graphic apps that have a Fill tool.

4 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

Perhaps by changing the icon?

But to what? It is already different from the icon used for the Color Picker Tool -- it actually is both the dropper & the small color well next to it. It is just not immediately obvious that there are two parts to the icon. The only way to tell is to notice that it does not matter if you drag or click on the dropper or the color well.

[R C-R]

5 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

The idea has been developing in my mind for some time that the context toolbar is just horrendous.

What would the alternative be for any tool that has several different modes, options, or behaviors to choose from? In many similar apps all that stuff is buried in a sidebar, a multi-section 'inspector,' or (worst of all) a series of modal windows.

[R C-R]

2 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

Then that is bad GUI design. It should be obvious.

Making every function of every UI element obvious to everyone requires a lot more than just a unique icon. This is why there are help topics, tutorials, support forums, & other learning aids for just about every app other than maybe for the most basic, barebones ones.

If nothing else, consider how steep the leaning curve is for new users of other apps like Photoshop or Illustrator. What would they guess a 'magic wand' tool would do, or what would be the difference between two arrow shaped tools that are basically the same except for their color?

[R C-R]

7 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said:

Something where I can arrange the attributes I want to see and care about. A (sometimes) very long and thin toolbar is not the best.

Is this something you would be willing to do individually for each tool? How much time would you be willing to put into doing this before you could start using the tools?

Maybe more to the point, how much would you have to learn about the capabilities of & options available for each tool before you could even start doing that?

[R C-R]

1 minute ago, LondonSquirrel said:

It is clear reading the comments that other people do have problems finding things in the GUI. I don't think I am alone.

That is certainly true, but it is also true of other apps, including the big mainstream ones from Adobe, Apple, & many others.

[GregoryCCB]

I know this thread deviated some from the original eye dropper question, but I again need help using the eye dropper tool in the toolbar - not the eye dropper fill tool in the color panel.

I am trying to cover up something in a photo by covering it with a shape and matching the gradient in the shape to the gradient of the surrounding image.  In Fireworks, anytime I use the color panel, it has its own eyedropper that allows me to sample pixels anywhere in the image without losing the actual function for which I need the color.  In AD, I use the gradient tool, click on the start circle for the gradient, and I don't have access to an eye dropper.  If I click on the eye dropper, I lose the gradient altogether, and it just fills the whole shape with the selected color.  Clicking back on the gradient tool shows that I have no gradient applied, and I have to start over.

That's what drew me to try the eye dropper icon in the color panel in the first place.  But since that is actually a fill tool, it doesn't meet my need.  Is there any way to sample pixels in an image while creating a gradient?

[walt.farrell]

10 hours ago, GregoryCCB said:

I know this thread deviated some from the original eye dropper question, but I again need help using the eye dropper tool in the toolbar - not the eye dropper fill tool in the color panel.

For your purpose, stay within the gradient dialog and use the tools available there. For example, in the screenshot below:

1. Click on the Fill color well to get the Fill dialog.
2. Click on the color well in that dialog to get the color chooser.
3. Drag the eyedropper in that dialog to pick a color.

[GregoryCCB]

Thanks Walt!  That's some workflow!  I never would have figured it out on my own.  Especially the dragging part for the eye dropper.  So, at the point I have the color sub-panel showing, there are 4 eye-dropper icons on the screen at once.  Amazing!

Thanks again!

Gregory

[walt.farrell]

On 6/27/2021 at 11:45 PM, GregoryCCB said:

 If I click on the eye dropper, I lose the gradient altogether, and it just fills the whole shape with the selected color.

You're welcome, Gregory.

[Sponsi]

Why the hell does one have to click the little circle to use the color?

Why such tiny things that make it harder to use Affinity products?