Color Differences between AFPUB and PAGES on Mac

[thetasig]

I could not find an appropriate forum for this simple question. I assume that if I were using AFPUB 2... the results would be the same. Using the latest Mac OS version on a MacBook Pro laptop.

I use AFPUB 1.10.6 as I have been developing a large document for some time. I am also manually paralleling that document in Mac PAGES.

I've noticed visually (on the display) that the same RGB (or HEX) versions of color on one application do not match the other application. I've also checked the CMYK settings in each application with the same result. In PAGES, the AFPUB color values provide a "brighter" color that I have to tone down. It would be helpful to figure out what I'm doing that keeps those two application out-of-sync.

Any suggestions on how to get them in sync would be appreciated. Thank you.

[walt.farrell]

The appropriate part of the forums is Affinity on Desktop Questions (macOS and Windows)

A Moderator will probably move this for you.

[thetasig]

Thanks Walt - I can always count on you for good advice. For some reason, that choice yesterday was greyed out and I could not choose that forum. I will look forward to having the post moved there.  Regards.

[Oufti]

6 hours ago, thetasig said:

I've noticed visually (on the display) that the same RGB (or HEX) versions of color on one application do not match the other application. I've also checked the CMYK settings in each application with the same result. In PAGES, the AFPUB color values provide a "brighter" color that I have to tone down. It would be helpful to figure out what I'm doing that keeps those two application out-of-sync.

Any suggestions on how to get them in sync would be appreciated.

Have you checked that you use the same color profile in the two apps?

• For Affinity, it is set in the Document Settings > Color.
• For Pages, it is quite hidden under the small button (…) in Color panel when the sliders tab is shown.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/guide/mac-help/mchlp1190/mac

[Oufti]

6 hours ago, thetasig said:

I assume that if I were using AFPUB 2... the results would be the same.

Well, it looks like that with v2, there is well something strange also… 

1. I created in both apps two docs with the same CMYK profile and inserted a form with the same color (0-86-74-0%).
   
2. If I look at both forms – or use Apple's Digital Color Meter (Applications > Utilities) set on L*a*b –, colors shown on screen are effectively not the same between both apps.
   (You can check by yourself, the same happens on the screenshot above, with slight local variations in colors probably due to compression. Or don't you see any difference? For me, Affinity's red is more towards orange, and "dirtier"…)
   
   Rectangle color, in Pages:
   
   Circle color, in Affinity. Color is different:
   
   But if I look in Affinity's Color panel, it shows the same L*a*b values as those found by the Digital Color Meter for Pages rectangle… ??
   
   
   Thus it looks like Affinity's software "knows" what is the intended color but it does not show this on screen. Why is Affinity not showing us what it pretends is a mystery for me. 
    
3. Then I switched to show RGB values of the forms (with the padlock locked in Affinity). No surprize, values in the file are well almost the same between the two apps, but colors shown are still not. (Again checked with the Digital Color Meter — measured values remain the same as before, which is normal). 
   

— In short, Apple (Digital Color Meter) agrees with Apple (Pages) and with what Affinity calculates, but not what it shows on screen. 

[Oufti]

2 hours ago, Oufti said:

if I look in Affinity's Color panel, it shows the same L*a*b values as those found by the Digital Color Meter for Pages rectangle…

This color is not what is measured on screen within Affinity' window but it is the color obtained after exporting from Affinity, including the profile – wether in PNG or PDF. 

In definitive, it seems that Affinity works well when exporting file but does not show what it should… 

9 hours ago, thetasig said:

Any suggestions on how to get them in sync would be appreciated.

I am as perplex as you are… 

[thetasig]

Thanks for your inspirations on what is going on.  One thing I noted after reading your notes is that my Pages color was set to 8-bit and AFPUB was set to 16-bit with the same color profile. I had read that certain differences could occur due to fractional differences (more detail in 16-bit). I'll check it out further to see if some good change will happen. I do have a display color measuring device and will see if there are still differences in the measured color.

[fde101]

Wondering if there is a difference in how rendering intent is being handled?

In the Affinity apps it is configurable in Preferences/Settings but in Pages I don't see an option for it so not sure what is being used there.

[Oufti]

9 hours ago, thetasig said:

One thing I noted after reading your notes is that my Pages color was set to 8-bit and AFPUB was set to 16-bit with the same color profile.

In my test, both were in 8-bits and I had differences well above rounding approximations. 

 

9 hours ago, thetasig said:

I do have a display color measuring device and will see if there are still differences in the measured color.

This would be very interesting!
Even a quick check between Rectangle color and Corcle color in the screenshots above would be informative. 

 

3 hours ago, fde101 said:

Wondering if there is a difference in how rendering intent is being handled?

FWIW, in my Aff settings, rendering intent was set on "perceptive", with Black point compensation set to "on" and no opening conversion.

[Chris26]

PS.tifI thought I would perform a little test:

I only upload a screenshot of the colour I used.

Photoshop's figures:

1. sRGB   138 66 153

2. L*A*B  43 49 -35

Affinity Pub's figures using eyedropper from colour palette after importing the file as a TIFF:

1. sRGB 158 65 157

2. L*A*B  43 49 -32

Using the Digicolour meter:

1. sRGB  157 65 155  (No LAB option with this)

Comparing the screens with the apple mac screen calibrated and my laptop at the optimum angle, it is clear there is a difference consistent with the above.  However I actually find little cause for concern when I print since the print always agrees with my apple, even after having imported images into the windows laptop into publisher where I have always anticipated differences.

[thomaso]

17 hours ago, Oufti said:

or use Apple's Digital Color Meter

5 hours ago, fde101 said:

Wondering if there is a difference in how rendering intent is being handled?

There are quite a few threads about inconsistencies in colours or values, (just a few) which often seem to be related to differences in colour management or a lack of colour management of certain UI elements, in Affinity Photo for instance the Info Panel versus the Colours Panel.

The video in the link below shows quite large deviations with Apple's Digital Color Meter while they differ between colour models they appear especially large if Adobe RGB gets selected. Hard to tell which item shows "true" values, in particular when two colours occur to be the same.

[lepr]

4 hours ago, Chris26 said:

Photoshop's figures:

1. sRGB   138 66 153

RGB(138, 66, 153) would be the numerical value for the purple colour in Adobe RGB colour space, so I wonder why Photoshop is telling you that is the value in sRGB colour space.

 

[Chris26]

2 hours ago, lepr said:

RGB(138, 66, 153) would be the numerical value for the purple colour in Adobe RGB colour space, so I wonder why Photoshop is telling you that is the value in sRGB colour space.

 

I stand corrected.  Thank you for pointing that out - bad mistake on my part.  The figures are all the same as you point out.