nezumi

Just to stir the pot a bit....
https://www.safe.ai/statement-on-ai-risk#open-letter

The problem with these I have is that these are not the places and not the people from real world. What is the point of picture if then you change everything about it? Everything now will be fake? "Look, me on the top of the Eiffel tower, on the bicycle, wearing Armani suit, drinking coffee!"? Or "check out photo of my grandma - she looked nothing like this but AI improved the quality and blue eyes are looking better on her anyways! And here me with her on one photo - isnt that amazing? She died before I was born!".
I dont know - technically its amazing stuff. You can make a redneck use suit. Very cool for some advertisement stuff. On the other hand now you dont need any skill to confuse the hell out of everybody. Which means all the stupid people have now tool to express their stupid ideas with ease. Before some effort was required which was surely great filter for lazy and unskilled people to polute internet with yet another meme. Now floodgate is open. I doubt that is good in any shape or form. But hey - "progress"...
I guess what I am trying to say - its another razor given to bunch of monkeys. Man will shave with it, but what monkeys will do - I guess we will see on social media soon...
@CM0 Theres significant difference between "I WANT" and "I NEED". Between "I can now do it faster" and "I wouldn not be able to do it before".
Although when I think about it, in many cases AI will made things for people who otherwise wouldn't be able to do at all... So yeah, this might be true. They are still unable to do it themselves but can get it done for them with a single click.

FWIW I have no interest in AI at all from a large scale generative viewpoint. But small scale inpaint / fill / retouch / editing? Absolutely. And sharpening / denoise? Absolutely, 10,000%. I don't want to add significant visual elements with AI, but having some intelligence when 'restoring' previously obscured textures, structures and such would be not only a huge time-saver but a definite improvement over trying to manually regenerate and match them in terms of the end result. Beyond that? I've seen nothing so far that interests me.
But if Serif are truly not interested at all in exploring AI, then IMO that's to their (and our, as users) detriment. Kinda reminds me of back in the '90s when Bill Gates initially thought the Internet was overrated. But one forum remark from one person is hardly an official corporate stance, IMO.

Its not done local, there is need a very big database with several models. For Generation you need strong and fast servers.
Midjourney works with Discord where the Bot is working. 
But we will see what the future will bring.
 

i think that the chances Adobe will just absorb the costs for this is approximately zero.

Adobe can track it because it is their own data, their own model and you are using their platform to create the images. They will likely count a generation as a use.
Yes, this was my position throughout last year and early this year. I found it all completely unusable for any professional work. However, PS has made a big step forward beyond Midjourney. I spent several hours watching what people are doing with it over the weekend. When used for compositing work combining real stock photo and some manipulation you can do some very impressive work that can be far more specific than anything you would get from Midjourney. Furthermore, it seems to be able to mimic any style of your current document even if not trained on it. So you could paint your own creation and it could add to it in a convincing manner.
However, when I say good enough for professional work, I'm still constraining that mostly when used as a complementary tool for blending, photo manipulation etc. It seems to do some excellent work there. Like a super advanced clone, blend and object removal. Nevertheless, for those who do a lot of that type of work, it will likely convert hours into minutes or seconds of work.
Now for other media, like video, as you mention it currently is terrible. However, so were images just over a year ago. I suspect it will be very different a year from now.

I am quite sure I will know if I am making decisions myself or letting AI do that for me. AI has its place, just not for the things I do.

I most certainly won't be. I have no use for it.

AI is currently the wild west. Adobe are a bit more careful than other companies since they are using their own resources to build AI tools, but we won't know for sure how the wind will blow. Just look at the state of NFTs and how fast things changed in a year or two. Discussions around AI will evolve rapidly in the coming years.

The guy is reading directly from Adobe's own website in that video (notice "adobe.com" at the very top):

 
 
Even if Adobe "allow" commercial use in the official release, they do not have the authority to determine its viability as a commercial product, the law is. The law has not yet been written and ironed out in regards to AI, but there has been legal precedent set by a court ruling that determined that AI generated imagery is not copyrightable, as previously mentioned. We won't know how AI will be used for commercial purposes until more laws have been written. 

I am old enough to use cameras with film also. I still have two old russian Cmena's, old Minolta and Zenit cameras. Digital cameras didnt made my head spin. Prices of decent camera did the trick
AI is not making my head spin either. Quite contrary. Maybe because I worked on the computer all my life starting with ZX spectrum and C64 ages ago? So all the new things I take with a pinch of salt and dont join the hysteria every time something new appears? Dont want to sound rude but when it comes to so called AI people behave like some sort of primitive tribe looking at TV for the first time, amazed how all these small people entered this box 😮 . 
I wonder from where comes this absolute confidence that this technology will quickly develop into something AMAZING. So many examples of tech that was really promising in early days and then its development plateaued or even completely crashed. Remember the revolutionary, game changing movement sensor Kinect? "You are the controller!". Nothing will be the same again! Well... Or beginning of VR - soon nobody will use monitor! Everything VR! It is around, still developing, maybe one day will be more popular. But it certainly didnt took over in many years. How about self driving cars? So many news, future is here! Well, not really yet, but soon! You will see! That takes long enough too, doesnt it? Turns out its not that easy as we thought it might be.
Recently I read that first 3D scanners were made in the... 60s. I dont even know what purpose it could serve back in a day where computers didnt even had... screen. 60 YEARS later 3d modelers still have jobs. Adobe is praised now for its forward thinking with its AI tools. It took about 30 YEARS to implement in Photoshop something as simple as symmetry - tool that was present in Deluxe Paint made in 80s. Forgive me if I am not joining the chant about how great that company is
I am not against technology (clearly, my everyday work depends on it), I do not afraid of it or anything like that. But sorry - I am not easily impressed by random picture showing up inside of selection... I would absolutely LOVE to see the end of retopologizing 3D objects by hand. Do that, o great AI. Make retopology obsolete, please. And while youre at it do the same with UVs. I will be the most progressive, forward thinking AI supporter then.
But spitting the image...?
I can only quote Shania Twain and say "that don't impress me much"

I am old enough to use cameras with film also. I still have two old russian Cmena's, old Minolta and Zenit cameras. Digital cameras didnt made my head spin. Prices of decent camera did the trick
AI is not making my head spin either. Quite contrary. Maybe because I worked on the computer all my life starting with ZX spectrum and C64 ages ago? So all the new things I take with a pinch of salt and dont join the hysteria every time something new appears? Dont want to sound rude but when it comes to so called AI people behave like some sort of primitive tribe looking at TV for the first time, amazed how all these small people entered this box 😮 . 
I wonder from where comes this absolute confidence that this technology will quickly develop into something AMAZING. So many examples of tech that was really promising in early days and then its development plateaued or even completely crashed. Remember the revolutionary, game changing movement sensor Kinect? "You are the controller!". Nothing will be the same again! Well... Or beginning of VR - soon nobody will use monitor! Everything VR! It is around, still developing, maybe one day will be more popular. But it certainly didnt took over in many years. How about self driving cars? So many news, future is here! Well, not really yet, but soon! You will see! That takes long enough too, doesnt it? Turns out its not that easy as we thought it might be.
Recently I read that first 3D scanners were made in the... 60s. I dont even know what purpose it could serve back in a day where computers didnt even had... screen. 60 YEARS later 3d modelers still have jobs. Adobe is praised now for its forward thinking with its AI tools. It took about 30 YEARS to implement in Photoshop something as simple as symmetry - tool that was present in Deluxe Paint made in 80s. Forgive me if I am not joining the chant about how great that company is
I am not against technology (clearly, my everyday work depends on it), I do not afraid of it or anything like that. But sorry - I am not easily impressed by random picture showing up inside of selection... I would absolutely LOVE to see the end of retopologizing 3D objects by hand. Do that, o great AI. Make retopology obsolete, please. And while youre at it do the same with UVs. I will be the most progressive, forward thinking AI supporter then.
But spitting the image...?
I can only quote Shania Twain and say "that don't impress me much"

I often feel that people want this AI for sake of having something new because others are using it
Video with dude generating fox and bird... Fox that is generated is not some specific species of fox that inhabits that specific region on the photo. Its mashed up, non existing, sort of fox looking creature. Pseudo falcon (because its shape looks nothing like falcon...) generated by AI is generated in completely wrong perspective to the photo. Its made from photos that are shot when bird was flying directly over the photographer - makes ZERO sense in that particular photo and looks awful. Unless that bird was starting vertically like a rocket  
Same as the elk on the street in Adobes presentation that is WAY too small. Its a travesty, a photographic equivalent to 5 YO drawing. Not specific, generic shapes roughly connected to the subject. So called AI has no idea about specifics - but for what I see (sadly) people who are using it neither. Dude generating different glasses on his face seems to not care that AI generates completely different eyebrows too... At some point, if you generate enough elements it isn't your picture anymore but some Frankenstein monster put together...
Example with photo of construction worker looking at the ship... It looks exactly like quickly slapped person from another photo with little to none effort to match lighting... In Affinity Photo took me under minute to match it bit more.. "But you have the base quicker!". Maybe - maybe not. Because with AI you have no idea what will show up. Maybe you will be clicking half day and nothing matches. Depends on your luck really.
Majority of this AI things looks like could be helpful but in the end its bit better content aware fill with image search inside of your software. Hardly something revolutionary to the level people describe it. Unless you are making things that can consist of kind-of, sort-of, not very specific, not very detailed stuff. Like that pseudo fox and pseudo falcon on the desert. Stuff that I was making as a young lad playing with Photoshop 3.0 ages ago.

Thanks for taking a moment to have a closer look 
Yes, I totally agree with that point of view.

Hahaha, why podcasters? Is that how you look at the world? Through YT videos? I just gave you examples of events that happened - entire portfolio sites filled with people that is against "AI art" for one reason or another. But lets ignore it all because podcasters
And sorry but you have not created anything. You wrote what you want to have created FOR YOU. Plus added specific artist name.. Quite frankly that is sad more then anything else.

I am old enough to use cameras with film also. I still have two old russian Cmena's, old Minolta and Zenit cameras. Digital cameras didnt made my head spin. Prices of decent camera did the trick
AI is not making my head spin either. Quite contrary. Maybe because I worked on the computer all my life starting with ZX spectrum and C64 ages ago? So all the new things I take with a pinch of salt and dont join the hysteria every time something new appears? Dont want to sound rude but when it comes to so called AI people behave like some sort of primitive tribe looking at TV for the first time, amazed how all these small people entered this box 😮 . 
I wonder from where comes this absolute confidence that this technology will quickly develop into something AMAZING. So many examples of tech that was really promising in early days and then its development plateaued or even completely crashed. Remember the revolutionary, game changing movement sensor Kinect? "You are the controller!". Nothing will be the same again! Well... Or beginning of VR - soon nobody will use monitor! Everything VR! It is around, still developing, maybe one day will be more popular. But it certainly didnt took over in many years. How about self driving cars? So many news, future is here! Well, not really yet, but soon! You will see! That takes long enough too, doesnt it? Turns out its not that easy as we thought it might be.
Recently I read that first 3D scanners were made in the... 60s. I dont even know what purpose it could serve back in a day where computers didnt even had... screen. 60 YEARS later 3d modelers still have jobs. Adobe is praised now for its forward thinking with its AI tools. It took about 30 YEARS to implement in Photoshop something as simple as symmetry - tool that was present in Deluxe Paint made in 80s. Forgive me if I am not joining the chant about how great that company is
I am not against technology (clearly, my everyday work depends on it), I do not afraid of it or anything like that. But sorry - I am not easily impressed by random picture showing up inside of selection... I would absolutely LOVE to see the end of retopologizing 3D objects by hand. Do that, o great AI. Make retopology obsolete, please. And while youre at it do the same with UVs. I will be the most progressive, forward thinking AI supporter then.
But spitting the image...?
I can only quote Shania Twain and say "that don't impress me much"

Always thought that's only the special domain of BratGPT. 🤔
A small Q/A conversation with Brat ...





So much for that! 😉

@CM0
I apologize. Frankly you almost lost me at "show me podcasters" and I gave up on "piece I created" presenting generated image. Sorry I have seen too much of it to keep going first time around. Guilty as charged.
Now I read it.
In other part of this forum I have spoken about AI tool for tracing bitmaps. Works very well - most accurate tool for tracing I have used. I am using Davinci Resolve also with quite good AI tools. As a 3D artist I am of course using denoisers to speed up rendering. These are actually helpful tools not just "I will do that for you" image spitters and hell, I will happily welcome that sort of AI in Affinity too. I think sooner or later it will become norm. So I am 100% in agreement with what you said. I just really dislike generative AI spitting ready artwork. Its just... wrong on many levels and sad on many more.
@v_kyrpart of the fun. Obviously nobody will change anything by posting on forum his opinion. Doesn't mean we cant have meaningless yet entertaining conversation for sheer fun of it.

@CM0
I apologize. Frankly you almost lost me at "show me podcasters" and I gave up on "piece I created" presenting generated image. Sorry I have seen too much of it to keep going first time around. Guilty as charged.
Now I read it.
In other part of this forum I have spoken about AI tool for tracing bitmaps. Works very well - most accurate tool for tracing I have used. I am using Davinci Resolve also with quite good AI tools. As a 3D artist I am of course using denoisers to speed up rendering. These are actually helpful tools not just "I will do that for you" image spitters and hell, I will happily welcome that sort of AI in Affinity too. I think sooner or later it will become norm. So I am 100% in agreement with what you said. I just really dislike generative AI spitting ready artwork. Its just... wrong on many levels and sad on many more.
@v_kyrpart of the fun. Obviously nobody will change anything by posting on forum his opinion. Doesn't mean we cant have meaningless yet entertaining conversation for sheer fun of it.

Hahaha, why podcasters? Is that how you look at the world? Through YT videos? I just gave you examples of events that happened - entire portfolio sites filled with people that is against "AI art" for one reason or another. But lets ignore it all because podcasters
And sorry but you have not created anything. You wrote what you want to have created FOR YOU. Plus added specific artist name.. Quite frankly that is sad more then anything else.

I am old enough to use cameras with film also. I still have two old russian Cmena's, old Minolta and Zenit cameras. Digital cameras didnt made my head spin. Prices of decent camera did the trick
AI is not making my head spin either. Quite contrary. Maybe because I worked on the computer all my life starting with ZX spectrum and C64 ages ago? So all the new things I take with a pinch of salt and dont join the hysteria every time something new appears? Dont want to sound rude but when it comes to so called AI people behave like some sort of primitive tribe looking at TV for the first time, amazed how all these small people entered this box 😮 . 
I wonder from where comes this absolute confidence that this technology will quickly develop into something AMAZING. So many examples of tech that was really promising in early days and then its development plateaued or even completely crashed. Remember the revolutionary, game changing movement sensor Kinect? "You are the controller!". Nothing will be the same again! Well... Or beginning of VR - soon nobody will use monitor! Everything VR! It is around, still developing, maybe one day will be more popular. But it certainly didnt took over in many years. How about self driving cars? So many news, future is here! Well, not really yet, but soon! You will see! That takes long enough too, doesnt it? Turns out its not that easy as we thought it might be.
Recently I read that first 3D scanners were made in the... 60s. I dont even know what purpose it could serve back in a day where computers didnt even had... screen. 60 YEARS later 3d modelers still have jobs. Adobe is praised now for its forward thinking with its AI tools. It took about 30 YEARS to implement in Photoshop something as simple as symmetry - tool that was present in Deluxe Paint made in 80s. Forgive me if I am not joining the chant about how great that company is
I am not against technology (clearly, my everyday work depends on it), I do not afraid of it or anything like that. But sorry - I am not easily impressed by random picture showing up inside of selection... I would absolutely LOVE to see the end of retopologizing 3D objects by hand. Do that, o great AI. Make retopology obsolete, please. And while youre at it do the same with UVs. I will be the most progressive, forward thinking AI supporter then.
But spitting the image...?
I can only quote Shania Twain and say "that don't impress me much"

I often feel that people want this AI for sake of having something new because others are using it
Video with dude generating fox and bird... Fox that is generated is not some specific species of fox that inhabits that specific region on the photo. Its mashed up, non existing, sort of fox looking creature. Pseudo falcon (because its shape looks nothing like falcon...) generated by AI is generated in completely wrong perspective to the photo. Its made from photos that are shot when bird was flying directly over the photographer - makes ZERO sense in that particular photo and looks awful. Unless that bird was starting vertically like a rocket  
Same as the elk on the street in Adobes presentation that is WAY too small. Its a travesty, a photographic equivalent to 5 YO drawing. Not specific, generic shapes roughly connected to the subject. So called AI has no idea about specifics - but for what I see (sadly) people who are using it neither. Dude generating different glasses on his face seems to not care that AI generates completely different eyebrows too... At some point, if you generate enough elements it isn't your picture anymore but some Frankenstein monster put together...
Example with photo of construction worker looking at the ship... It looks exactly like quickly slapped person from another photo with little to none effort to match lighting... In Affinity Photo took me under minute to match it bit more.. "But you have the base quicker!". Maybe - maybe not. Because with AI you have no idea what will show up. Maybe you will be clicking half day and nothing matches. Depends on your luck really.
Majority of this AI things looks like could be helpful but in the end its bit better content aware fill with image search inside of your software. Hardly something revolutionary to the level people describe it. Unless you are making things that can consist of kind-of, sort-of, not very specific, not very detailed stuff. Like that pseudo fox and pseudo falcon on the desert. Stuff that I was making as a young lad playing with Photoshop 3.0 ages ago.

I am old enough to use cameras with film also. I still have two old russian Cmena's, old Minolta and Zenit cameras. Digital cameras didnt made my head spin. Prices of decent camera did the trick
AI is not making my head spin either. Quite contrary. Maybe because I worked on the computer all my life starting with ZX spectrum and C64 ages ago? So all the new things I take with a pinch of salt and dont join the hysteria every time something new appears? Dont want to sound rude but when it comes to so called AI people behave like some sort of primitive tribe looking at TV for the first time, amazed how all these small people entered this box 😮 . 
I wonder from where comes this absolute confidence that this technology will quickly develop into something AMAZING. So many examples of tech that was really promising in early days and then its development plateaued or even completely crashed. Remember the revolutionary, game changing movement sensor Kinect? "You are the controller!". Nothing will be the same again! Well... Or beginning of VR - soon nobody will use monitor! Everything VR! It is around, still developing, maybe one day will be more popular. But it certainly didnt took over in many years. How about self driving cars? So many news, future is here! Well, not really yet, but soon! You will see! That takes long enough too, doesnt it? Turns out its not that easy as we thought it might be.
Recently I read that first 3D scanners were made in the... 60s. I dont even know what purpose it could serve back in a day where computers didnt even had... screen. 60 YEARS later 3d modelers still have jobs. Adobe is praised now for its forward thinking with its AI tools. It took about 30 YEARS to implement in Photoshop something as simple as symmetry - tool that was present in Deluxe Paint made in 80s. Forgive me if I am not joining the chant about how great that company is
I am not against technology (clearly, my everyday work depends on it), I do not afraid of it or anything like that. But sorry - I am not easily impressed by random picture showing up inside of selection... I would absolutely LOVE to see the end of retopologizing 3D objects by hand. Do that, o great AI. Make retopology obsolete, please. And while youre at it do the same with UVs. I will be the most progressive, forward thinking AI supporter then.
But spitting the image...?
I can only quote Shania Twain and say "that don't impress me much"

All they said is they have no plans at present to implement any AI based features. That says nothing one way or another about what they are aware of, or even what they might be laying plans for in a longer term than at the present time. (Note that the phrase "at present" generally is understood to be synonymous with "now.")
Vague, cagey comments about future software developments like this are not unusual in the industry, in part because nobody wants to tip off the competition about what they are working on, in part because they do not want to raise customer expectations about anything until they can be sure they can deliver it in a reasonable or expected time frame, & in part even because they do not want to risk being victims of the Osborne Effect.

Does anybody seriously think that Serif is not already aware of the possibilities of AI that they need to reassure users of that?