The Publisher does not correctly transfer the colors from Pantone to CMYK.

[Designer1]

The Publisher does not correctly transfer the colors from Pantone to CMYK. This can be checked on : https://www.pantone.com/eu/de/color-finder/.

[Patrick Connor]

This in not enough information for us to investigate. You will need to provide a sample document and a workflow, for example what settings you are using when exporting to what format and your expectations. e.g

• Spot colour Pantones or Pantone Process?
• Applied to what objects? (sample file)
• Exported to what file format (using what settings)?
• Colour management settings?

[Designer1]

24 minutes ago, Patrick Connor said:

This in not enough information for us to investigate. You will need to provide a sample document and a workflow, for example what settings you are using when exporting to what format and your expectations. e.g

• Spot colour Pantones or Pantone Process?
• Applied to what objects? (sample file)
• Exported to what file format (using what settings)?
• Colour management settings?

You can take any Pantone color from the PANTONE® Formula Guide Solid Coated V4 and compare the CMYK values with the specifications on the Pantone website. They do not match.

[Patrick Connor]

Pantone do not provide software houses with CMYK equivalents for their Solid Coated V4 range, many of which for obvious reasons cannot be made using CMYK inks, which is why they make their money selling the actual ink/paint etc. Pantone only provide RGB values for that range to show them on screens and so you should not rely on the CMYK values provided by that site, as we have had to calculate values based on a RGB->CMYK conversion. 

For example choosing Solid Colours from that page leads to these type of pages that have this footnote

Quote

*Before using, understand that the colors shown on this site are computer simulations of the PANTONE Colors and may not match PANTONE-identified color standards. Always consult PANTONE Publications to visually evaluate any result before utilization.

...and Affinity does not match those CMYK values on the site. There is nothing can be done about that. To be honest I am surprised that they are providing CMYK colours themselves, as they will not be accurate

For Pantone Colour bridge range, a colour like 675-CP is correctly shown in app as [17,98,1,7] and Pantone Process colours like P25-16C is correctly represented in our applications as [0,57,100,35]. 

If that is not your experience, then please provide a sample file, but please note Pantone makes their money on spot colours that cannot be represented adequately or reliably with CMYK inks.

[MikeW]

To further Patrick's answer as to why Pantones cmyk numbers will not match to (nearly) any application's output numbers...

The numbers used on the Pantone website are what I refer to as "dumb numbers." That is, the numbers are what one can/will get if, and only if, an application's output was "uncharacterized" by an output profile. They are "straight conversions," but they are also straight conversions using LAB as the beginning color model to a nearest number scheme that squeezes numbers to fit into the cmyk model. The same can/does apply to the rgb numbers--difficult to always obtain those rgb numbers straight from an application that uses output profiles. Pantone could have changed how it calculates the numbers posted to their website since I last communicated with them.

In my experience, there is variance from all applications that is using output profiles no matter the end color model.

Further, If one uses their desktop application, PCM (Pantone Color Manager) set to use the same output profile that one is using in an application, the numbers shown in PCM are the same / nearly identical as those the pdf and/or application reports. This has always applied to Serif applications as well.

 

[Designer1]

Thank you very much for this information. For me the crucial question is, which information should I better use, from the Pantone website or from Publisher.

I make an example for PANTONE 7862. As you can see, the CMYK values are different.

Were you advised to use only PANTONE® Color Bridge Coated V4?

[Patrick Connor]

@Designer1

The CMYK for Pantone Process colors and from Pantone bridge colours, can be made to match the colours in the application. You should not use/rely on the CMYK colours from their website or our software for other parts of the Pantone range. hopefully this makes sense

Here is my use of that Pantone colour which matches the website.

As I said in the first place, if you could provide a document it would help us see what is happening. I would suggest your document is not CMYK colour model or uses the wrong ICC profile, but that is guesswork. Does my document work for you?

 

Pantone 7462 CP.afpub

[Designer1]

1 hour ago, Patrick Connor said:

@Designer1

The CMYK for Pantone Process colors and from Pantone bridge colours, can be made to match the colours in the application. You should not use/rely on the CMYK colours from their website or our software for other parts of the Pantone range. hopefully this makes sense

Here is my use of that Pantone colour which matches the website.

As I said in the first place, if you could provide a document it would help us see what is happening. I would suggest your document is not CMYK colour model or uses the wrong ICC profile, but that is guesswork. Does my document work for you?

 

Pantone 7462 CP.afpub

PANTONE® Color Bridge Coated V4 corresponds to CMYK specifications on Pantone website. The problem is only in the PANTONE® Formula Guide Solid Coated V4. The cat has correct CMYK colors also with me.

[Patrick Connor]

Solid Coated V4 have no published CMYK equivalents. The ones on the website are not accurate they are only an approximation. The colour in that Swatch can only be reliably reproduced as a spot colour ink, and MUST be used as a spot colour in Affinity and exported to a PDF format that supports spot colours.

So you don't need to worry about the on screen colour as long as you only use it as a solid or tinted colour and export correctly.

What is your use case and why are you concerned about the numbers on the display? I suggest you export your design using spot colours and have it checked plate by plate. The pantone will not output on the CMYK plates if you don't want it to. 

I hope you can see this. Perhaps someone else here can explain better if you give us your file and explain the exact problem.

[pruus]

Have you tried to use an online tool? Like https://codebeautify.org/pantone-to-cmyk-converter. This is perhaps and acceptable solution.

 

[Designer1]

12 hours ago, Patrick Connor said:

Solid Coated V4 have no published CMYK equivalents. The ones on the website are not accurate they are only an approximation. The colour in that Swatch can only be reliably reproduced as a spot colour ink, and MUST be used as a spot colour in Affinity and exported to a PDF format that supports spot colours.

So you don't need to worry about the on screen colour as long as you only use it as a solid or tinted colour and export correctly.

What is your use case and why are you concerned about the numbers on the display? I suggest you export your design using spot colours and have it checked plate by plate. The pantone will not output on the CMYK plates if you don't want it to. 

I hope you can see this. Perhaps someone else here can explain better if you give us your file and explain the exact problem.

Thanks for this information. The printing is in CMYK ! The Pantone must therefore be transferred as accurately as possible in CMYK. So my questions are: What is better to use in Publisher, PANTONE® Formula Guide Solid Coated V4 or PANTONE® Color Bridge Coated V4?

[Patrick Connor]

If you are printing in CMYK with no additional spot colour plates, then avoid the Solid Coated V4, as they are best printed as a spot colour plate on top of the CMY&K.

The Color Bridge range is sold as a swatch that shows the exact colour "C" and the nearest process equivalent "CP"

Look at the 3rd picture on this page https://www.pantone.com/color-bridge-guide-coated 

So you can design in Pantone Colour Bridge colours if you are willing to accept the "CP" version of the "C" colour. If you need the exact C colour you need to pay for the extra spot colour plate, but they are often very close. I suggest you read around on the difference and decide what is right for your particular case, as mistakes can be expensive to correct.

[Designer1]

4 minutes ago, Patrick Connor said:

If you are printing in CMYK with no additional spot colour plates, then avoid the Solid Coated V4, as they are best printed as a spot colour plate on top of the CMY&K.

The Color Bridge range is sold as a swatch that shows the exact colour "C" and the nearest process equivalent "CP"

Look at the 3rd picture on this page https://www.pantone.com/color-bridge-guide-coated 

So you can design in Pantone Colour Bridge colours if you are willing to accept the "CP" version of the "C" colour. If you need the exact C colour you need to pay for the extra spot colour plate, but they are often very close. I suggest you read around on the difference and decide what is right for your particular case, as mistakes can be expensive to correct.

Many thanks for this important information.

[Goran62]

@Designer1:  Conversion of Pantone inks to limited CMYK colour space should use ICC profile of your specific printer or standard, defined in Colour Management of your DTP app. CMYK numbers of  certain Pantone colours should be slightly different when printing device is your PS laser printer or PS ink-jet printer or offset press etc. Therefore, CMYK definitions of inks on Pantone site - without mentioning for which  CMYK printer or printing standard values are made for, are more or less informative.