Saved files get much big

[Polygonius]

Here you see 2-times the same file. The copy is edited by AP and "saved as reduced" - Its almost10 times big!!!!!  (i made the duplicate before in finder).

If i compare in finder-attributes both the same JPEG in dpi, size...rgb... just the filesize is so much bigger. Why this and how to shrink it? 

[stokerg]

Hi Polygonius,

This has come a few times on the Forums, this being one of the threads

On the export dialog you click on More and untick embed metadata which will reduce the file further or alter the quality slider to something much lower than 100.  I'm sure if anyone else has any tips, they will share them shortly  

[R C-R]

2 hours ago, stokerg said:

On the export dialog you click on More and untick embed metadata ...

You can also do the same for "Embed ICC profile." However, at least for the JPEGs I have, including both in the export usually only adds a few 10's of KB to the file's size, not anywhere near enough to explain a 10x increase in export file size.

What can make a huge difference though is editing a heavily compressed JPEG like by painting out compression artifacts, adding sharpness or clarity, intensifying colors, or anything else that makes the file much harder to compress much for a given export quality setting. Since using a much lower quality setting on export tends to reintroduce whatever problems the edits are meant to fix (& often makes them worse), users learn to avoid that by using a higher quality setting that keeps all or most of their improvements intact.

Another part of it is there are more efficient lossy compression algorithms than the one (ones?) Affinity uses, but the most efficient ones take much longer to work -- as much as 10-15 seconds even on moderately sized files, so I guess they have opted for faster over better in Affinity.

[Polygonius]

Thanks stokeret, 

I created some presets with that... but thats only for the long way via export. The short hard-overwrite "save" will produces big files...  Its ok, i prefer export,with my new presets.

 

But however, i always get a "for this file there is a recovery-file" when re open a file i just play around and DID NOT save it, neither as aphoto nor overwrite the file. 

So what is AP doing here in the background, where are this "recoverys", how big are this files, does i do not need special aphoto-files cause the recovery always is hidden aphoto????

[stokerg]

On 12/7/2018 at 3:11 PM, Polygonius said:

So what is AP doing here in the background, where are this "recoverys", how big are this files, does i do not need special aphoto-files cause the recovery always is hidden aphoto????

Thats odd, as i'd only expect a recovery file if Affinity had crashed while working.  From my understanding a recovery file is the autosave file, so this should be removed when the file/app is closed.  I could be wrong and will double check that on Monday with the Dev team.

On 12/7/2018 at 1:57 PM, R C-R said:

Another part of it is there are more efficient lossy compression algorithms than the one (ones?) Affinity uses, but the most efficient ones take much longer to work -- as much as 10-15 seconds even on moderately sized files, so I guess they have opted for faster over better in Affinity.

Not 100% sure on this, but i'll see what i can find out and report back  

[Polygonius]

1 hour ago, stokerg said:

Thats odd, as i'd only expect a recovery file if Affinity had crashed while working.  From my understanding a recovery file is the autosave file, so this should be removed when the file/app is closed.  I could be wrong and will double check that on Monday with the Dev team.

"THERE IS A RECOVERY FILE.".. (or similar)... THATS WHAT I MEAN WHAN SAYING "THIS..."...

Nope, without crashes. Just open some JPG or PNG as separate AP-new docs...  and do, just for fun, some edits... than close AP ITSELF... You got a lot of "save/save not"...  If you "NO" some (or all) of this "projects" and then "reopen" the based JPEG or PNG you get this dialog... I NEVER saved or even OVERWRITE this ORIGINAL jpg/png... nope. But when reopening (from finder) i get often this message...

BTW: is there a way to SAY NEVER overwrite an existing IMAGE (jpg, png...)... the current SAVE is a little bit confusing... (i never tried to the end)... but if i say "save" i want an AP-file, if i say "Oerwrite" i want that the jpg. png... ITSELF gets overwrite... so its really confusing. 

 

And yeah, do i need a hidden-backup-file? Sometimes yes, maybe if the app or the system crashes... but i would say the app closed normally all "temp" files will at trash as last step. I do not need any "there is a recorvery for this"... 

Not general, maybe there is smart algorithm in the background... i open my JPG again and then i remember, oops, i had done some already, than would like to ASK AP "is there any kind of backup? Please show!" But i do not want this as default-never-ask-show-"recovery" as open-prompt-window... And yeah, IF I ASK, i get 2 possibilitys in this window: Empty the (backup) cache for THIS file AND EMPTY ALL backup-chache (or however you call this). 

 

Thanks, that you take a look of it. I do not not see any advantage of this behavior, of this confusing and maybe hidden database-growing...  "what gets overwritten / save ... by save, save as reduced... i just play with that image and CLOSE it..."  

My suggestion is: JUST decide between SAVE (is creating a NEW AP file) and OVERWRITE  (is a DESTRUCTIVE overwrite of the source-image).

I do not say  this hidden TEMP/backgroudn/recovery_protocoll is wrong. In the opposite. But i want to use it or not. I want to if I ask "is there a "backup"..."  Not that AP PROMPT  "there is a recovery-file..." its A) nasty to click away and B) i never know aht is "recoverd" a Seperate AP-file" or a temparally JPG-overwrite????  The feature itself maybe makes sense, but in this way "of use" its confusing/nasty. 

 

 

After each crash/re-open... i click AP-main-menu and there i will find the entry "chache" which opens a box, i can search for date/name/kind...  and the simple clear ALL button. Well, some users like this "we are saving all..." i´m not, so create this as an option for "risk-people" and the "all-collectors".

 

[R C-R]

1 hour ago, Polygonius said:

Nope, without crashes. Just open some JPG or PNG as separate AP-new docs...  and do, just for fun, some edits... than close AP ITSELF... You got a lot of "save/save not"...  If you "NO" some (or all) of this "projects" and then "reopen" the based JPEG or PNG you get this dialog... I NEVER saved or even OVERWRITE this ORIGINAL jpg/png... nope. But when reopening (from finder) i get often this message...

I am not quite sure I understood all of that, but if you are saying you always get a 'recovery file exists' message of some sort, that is not normal -- like @stokerg mentioned, that should only happen if the app crashes, & that is how it does & always has worked for me.

The recovery temp file should be (& is for me) deleted whenever a document is closed normally, whether saved or not. If the app crashes with open files (saved or not) & these temp files are not deleted. The next time the app starts up, it checks for undeleted recovery files. It used to be that on startup there was always a notice about that, whether or not I tried to open a saved file with a matching recovery file. But now it seems the notice appears only if I try to open one of those files.

Also, the recovery files contain the serialized changes made since the last save (if there was one), so they are not necessarily the same as the last saved version or usable on their own.

[Polygonius]

41 minutes ago, R C-R said:

...but if you are saying you always get a 'recovery file exists' message of some sort, that is not normal -- like @stokerg mentioned, that should only happen if the app crashes,...

in 1.7 i get VERY often a 'recovery file exists' WITHOUT crash or similar. Sometimes i get "there are 3 recovery files"... when reopen AP-beta WITHOUT any crash! As "prompt" before doing anything... Maybe it crashes "intern" and writes this "backups" but the app itself seems be stable? Obvious, maybe system-special... but try by yourself: Open several pics, do some edits like recolor in ech "file", close APitself, say NO to all docs...  and then re-open one of this pics... i get often this messages????

Maybe the JPG/pngs itself are set to not "overwrite" (read only)... but exact this finder-setting should do the opposite????  A "cannot save, cause its forbidden..."????

in normal close? When "pseudo-crshing, this box will of course not appear... but waht will happen than...???

As said i NEVER ever "stored anything" in any kind. Just playing TEMPORALLY with SOME (jpg/png) files "at once" (in the same session, but as separate "doc")..

[Old Bruce]

43 minutes ago, R C-R said:

but if you are saying you always get a 'recovery file exists' message of some sort, that is not normal -- like @stokerg mentioned, that should only happen if the app crashes, & that is how it does & always has worked for me.

I have saved, closed a document and quit the application only to see the recovery file available dialog on starting up again later. This happens often enough to be noticeable but no where near every time.

[R C-R]

29 minutes ago, Polygonius said:

in 1.7 i get VERY often a 'recovery file exists' WITHOUT crash or similar.

Wait! Are you talking about the Affinity Photo beta? If so, why are you not posting all this to the beta forum?