Affinity.help Suggestion

[debraspicher]

I know that we can look at the URL to get the manual's version information and I've been utilizing this fine, but it would be really helpful for us at a glance to have in the header which manual we are currently looking at, V1 or V2. Even something as simple as a graphic in the sidebar as a bg. That's not the best route to take as far as accessibility/ARIA is concerned, but it is an option visually.

DuckDuckGo (I don't know about Google...) tends to return V1 results organically and so we are often sent to both manuals when doing out-of-app searches.

I do rather like the main page as well as the domain name. It is easy to remember.

I do type it in sometimes by hand to access as a reference when away from the PC. As a chronically busy person and a raiser of a little being, it can be sluggish to have to access this way on mobile as I have to type it in. It's not a deal breaker, just hard to be quick with a search through the manual via DDG will not always pull up the correct manual. Anyway, some very basic navigation would be helpful up top in the webpages. In the very least, adding a link can be a nod to V1 users, "Using V1 instead of V2?", etc that way they are still acknowledged.

[MikeTO]

Agreed and Google does give more priority to v1 help, probably because that's been around longer and there are more links to it. But instead of 'branding' the pages perhaps just change their titles. For example, this search query returns the Photo v1 page first as a featured snippet and the photo v2 page below, but they look identical and the unique part of the URL is hidden. You can't tell whether these pages are v1 or v2, or even which app they're for. Perhaps the page title could be changed so that it appears in Google as "Applying adjustments - Affinity Photo 2 Online Help".

https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q="applying+adjustments"+"affinity+photo"&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

 

[debraspicher]

8 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

Agreed and Google does give more priority to v1 help, probably because that's been around longer and there are more links to it. But instead of 'branding' the pages perhaps just change their titles. For example, this search query returns the Photo v1 page first as a featured snippet and the photo v2 page below, but they look identical and the unique part of the URL is hidden. You can't tell whether these pages are v1 or v2, or even which app they're for. Perhaps the page title could be changed so that it appears in Google as "Applying adjustments - Affinity Photo 2 Online Help".

https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q="applying+adjustments"+"affinity+photo"&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

 

I actually like that the pages themselves are generally unbranded. It's more that on mobile, there's no title visible usually. And in many cases, people don't use title bars in their browsers. It's usually just a tab and a URL, so it's not easy to see which version the manual is in truncated tab text. A simple link or just a small icon someone imo would suffice in the header itself. It wouldn't need to be dramatic branding. A background in the sidebar could be very subtle difference, but again, not helpful for screen readers.

A unique favicon might help though (the icon for the site). That might stray too far from preexisting branding and maybe too hard to see for certain users if it has to say explicitly "V1" or "V2".

[v_kyr]

44 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

this search query returns the Photo v1 page first as a featured snippet and the photo v2 page below

Well you have to be more specific with your search terms, then you will also get better & more exact results! - First of all when we are talking here about the Affinity online help site, then restrict the search also to that ...

• site:affinity.help

... if you are only interested in "V2" help topics then tell the search engine so ...

• "V2"

... so for your before shown example, but this way ...

• "applying adjustments" "V2" "affinity photo" site:affinity.help

... you will only get V2 contents results ...

44 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

Perhaps the page title could be changed so that it appears in Google as "Applying adjustments - Affinity Photo 2 Online Help".

That would give back then even better search result matches here! - Though people overall have to learn how to make use of the search capabilities of modern search engines first and thus knowing how to express search criterias the right way in order to find what they are after. - This is essentiell here!

So take also a look at ...

• https://help.duckduckgo.com/duckduckgo-help-pages/results/syntax/
• How to search on Google (see also the advanced topics there)
• ... etc ...

 

[debraspicher]

17 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

Well you have to be more specific with your search terms, then you will also get better & more exact results! - First of all when we are talking here about the Affinity online help site, then restrict the search also to that ...

• site:affinity.help

... if you are only interested in "V2" help topics then tell the search engine so ...

• "V2"

... so for your before shown example, but this way ...

• "applying adjustments" "V2" "affinity photo" site:affinity.help

... you will only get V2 contents results ...

That would give back then even better search result matches here! - Though people overall have to learn how to make use of the search capabilities of modern search engines first and thus knowing how to express search criterias the right way in order to find what they are after. - This is essentiell here!

So take also a look at ...

• https://help.duckduckgo.com/duckduckgo-help-pages/results/syntax/
• How to search on Google (see also the advanced topics there)
• ... etc ...

 

This topic is not really about how to use search. It's about the manual more clearly showing which version is which when viewing the site. @MikeTO very likely knows how to use search.

[v_kyr]

2 minutes ago, debraspicher said:

This topic is not really about how to use search. It's about the manual more clearly showing which version is which when viewing the site. @MikeTO very likely knows how to use search.

As said and I didn't meant Mike specifically here, but people here in the forum in general, I just/only jumped on of what Mike showed as a search. - If used the right way people will of course only see and get V2 related contents pages. If people also want to see on the help pages themself that they are on the right contents place, then what Mike suggested is a good addon and way to go.

But beside all that people should generally learn how to perform concrete internet based searches and how to do an overall better information retrival on the net (as also the forum and all related Affinity informations here)!

[debraspicher]

6 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

As said and I didn't meant Mike specifically here, but people here in the forum in general, I just/only jumped on of what Mike showed as a search. - If used the right way people will of course only see and get V2 related contents pages. If people also want to see on the help pages themself that they are on the right contents place, then what Mike suggested is a good addon and way to go.

But beside all that people should generally learn how to perform concrete internet based searches and how to do an overall better information retrival on the net (as also the forum and all related Affinity informations here)!

I understood this, but "the forum" has enough issue(s) with threads being sidetracked with soap-boxing as it were. I understand for some, they're seeing this as a way to create unique discussion. It's just there's a fine line where this can be really helpful, but other times, become a bit of an annoyance because it's inserting unnecessary friction into discussions that are actively attempting to be on-topic. That's where a large amount of headbutting for people comes from (imo), because it  leads to confusion and can also lead to people feeling they're being grossly misunderstood. Anyway, this wasn't about whether a person can or not use search. My suggestion was more about how difficult it is to tell if the information they are looking at it is even relevant to them. If that makes sense.

[debraspicher]

Can y'all see which manual is which? Both are screenshots of the fold. Same topic at a glance, V1 & V2.

&&


 

[v_kyr]

7 hours ago, debraspicher said:

Can y'all see which manual is which?

Yes I can, but I'm a long time user who often referenced those things, when pointing people to the online help. So I recognize the bottom image part from V1 while sleeping and I also know finer textual differences as "Types of Layers - from V1" in contrast to "Layer types - from V2" here and thus can distinguish between versions.

Another point related to the help texts is, that those are part of the apps help system and just taken over by Serif to the web too as online references here. Thus those always have to be in sync here then (the app internal help & online help). Meaning the app internal help is the base important one here which has to carry those changes over then.

Further since the V1 apps aren't sold any longer, their online help may also disappear too one day, since then being obsolete either way for the actual newer apps. Another point is that there are a bunch of redundances between V1 and V2 help texts, meaning they tell pretty much the same here and V2 texts do just list/tell the additions made here. - So it's questionable if and how long Serif will keep all app versions texts online, instead of just showing the actual apps help online. As it's additional work for them to keep up the older version help texts always too here.

All in all, Serif has to decide whether the extra effort for a better overview and separation of the help content is worth it for them and their user base.

 

 

[MikeTO]

10 hours ago, debraspicher said:

@MikeTO very likely knows how to use search.

AltaVista rules!

[Alfred]

12 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

AltaVista rules!

Don’t forget HotBot!!

[v_kyr]

26 minutes ago, MikeTO said:

AltaVista rules!

Yahoo once upon a time acquired Inktomi and Overture for more than $2 billion. Overture also owned the Altavista search engine at the time. - In the pasts I had to program a lot with the Inktomi search API, so maybe that's why I'm always very picky about searching in general and search engines etc. in particular. 😉

[debraspicher]

3 hours ago, MikeTO said:

AltaVista rules!

 

2 hours ago, Alfred said:

Don’t forget HotBot!!

Not sure which example is more dated. Hotbot I seem to remember being more obscure in the US.