"Enable transform origin" often impossible: the "+ within a circle" origin is nowhere

[Lobivia]

Hi  (from a beginner)

Context: I want to rotate of a few degrees a part of raster image
1- I "rectangular select" the part of the image I want to rotate.
2- I select the "move" tool. The corresponding settings appear in the top horizontal "setting bar", especially the "Enable transform origin"
3- I click the "Enable transform origin" and the button becomes grey as expected.

The bug (my bug or photo bug?): Very often (i.e., not systematically! See exceptions below) the small icon "+ within circle" appears nowhere within the image and it is thus impossible to set the origin of the trenaformation. Whatever I unselect and redo steps 1 to 3, I disable and re-enable the "trasnform origin", the "+ within circle" does not appear.
NB: I have even placed a horizontal and a vertical guide to locate the middle of the selected rectangle where the "+ within circle" should appear at first, and it is lacking! My eyes are thus not faulty, I guess…

Exceptions:
— After launch of Photo the "enable tarnsform origin" is always working properly at first use. I use this trick to recover the "transform origin" by storing my file, quiting Photo, and restarting Photo. But this is time consuming!
— If, after unsuccesful attempts to enable transformation origin, I decide to make some other operations (Paint brush, clone brush, persepctive tool…), and then I come back to steps 1-3 above, sometimes (not always!) the "+ within circle" origin is again available! However the availabilty seems to take place at random…

Suggestion: I think that the "transform origin" should be enabled by default (not disabled by default!). I even consider that it should be always enabled: who would really needs to disable this origin? If I remember well, it is always enabled in Photoshop…

Final Remark: sorry for my Frenglish…

Have a good week-end!

 

 

[Old Bruce]

Nice catch. The bug is showing up on the second use of the Enable Transform Origin crosshair. After using it once to rotate a Marquee selection, any new marquee selection will have the origin offset by some weird math.

Example; I moved the Transform origin over to the right and down then rotated the marquee selection around this. The next selection I made has the transform origin much much farther to the right and down. In my tests the second use had the initial origin outside of the canvas. So what I have to do is zoom way out and rotate the marquee selection, being zoomed out far enough I can see the location of the Transform Origin. Now I just have to move the marquee selection up and to the side so the Transform Origin is on the document/canvas and I can see it and double click it to set it back to the middle of the Marquee selection.

[Lobivia]

Happy to learn that I am not bind, that it is a real bug, and that is reproduced by somebody else!

IWhen writing my initila post I was thinking of waht I had observed, and I vaguely rememebr that sometimes, I have found the "origin" somewher far from the expected location…

I will be even more happy when the bug will be corrected…

PS: I really wonder which "weird math" is used to locate the new loctaion of the origin; I could then use some Mathematic code lines to predict where I should search… 🤣

[Lobivia]

… not BLIND instead of not bind!!! (Maybe I am really blind after all!)

[Old Bruce]

9 minutes ago, Lobivia said:

PS: I really wonder which "weird math" is used to locate the new loctaion of the origin; I could then use some Mathematic code lines to predict where I should search… 🤣

Near as I can tell it is in the same general "direction" but I don't know how it winds up so very far away in total distance. I just zoomed out and tried finding it as I rotate the selection, may have to zoom out a few times.

[loukash]

4 hours ago, Old Bruce said:

After using it once to rotate a Marquee selection, any new marquee selection will have the origin offset by some weird math.

It seems that it's only if you have moved the origin manually. The X,Y offset will be +3000 something px.

[Lobivia]

Hi

Loukash: how to move the origin other than manually? (I am a beginner!!!)

Both of you: How to alert some Affinity developpers(s)?

[loukash]

3 hours ago, Lobivia said:

Loukash: how to move the origin other than manually? (I am a beginner!!!)

What I meant: Technically by clicking one of the "anchor" nodes on the bounding box proxy in the Transform panel. Those will then become your origin.

3 hours ago, Lobivia said:

Both of you: How to alert some Affinity developpers(s)?

Since this post is in the Bugs section, Serif staff will eventually chime in, confirm and log the bug internally.

[Lobivia]

Thanks Loukash!

Just a further remark concerning the use of the bounding box in the Transform panel. An even simpler method consists in forcing the anchor to the corner opposite to that you "rotate" by "Ctrl-rotate" this corner. This works whatever the corner selected in the Transform panel. But that is only a trick, and I need an anchor which is often not a corner even though it is not so far.

Finally, you teached me a new verb: "chime in". Besides technical discussions, this forum is very helpful to upgrade my poor English………   😄

[loukash]

43 minutes ago, Lobivia said:

this forum is very helpful to upgrade my poor English

Oh, English is also only my 3rd language. Over 20 years of using the internet is quite a good English course.  

[Lobivia]

3rd language!!?? Wow! French, my native language, is sometimes my 1st foreign language… 🥴
Where are you from? Yes, I know this is off topic!

[loukash]

Oh, 1st language Czech, 2nd German. Actually I also fluently speak the Swiss German dialect which is "technically" almost a language on its own. And as a native Czech, I have no problems to read and even speak the Slovak language. So English would be my 5th language, haha.
40 years ago I also had some French in school but at that time I was still too busy learning German so there's not much French knowledge left. At best some passive reading.

[Lobivia]

Some final (???) news about the situation:

It seems that the bug is specific to Mac Platform. Another user told me that it is not observed under Windows OS.
My computer: MacBook Pro, M1 pro processor, 16GB, OS Ventura 13.1; Affinity photo 2.0.3

[Dan C]

Hi @Lobivia,

Thanks for your report and our sincerest apologies for the delayed response here. We are exceptionally busy following the release of V2 and we thank you for your continued patience and understanding here.

I can confirm I have been able to replicate this issue and a few others regarding Transform Origin and Selections & have logged these with our developers.

I hope this helps

[Lobivia]

Thanks Dan!

[lovelyjubbly]

On 2/7/2023 at 2:24 AM, Dan C said:

Hi @Lobivia,

Thanks for your report and our sincerest apologies for the delayed response here. We are exceptionally busy following the release of V2 and we thank you for your continued patience and understanding here.

I can confirm I have been able to replicate this issue and a few others regarding Transform Origin and Selections & have logged these with our developers.

I hope this helps

Hello - is there any update with this?  Also, once the origin goes so far astray, how do you get it to re-set itself?  Toggling on and off doesn't work.  Thanks!

[Dan C]

I can confirm these are unfortunately still logged with our developers to be resolved at this time - in regards to resetting the origin, it will likely depend on the layer type you are using and the specific workflow that caused the origin to be displaced.

Can you please verify the workflow you are taking when this occurs? If possible a screen recording or copy of your document showing this for me would help.

Many thanks in advance!

[Lobivia]

On 2/6/2023 at 1:24 PM, Dan C said:

I can confirm I have been able to replicate this issue and a few others regarding Transform Origin and Selections & have logged these with our developers.

Hi Dan,

Since you told me (see quote above) that you were able to replicate the issue, please refer to your own experience…😜
I am +or - a beginner and I don't know what you mean by "layer type" and "workflow"…

Anyway, thanks for your attention!

[Dan C]

Hi @Lobivia,

My apologies, the previous post above is for @lovelyjubbly and not yourself - as in my previous testing I found 4 separate instances of this issue, which were triggered by following a different set of steps for each, and therefore each have their own type of resolution which this user is looking for.

At this time, I don't require anything further from yourself, but I appreciate your response here

[lovelyjubbly]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:48 PM, Dan C said:

I can confirm these are unfortunately still logged with our developers to be resolved at this time - in regards to resetting the origin, it will likely depend on the layer type you are using and the specific workflow that caused the origin to be displaced.

Can you please verify the workflow you are taking when this occurs? If possible a screen recording or copy of your document showing this for me would help.

Many thanks in advance!

Hi Dan - I'm a newbie too, but to describe what I'm doing, it usually happens when I've selected two separate groups and then tried to move the origin and route around that origin.  I drag the cross hairs to where I want the origin to be, and then it just flies off in a random direction.  I then have to just move each group separately as I can't get the origin to re-set.  I'm using a MacBook Pro on the latest OS.  Thanks!

[Dan C]

17 hours ago, lovelyjubbly said:

it usually happens when I've selected two separate groups and then tried to move the origin and route around that origin.  I drag the cross hairs to where I want the origin to be, and then it just flies off in a random direction.

Thanks for this information provided! I've been able to replicate this behaviour here and it is slightly different from previous reports, therefore I am logging this as a new bug with our development team now.

17 hours ago, lovelyjubbly said:

 I then have to just move each group separately as I can't get the origin to re-set

Unfortunately in my testing, the only way to resolve this I have found is after moving the origin the first time and performing the initial rotation - select one (either should work) of the Groups in the Layers Studio, then use CMD+SHIFT+G to ungroup the objects, then use CMD+G to regroup these layers.

With this new Group created, select the second Group of objects and you should now find the Transform Origin is reset.

I hope this helps

[Lobivia]

Hi Dan & lovelyjubbly,

May I add a joke? I assume your answers are yes… The question is not "WHERE the origin is, but when…". Cf. Netflix series "Dark"… 😜

It seems that the issue is much more complicvated than expected on last January 20th… However, I hope that finding a solution will not require 33 years!

[lovelyjubbly]

On 5/16/2023 at 4:01 AM, Dan C said:

Thanks for this information provided! I've been able to replicate this behaviour here and it is slightly different from previous reports, therefore I am logging this as a new bug with our development team now.

Unfortunately in my testing, the only way to resolve this I have found is after moving the origin the first time and performing the initial rotation - select one (either should work) of the Groups in the Layers Studio, then use CMD+SHIFT+G to ungroup the objects, then use CMD+G to regroup these layers.

With this new Group created, select the second Group of objects and you should now find the Transform Origin is reset.

I hope this helps

Thank you Dan, that does work 🙂

[Affinity Info Bot]

The issue "Transform origin can randomly jump into a different location" (REF: AFP-5197) has been fixed by the developers in internal build "2.2.0.1951".
This fix should soon be available as a customer beta and is planned for inclusion in the next customer release.
Customer beta builds are announced here and you can participate by following these instructions.
If you still experience this problem once you are using that build version (or later) please reply to this thread including @Serif Info Bot to notify us.

[Affinity Info Bot]

The issue "Transform Origin with multiple Group selections cause the Origin to become offset after the first rotation, further transforms of the origin point do not work as expected." (REF: AFD-6606) has been fixed by the developers in internal build "2.2.0.1951".
This fix should soon be available as a customer beta and is planned for inclusion in the next customer release.
Customer beta builds are announced here and you can participate by following these instructions.
If you still experience this problem once you are using that build version (or later) please reply to this thread including @Serif Info Bot to notify us.