Weird glow around black images

[FAEGames]

I'm doing a PDF for a foil print. Everything that's foil has to be 100% black. That seems simple enough, but when exporting the black images or text there's a grayish glow around the black. It seems to be caused by the background, but of course I can't remove the background. This doesn't occur when using light colors. Any thoughts?

 

[stokerg]

Hi @FAEGames,

Could you attach your Affinity file for this?

Also, how were those lines created?  With a brush or the Pen Tool?  Also what are your PDF exporting settings that you are using?

[FAEGames]

Hi @stokerg, I've attached the file with all layers and images. I'm using the standard PDF/X-4 setting to export. Shown above are images and I'm using art text and regular text frames that exhibit the same behavior.

deluxe cover TEMPLATE.afpub

[thomaso]

4 hours ago, FAEGames said:

when exporting the black images or text there's a grayish glow around the black. It seems to be caused by the background, but of course I can't remove the background.

The gray edges seem to be caused by your Recolour Adjustment setting, which enlightens the formerly semitransparent areas of antialiasing.

[FAEGames]

16 minutes ago, thomaso said:

The gray edges seem to be caused by your Recolour Adjustment setting, which enlightens the formerly semitransparent areas of antialiasing.

That's correct! What would recommend to get a CMYK (0,0,0,100) black readjustment on all graphics? A levels adjustment seems to end up in the same situation.

[JimmyJack]

There are several ways. Just one is...

Since you're already dealing with raster images how a bout using an FX overlay instead? (fyi, FXs will rasterize vectors)

[thomaso]

35 minutes ago, FAEGames said:

That's correct! What would recommend to get a CMYK (0,0,0,100) black readjustment on all graphics? A levels adjustment seems to end up in the same situation.

It depends what exactly you want to achieve respectively want to influence, here for instance the antialiasing (which alters the visual details, the widths of the drawn lines).

For objects of layer type "(Curve)" the easiest / best would be to assign the desired colour directly. Note that any adjustment forces rasterisation on output. For raster image content I'd use a fill colour rather than an adjustment. Again, this requires rasterisation, turning your "image" layers into "pixel" layers.

If you want to have 100 % black only and avoid any transparency then you would have to decide what should happen with the antialiased areas: the can get filled with black or get cropped, both alters the visual impression, and also depends on the resolution / DPI.

[FAEGames]

Everything on the page will be a silver foil and the requirement from the print is those areas to be 100% black. So the areas can be rasterized but shouldn't display any other colors. Any alteration would be fine given this color restriction.

[thomaso]

5 hours ago, FAEGames said:

Everything that's foil has to be 100% black.

6 minutes ago, JimmyJack said:

how a bout using an FX overlay instead

An overlay combines one color with the existing colors underneath. So, if the OP's production process demands 100% Black only (= no gray, no cmy) than the overlay FX would require more steps to get there.

[FAEGames]

13 minutes ago, JimmyJack said:

Since you're already dealing with raster images how a bout using an FX overlay instead? (fyi, FXs will rasterize vectors)

 

Weirdly enough this doesn't give the same result with me

 

[JimmyJack]

29 minutes ago, thomaso said:

An overlay combines one color with the existing colors underneath. So, if the OP's production process demands 100% Black only (= no gray, no cmy) than the overlay FX would require more steps to get there.

If the FX Overlay was set to .... Overlay, then yes. But As Normal I believe it just replaces the color fill.

The Eyedropper seems to confirm this (original fill is the green in the well).

[thomaso]

A simple way to suppress CMY and output K only is via an according colour space & profile. Here fore instance with your Adjustment layer Off (compare the white detail in the leaves) set to Grayscale 8 bit with the Black & White profile. The output contains the K channel only but, different than expected, not 100 K only but includes gray again at the initial antialiased edges. – May be the foil production process will clip all colours below 100 K? Or turn them all to 100 K, too?

deluxe cover TEMPLATE_b&w-100K.pdf

[thomaso]

16 minutes ago, JimmyJack said:

But As Normal I believe it just replaces the color fill.

The Eyedropper seems to confirm this (original fill is the green in the well).

Interesting, and sounds logical. But here is what I get for a 100 K overlay Normal in this CMYK document. (regardless of background layer on/off)

[FAEGames]

24 minutes ago, thomaso said:

A simple way to suppress CMY and output K only is via an according colour space & profile. Here fore instance with your Adjustment layer Off (compare the white detail in the leaves) set to Grayscale 8 bit with the Black & White profile. The output contains the K channel only but, different than expected, not 100 K only but includes gray again at the initial antialiased edges. – May be the foil production process will clip all colours below 100 K? Or turn them all to 100 K, too?

deluxe cover TEMPLATE_b&w-100K.pdf 62.04 kB · 0 downloads

But how would you keep the purple background then? Then the edges will be (55,0,55,67) for example. I'll just go and ask the printer.

[FAEGames]

2 minutes ago, thomaso said:

Interesting, and sounds logical. But here is what I get for a 100 K overlay Normal in this CMYK document. (regardless of background layer on/off)

 

It seems as if @JimmyJack has something different from us, because I get your results as well.

[JimmyJack]

1 hour ago, thomaso said:

Interesting, and sounds logical. But here is what I get for a 100 K overlay Normal in this CMYK document. (regardless of background layer on/off)

 

1 hour ago, FAEGames said:

It seems as if @JimmyJack has something different from us, because I get your results as well.

🤣 Here we go with Affinity again. On the image below the selected object says 100k (on top of the original green shown to the left) but is clearly showing a rich black on screen. The object to it's right is a duplicate but I nudged the slider off of and then back to 100K. Are we having fun yet 😂 🤣 😂
(edit: I am in Designer btw)

But Just try it with any color. You'll see that the fill is that color and not a combination with what's beneath (when set to normal).

[iconoclast]

If you add a Levels Adjustment Layer to the Group with the Recolour Layer and drag the Gamma Slider to "0", the objects and the texts will become pure black without those outlines. But not really sharp. Just try it.

[JimmyJack]

@FAEGames Sorry didn't see one of your posts. 

You have to Rasterize the image first before using the FX.

Another simple way to achieve what you want without the recolor is to nest a color field (rectangle) of 100%k as a child of the artwork (also needs rasterization first. Welcome to Affinity)

I've attached a PDF using the FX method. No glow. (at least in Preview, Acrobat or on web browsers)
BUT..... the white in the leaves is missing. That's fixable..... but another topic

 

Edit: originally posted the wrong file. Now corrected

deluxe cover TEMPLATE 2.pdf

[JimmyJack]

@FAEGames head smack moment here.... are you trying to get rid of the anti-alaising while maintaining 100K?? Or do you want to keep the soft edge and just get rid of the "glow"?

[thomaso]

53 minutes ago, FAEGames said:

But how would you keep the purple background then? Then the edges will be (55,0,55,67) for example. I'll just go and ask the printer.

Good idea to ask the printer.  If you export the objects for foil print together with the purple background then its 50% black will appear in the black ink channel, too, not the foil content only.

[thomaso]

34 minutes ago, JimmyJack said:

🤣 Here we go with Affinity again. On the image below the selected object says 100k (on top of the original green) but is clearly showing a rich black on screen.
The object to it's right is a duplicate but I nudged the slider off of and then back to 100K. Are we having fun yet 😂 🤣 😂

Wow. Indeed, after moving the slider back and forward the picker says 100 K. What a weird interface.

Does one know if this was ever reported + logged as bug? @stokerg?

[FAEGames]

27 minutes ago, JimmyJack said:

@FAEGames head smack moment here.... are you trying to get rid of the anti-alaising while maintaining 100K?? Or do you want to keep the soft edge and just get rid of the "glow"?

@JimmyJack The second, I want to keep the soft edge and just get rid of the "glow". I BTW don't have Designer, only Publisher and Photo.

I'll also try your others methods.

[FAEGames]

58 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

If you add a Levels Adjustment Layer to the Group with the Recolour Layer and drag the Gamma Slider to "0", the objects and the texts will become pure black without those outlines. But not really sharp. Just try it.

You mean like below? Doesn't seem to make a difference for me.

[iconoclast]

I mean this below. For me it looks like it's making a difference.

[iconoclast]

Or, if you prefer Curves, try this: