Roman Rogner Posted February 2 Posted February 2 I made my zine with AP with monochrome photos. The printer keeps calling me saying the PDF is exported in CMYK and it needs to be in gray. What is the correct setting to print the document in monochrome? Thank you. Quote
NotMyFault Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Do you need 1bit pure black / white for a halftone print (not possible in Affinity apps), or 8 bit greyscale? Roman Rogner 1 Quote Mac mini M1 A2348 | MBP M3 Windows 11 - AMD Ryzen 9 5900x - 32 GB RAM - Nvidia GTX 1080 LG34WK950U-W, calibrated to DCI-P3 with LG Calibration Studio / Spider 5 | Dell 27“ 4K iPad Air Gen 5 (2022) A2589 Special interest into procedural texture filter, edit alpha channel, RGB/16 and RGB/32 color formats, stacking, finding root causes for misbehaving files, finding creative solutions for unsolvable tasks, finding bugs in Apps. I use iPad screenshots and videos even in the Desktop section of the forum when I expect no relevant difference.
Roman Rogner Posted February 2 Author Posted February 2 3 minutes ago, NotMyFault said: Do you need 1bit pur black / white for a halftone print (not possible in Affinity apps), or 8 bit greyscale? I don't know 🙂 I'm a beginner and I need to prepare a document with black and white photos for the printer... Quote
GarryP Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Trying to ‘fix’ one requirement at a time might be problematic and take a long time. If you ask your printer for a detailed list of all of their requirements, and post them here, then someone should be able to help you further. Roman Rogner 1 Quote
Ldina Posted February 2 Posted February 2 43 minutes ago, Roman Rogner said: I'm a beginner and I need to prepare a document with black and white photos for the printer... @GarryP's advice is right on. Most decent sized commercial printers usually have extensive, written specifications detailing all their PDF submission requirements. I'd look on their website, and if you cannot find them, ask the printer to send you their requirements. That will save you a lot of grief in the long run. Roman Rogner 1 Quote 2024 MacBook Pro M4 Max, 48GB, 1TB SSD, Sequoia OS, Affinity Photo/Designer/Publisher v1 & v2, Adobe CS6 Extended, LightRoom v6, Blender, InkScape, Dell 30" Monitor, Canon PRO-100 Printer, i1 Spectrophotometer, i1Publish, Wacom Intuos 4 PTK-640 graphics tablet
werfox Posted February 2 Posted February 2 Hi @Roman Rogner, until you get exact specification from your printer (and possibly share it here with us), you could try to export as PDF/X-1a with a Grey colour space: That means, all elements (be it text and/or images) will be converted into greyscale. Regardless of the colour space used in your document. Best regards Roman Rogner 1 Quote Affinity Publisher | Photo | Designer v1, v2 & v2 public beta running in a Windows 10 Pro VM (4 CPU cores + 8 GB RAM) on Ubuntu Linux (22.04 LTS) | Asrock DeskMini X300 | EIZO S2431W
lacerto Posted February 3 Posted February 3 Note though [if you end up converting to Grayscale] that if you currently have your text and solid blacks defined as K100, they will be converted to something like G5 (instead of G0), the exact value depending on the color profiles used. If you want to produce G0 black, the color definitions should be given in grayscale G0, or as RGB 0,0,0. The difference is not big but might be noticeable (here the converted K100 grays on top of true black): werfox and Roman Rogner 2 Quote
Roman Rogner Posted February 3 Author Posted February 3 13 hours ago, werfox said: Hi @Roman Rogner, until you get exact specification from your printer (and possibly share it here with us), you could try to export as PDF/X-1a with a Grey colour space: That means, all elements (be it text and/or images) will be converted into greyscale. Regardless of the colour space used in your document. Best regards Thank you! In the section Colour space I have only CMYK, not Grey, what am I doing wrong? Quote
werfox Posted February 3 Posted February 3 Could you provide a screenshot of your PDF export settings? There is a small but important difference in the Colour space drop down menu, depending on whether the layout document is set to CMYK (then "As document, CMYK, Grey" appear): or if the document is RGB/8 (then only "CMYK and Grey" appear as options): Quote Affinity Publisher | Photo | Designer v1, v2 & v2 public beta running in a Windows 10 Pro VM (4 CPU cores + 8 GB RAM) on Ubuntu Linux (22.04 LTS) | Asrock DeskMini X300 | EIZO S2431W
lacerto Posted February 3 Posted February 3 If you choose PDF/X-1a:2003, you basically need to have a press-based grayscale/black and white ICCs available to be able to choose Grayscale color space. On Windows there are by default none available (e.g., Dot Gain based ICCs become available with Adobe apps, and if you have other, they are ones that have been acquired separately). If appropriate grayscale profiles are not available, Gray option will not be available, explaining why CMYK will be the only option. However, if you want to force exporting to grayscale, you can do so by choosing e.g. PDF 1.7 (which is the most compatible of PDF versions that are available within Affinity apps) and then choose e.g. the generic Grayscale D50 profile that comes with Affinity apps, and to make the exported PDF DeviceGray, leave "Embed ICC profiles" box unchecked. This workflow would give you a PDF where you only have gray values. The problem with this method, as shown in my previous post, would be that if you have K100 definitions of black, they will be converted to dark gray, not G0. To fix this, you should have all native objects that you intend to be pure black as Grayscale values (G0) (they could also be RGB 0, 0, 0, but it is clearer to have them explicitly in grayscale, if not already RGB 0, 0, 0). An alternative option would be producing a CMYK PDF with output only on the K plate, and none on C, M and Y plates. Your printer most probably referred to an issue that your exported PDF has inadvertently had grays produced as "rich black" (not with mere K values, but mixing all four inks). This would happen if you have blacks specified in Grayscale or RGB. To keep grays and blacks in CMYK color mode and export as "non-rich", you need to specify them using K-values only. As you obviously do not have press-based grayscale profiles (and appropriate choices to choose the most suitable grayscale profile for the media you use, e.g. for uncoated paper), you would probably get best results if you choose the closest CMYK profile that fits the purpose (ask a recommendation from your printer, if you do not get any, choose U.S. Web Coated (SWOP) v2 if the media you use is coated, or U.S. Web Uncoated v2, if it is uncoated (these are kind of basic choices and I mention them because these profiles come with Affinity apps, so there is no need to download specific ICC profiles): You can check and change the document color profile by choosing File > Document Setup, and then activate the Color tab. When changing the profile, you can retain existing color values by making sure that you have the "Assign" tab selected when you press OK. Otherwise existing CMYK definitions of native objects change, and e.g. K100 definitions are translated to four-color black. If you use CMYK color mode, make sure that all native objects and text are defined in K-only color values, before exporting. It is important that you export using the document color profile, so make sure that you do not change the CMYK color profile when exporting, otherwise all CMYK values will be converted, and you again end up in getting four-color blacks and grays. As you can see, producing grayscale PDFs can be a challenge in Affinity apps. If your printer can give you some recommendations, they most probably cannot give detailed instructions because it is not likely that they know Affinity Publisher specific workflows and limitations. But once you know more, you are welcome to ask on the forum. Grayscale issues are well-known here and someone can certainly help you out producing what is required. Ldina and Roman Rogner 2 Quote
Roman Rogner Posted February 3 Author Posted February 3 1 hour ago, lacerto said: Pokud zvolíte PDF/X-1a:2003, v zásadě potřebujete mít k dispozici tiskové ICC ve stupních šedi/černobílé, abyste si mohli vybrat barevný prostor Stupně šedi. Ve Windows nejsou ve výchozím nastavení k dispozici žádné (např. ICC založené na Dot Gain budou dostupné s aplikacemi Adobe, a pokud máte jiné, jsou to ty, které byly získány samostatně. Pokud nejsou k dispozici vhodné profily ve stupních šedi, nebude k dispozici možnost Šedá , vysvětlující, proč bude CMYK jedinou možností. Pokud však chcete vynutit export do stupňů šedi, můžete tak učinit tak, že zvolíte např. PDF 1.7 (což je nejkompatibilnější z verzí PDF dostupných v aplikacích Affinity) a poté zvolíte např. obecný profil Grayscale D50, který je součástí aplikací Affinity. a chcete-li exportované PDF změnit na DeviceGray, ponechte políčko "Vložit profily ICC" nezaškrtnuté. Tento pracovní postup vám poskytne PDF, kde máte pouze šedé hodnoty. Problém s touto metodou je, jak je ukázáno v mém předchozím příspěvku, že pokud máte definice černé K100, budou převedeny na tmavě šedou, nikoli na G0. Abyste to napravili, měli byste mít všechny nativní objekty, které chcete mít čistě černé, jako hodnoty stupňů šedi (G0) (mohou být také RGB 0, 0, 0, ale je jasnější mít je explicitně ve stupních šedi, pokud již nejsou RGB 0, 0, 0). Alternativní možností by bylo vytvoření CMYK PDF s výstupem pouze na desku K a žádný na desky C, M a Y. Vaše tiskárna s největší pravděpodobností odkazovala na problém, že ve vašem exportovaném PDF se neúmyslně objevily šedé jako „sytá černá“ (ne s pouhými hodnotami K, ale smícháním všech čtyř inkoustů). To by se stalo, pokud máte černou specifikovanou ve stupních šedi nebo RGB. Chcete-li zachovat šedé a černé v barevném režimu CMYK a exportovat je jako „nebohaté“, musíte je zadat pouze pomocí K-hodnot. Protože zjevně nemáte profily ve stupních šedi založené na tisku (a vhodné možnosti výběru nejvhodnějšího profilu ve stupních šedi pro média, která používáte, např. pro nenatíraný papír), pravděpodobně byste nejlepších výsledků dosáhli, pokud byste zvolili nejbližší profil CMYK, který vyhovuje účel (požádejte o doporučení od své tiskárny, pokud žádné nedostanete, zvolte US Web Coated (SWOP) v2, pokud je médium, které používáte, potažené, nebo US Web Uncoated v2, pokud je nepotažené (toto jsou druh základních možností a zmiňuji je, protože tyto profily jsou dodávány s aplikacemi Affinity, takže není nutné stahovat konkrétní profily ICC): Barevný profil dokumentu můžete zkontrolovat a změnit výběrem možnosti Soubor > Nastavení dokumentu a poté aktivujte kartu Barva. Při změně profilu můžete zachovat stávající hodnoty barev tím, že se po stisknutí OK ujistíte, že máte vybranou kartu "Přiřadit". Jinak se stávající definice CMYK nativních objektů změní a např. definice K100 se převedou na čtyřbarevnou černou. Pokud používáte barevný režim CMYK, ujistěte se, že všechny nativní objekty a text jsou před exportem definovány v hodnotách pouze K. Je důležité, abyste exportovali pomocí barevného profilu dokumentu, takže se ujistěte, že jste při exportu neměnili barevný profil CMYK, jinak budou převedeny všechny hodnoty CMYK a opět získáte čtyřbarevné černé a šedé. Jak vidíte, vytváření souborů PDF ve stupních šedi může být v aplikacích Affinity výzvou. Pokud vám vaše tiskárna může poskytnout nějaká doporučení, s největší pravděpodobností nemůže poskytnout podrobné pokyny, protože není pravděpodobné, že by znala specifické pracovní postupy a omezení Affinity Publisher. Ale jakmile budete vědět více, můžete se zeptat na fóru. Problémy ve stupních šedi jsou zde dobře známé a někdo vám jistě může pomoci s výrobou toho, co je potřeba. Thank you very much! lacerto 1 Quote
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