Affinity does not import EPS files from MathType correctly

[pet_griffin]

Hi

I am using MathType to create mathematical equations.  These can be inserted as an object in Word and can also be exported as an EPS file for input to InDesign and (hopefully) Publisher.  Attached are PDFs of the resulting document created by Word, InDesign and Publisher as well as a PDF created by MathType.  I have also attached the eps file and the associated Publisher file. 

There's an issue with the Word PDF converter because the printed version is OK whereas the PDF version isn't .  However, the main issue is that Publisher doesn't do a very good job with the mathematical symbols in the equation, whereas InDesign is fine. I checked that the fonts mentioned in the EPS file are installed and they are.  Would appreciate any comments people might have - thanks!

publisher_mt.afpub mathtype_mt.pdf indesign_mt.pdf publisher_mt.pdf word_mt.pdf eqn_01.eps

[lacerto]

Yes, this works perfectly with Word and InDesign. We still use MathType 6.9a, which was the last non-subscription version of MathType, and on Windows. I have no experience of later versions, or working with macOS, so I am not sure if my advises are useful to you.

The problem with Affinity apps is that they do not support embedded fonts (text) within EPS files, so they convert text to curves, and do it inadequately, which is pretty fatal with equations, requiring accuracy. It seems Affinity apps cannot interpret properly the Microsoft Print to PDF created equations, either (but can place them correctly, I assume) -- but did I understand correctly that Microsoft Print to PDF created equations are some kind of workaround only?

On Windows it might be useful to try .WMF exports, though the problem is that they need to be manually resized and positioned (unlike EPS files that work fine when imported as inline graphics within Word and then e.g. mass replaced to linked EPS files using a script). WMF files also need to be converted from RGB to CMYK (K100), which is an additional nuisance.

I am not sure that I understand your workflow properly. We basically always convert all equations to MathType equations (in a batch), exporting to EPS, and leave original equations as inline graphics, import to InDesign along with Word files, and subsequently replace inline graphics with linked EPS files using a script.

UPDATE: As you mention Word and Microsoft Print to PDF generated PDF equations, your workflow probably is not strictly CMYK based, since these export methods produce RGB black. EPS workflow produces K100 black.

[pet_griffin]

Hi @lacerto

thanks for your comments.  Apologies for the confusion re workflow - I was just trying out different methods of generating the equation image in case readers of this post were not used to MathType (MT).  I am using WIndows 10 BTW.

My usual workflow with InDesign (ID) was to create the equation using MathType, save it as a EPS file and then place the EPS file in the ID document.  Occasionally, this caused ID to crash so I would use MS Print to PDF to produce a PDF of the equation from MT and then place the PDF.  I tried doing this with Affinity but it seemed to think that the resulting PDF was A4-sized which was not much use - might revisit this to check that I wasn't doing anything silly.  Will also check out your suggestion of trying a WMF file.

 

[Old Bruce]

Does MathType not export to PDF? That is what I would use instead of EPS which is being supported by fewer and fewer software makers as time marches on.

[kenmcd]

Other options...

Export PNG at 1200dpi from PDF:

 

Edited PDF and converted all text to curves.
Then cropped the PDF.

outlines from indesign_mt.cropped.pdf

Then converted the cropped PDF to an SVG.

outlines from indesign_mt.cropped.svg

That SVG looks like this in the browser:

Happened to use the ID PDF above, but it works the same with the MT PDF.

 

[lacerto]

5 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

Does MathType not export to PDF?

No. I think that the macOS version (v7 and after) do, which would be a viable option (if macOS is available). 

18 minutes ago, pet_griffin said:

PDF was A4-sized

The sheet size can be changed, but it is nevertheless always a fixed (pre-defined) size. 

[lacerto]

Before resorting to external measures, if raster format is ok, you can have MathType render your GIF image format equation exports with e.g. 900dpi, antialiased, and with transparency, and this is supported by Affinity apps:

...so you can generate hundreds of cropped, hires, antialiased and transparent equations just within a few seconds:  

[lacerto]

If you really need to have your equations retained as text, one option would be cropping the Microsoft Print to PDF oversized output using an appropriate PDF tool, and optionally convert the output to grayscale, while having the document in CMYK color mode and include color graphics, if wanted.

The tool that can do this, might cost a bit. I did it with Adobe Acrobat Pro (2020, perpetual license), but it can also be done with e.g. PDF.XChange, much cheaper non-subscription tool.

[pet_griffin]

Thanks all for your comments - looks like the easiest way to place equations in Publisher would be to export them from MT in high resolution GIF format.  It is possible to export MT equations in LaTex format but I get the impression that Publisher does not support LaTex (unlike Scribus, Affinity developers please note ...?
😉), so this is not much help

[joe_l]

13 hours ago, pet_griffin said:

I tried doing this with Affinity but it seemed to think that the resulting PDF was A4-sized which was not much use

Place the mathtype_mt.pdf and select "Minimum Content" from the top context toolbar.

[lacerto]

14 minutes ago, joe_l said:

Place the mathtype_mt.pdf and select "Minimum Content" from the top context toolbar.

Thanks, I had totally forgotten that option. Otherwise fine, but if you have italics, it tends to cut off a little bit from the corners:

[joe_l]

38 minutes ago, lacerto said:

Otherwise fine, but if you have italics, it tends to cut off a little bit from the corners:

Good catch! Haven't noticed this. Seems to be worth a bug report.

[pet_griffin]

Hi @joe_l

thanks for the tip re placing as "minimum content".  That reduced the bounding box of the PDF equation and the equation looks OK:

However, I get this pre-flight warning

I pressed "fix" but now get a bunch of errors:

and the placed PDF equation is all messed up

I guess I can ignore the pre-flight warnings but was wondering if there were any workarounds for this?

[joe_l]

4 minutes ago, pet_griffin said:

I guess I can ignore the pre-flight warnings but was wondering if there were any workarounds for this?

This kind of Preflight warning does not make totally sense to me. It just checks if the PDF version of the placed document fits the PDF version the last time a document was exported.

Regarding the missing fonts: Some PDF creators tend to show strange font names, which are not related to the real font names. @kenmcd knows it surely better? So I would say, place the PDF and have an eye on the PDF version during export.

[pet_griffin]

Ok - thanks.  Will do ...

[lacerto]

17 hours ago, joe_l said:

Regarding the missing fonts: Some PDF creators tend to show strange font names, which are not related to the real font names.

Affinity apps give the exact same warning when Adobe PDF is used as the virtual printer and when explicit (native) PostScript names of the used (and system installed) TrueType fonts (TimesNewRoman Regular and Italic), and Symbol, are used. The warning might be related to use of subsets or CMap based character encodings in embedded fonts. In both cases fonts are passed just fine and equations rendered correctly. If the "issue" is fixed, the font dependency is lost and the equations are rendered incorrectly already on the canvas, and when subsequently exported.

UPDATE: I subsequently tested with PDF settings (both when using Adobe PDF and PDF/X-Change virtual printers) with no subsetting, and it has no effect on triggering of the PDF Preflight warning within Affinity apps. Oddly, when I forced PDF/X-1a (and only that, PDF/X-3 or PDF/X-4 will not do) from within Adobe PDF, the warning was not triggered (which in a way is logical, because embedded PDF/X-1a does produce very compatible package for K100/grayscale font-dependent equations).