Publisher 2 : Problem export PDf ( spreads or pages )

[kamelus]

Hi

I have a curious problem when exporting to PDF, if i export Spreads i have a correct result if i choose pages there is an overflow i can't explain see in my screen captures below

Export parameters : Spreads 

Result with spreads parameters : it's seem correct

Export parameters : pages

 

 

Result with pages parameters : it's not correct there is an overflow 

 

 

Can anyone explain what's wrong ?

And could you please tell me what parameter should i use to export for press ready ?

 

Thanks in advance for your help

[walt.farrell]

What are the Bleed settings for the document? And can you show us a screenshot of the spread in Publisher, please?

[kamelus]

7 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Quels sont les paramètres de fond perdu pour le document ? Et pouvez-vous nous montrer une capture d'écran de la diffusion dans Publisher, s'il vous plaît ?

Hi Walt 

thanks a lot for your help

Here is the bleed parameter 

And the page in publisher

 

 

Is it what you asked for ?

 

[kamelus]

Hi Walt 

i think i have found the problem

When in Frame properties i choose "Size Frame to  content" here is the result and i think that the problem is here

 

If i adjust manually and export again the result is correct

Is it the right method to correct my issue ?

Sincerly am a newbie on Affinity publisher and somthings are not clear for me

My last question is wich option i have to choose if i want to export PDF to Press ready , it's a book ?  Spreads or pages  ?

[kamelus]

15 minutes ago, kamelus said:

Hi Walt 

i think i have found the problem

When in Frame properties i choose "Size Frame to  content" here is the result and i think that the problem is here

 

If i adjust manually and export again the result is correct

Is it the right method to correct my issue ?

Sincerly am a newbie on Affinity publisher and somthings are not clear for me

My last question is wich option i have to choose if i want to export PDF to Press ready , it's a book ?  Spreads or pages  ?

 

No it doesn't work finally i don't undersand what "Size Frame to  content" mean 

[walt.farrell]

I'm not sure what to say. In the first screenshot in your post 2 above this one, clearly the image on the right page is extending onto the left page, which (I think) would explain why it's visible in the bleed area of the left page when you export it. So that seems correct to me. And my suggestion for that would be to not extend the image frame past the right page's bleed area. That is, don't extend the frame onto the left page, as you seem to have done.

As for export format: Pages, not Spread, is probably what you want.

[kamelus]

6 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Je ne sais pas quoi dire. Dans la première capture d'écran de votre message 2 au-dessus de celui-ci, il est clair que l'image de la page de droite s'étend sur la page de gauche, ce qui (je pense) expliquerait pourquoi elle est visible dans la zone de fond perdu de la page de gauche lorsque vous l'exportez. Donc cela me semble correct. Et ma suggestion pour cela serait de ne pas étendre le cadre de l'image au-delà de la zone de fond perdu de la page de droite. Autrement dit, n'étendez pas le cadre sur la page de gauche, comme vous semblez l'avoir fait.

En ce qui concerne le format d'exportation : Pages, pas Spread, est probablement ce que vous voulez.

Hi Walt

as you see on the screen below i didn't extended the image on the left or on the right

 

 

But the result when i export to PDF with pages is not correct

 

 

I don't understand why

[walt.farrell]

Can you share a .afpub file with those pages?

[thomaso]

@kamelus, simply set the inner bleed = 0 so that no area of the opposite page appears when exporting as single pages.

[kamelus]

34 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Pouvez-vous partager un . afpub avec ces pages ?

Hi Walt

 

here is the Afpub file ( light version ) because the original file is too big but with this i can reproduce the issue

 

KBFOTOART_LIVRE_QUOTIDIEN_PAYSAGE_V_L.afpub

[kamelus]

23 minutes ago, thomaso said:

@kamelus, simply set the inner bleed = 0 so that no area of the opposite page appears when exporting as single pages.

Hi Tomase

thanks for your Help, i didn't try that because as i learned the Bleed is important and if i set it to 0 may be it will generate a problem during the printing 

 

I want to you know the difference between exporting spreads or pages , because if i can exports in spreads mode and don't generate a problem when printeing my book i think ti can solve my problem as i learned it's better to export all pages instead all spreads but i didn't understand why

[Old Bruce]

22 minutes ago, kamelus said:

I want to you know the difference between exporting spreads or pages , because if i can exports in spreads mode and don't generate a problem when printeing my book i think ti can solve my problem as i learned it's better to export all pages instead all spreads but i didn't understand why

You'll want to talk to your printer, I bet the Printshop will want Pages not spreads.

You would maybe want to place the Picture frames so they go out to the bleed on the top, bottom and outside page of the spreads. Flush up to the inner / gutter side. Finally checkmark the Include Bleed and Include Printers marks. Then export and the Photos should extend past the page size and the crop marks will show what will be trimmed off.

By having the Picture Frame the size of the Page but not the bleed you run the risk of the printed pages having blank paper on one of the three sides (top, bottom and/or outside). This will happen when the paper isn't exactly printed then trimmed. The trimming is why the image must go beyond the page's edges (top, bottom, and outside).

[kamelus]

23 minutes ago, Old Bruce said:

You'll want to talk to your printer, I bet the Printshop will want Pages not spreads.

You would maybe want to place the Picture frames so they go out to the bleed on the top, bottom and outside page of the spreads. Flush up to the inner / gutter side. Finally checkmark the Include Bleed and Include Printers marks. Then export and the Photos should extend past the page size and the crop marks will show what will be trimmed off.

By having the Picture Frame the size of the Page but not the bleed you run the risk of the printed pages having blank paper on one of the three sides (top, bottom and/or outside). This will happen when the paper isn't exactly printed then trimmed. The trimming is why the image must go beyond the page's edges (top, bottom, and outside).

Hi Bruce 

if i undersand , pictures must be extanded to the bleed limit and not to page limit ? is it correct please could you if you can download the afpub above correct it and upload it on your answer ? it will be very kind of you. My original file has 200 pages and it's a huge work to correct all the pictures manually i want to be sure to avoid doing this work again and again it very kind of you and i want to thank you in advance

[Old Bruce]

13 minutes ago, kamelus said:

if i undersand , pictures must be extanded to the bleed limit and not to page limit ? is it correct...

Yes.

27 minutes ago, kamelus said:

could you if you can download the afpub above correct it and upload it on your answer ?

New Folder With Items.zip

This is how I would deal with full page images that need bleed. I would do away with the Picture Frames and just drag the images to the proper size. I use Picture Frames for images that will be smaller than the page.

I replaced the pictures with cheap and nasty screenshots and just drew a rectangle for the little image on the page with text. I included the PDF that I exported (pages, not spreads) with bleed and trim marks.

[thomaso]

29 minutes ago, kamelus said:

if i undersand , pictures must be extanded to the bleed limit and not to page limit ?

That is correct for all the outer edges. For a layout with a full page image you should increase the image frame at the 3 outer edges only but not at the 1 inner edge (spine) because then you would force the image to appear on the opposite page unintentionally.

That means a full page image which does not exceed the page at the inner edge must appear in the bleed of the opposite page.
If you don't want it to appear there (e.g. for a special use of the PDF) you can avoid this only if you set the inner bleed = 0. But for normal print process (e.g. as book) inner bleed and object appearance is as wanted and will be cut in the later process.

[kamelus]

8 hours ago, thomaso said:

That is correct for all the outer edges. For a layout with a full page image you should increase the image frame at the 3 outer edges only but not at the 1 inner edge (spine) because then you would force the image to appear on the opposite page unintentionally.

That means a full page image which does not exceed the page at the inner edge must appear in the bleed of the opposite page.
If you don't want it to appear there (e.g. for a special use of the PDF) you can avoid this only if you set the inner bleed = 0. But for normal print process (e.g. as book) inner bleed and object appearance is as wanted and will be cut in the later process.

Hi Thomaso thanks a lot to take a time to help me.

 

I replaced the pictures frames by dragging directly the picture as you have recommanded ( i have to confess that this solution mean that i have to change 200 pages of pictures in my book it's a huge work and other problem is that with a picture frame i can control the size fit of the image not on draggin the image only, anyway ) anyway , i have extended the limit at the 3 outer edges as you have suggested , the result is the same as you see, the image  appear on the opposite page unintentionally.

 

Did i made something wrong ?

Thanks Tomaso

 

[thomaso]

16 minutes ago, kamelus said:

Did i made something wrong ?

It depends what look you want to achieve. It is a little guessing with your screenshots only (I can't open Affinity V2) without seeing page vs bleed edges. Thus it gets more clear if you export with crop marks since they will indicate page vs bleed areas. (compare the PDF exported by @Old Bruce)

On the left page the gray gradient appears not to cover the bleed though the layout implies it should. If it should then increase this frame on its 3 outer edges.

The right brownish image looks smaller than the right 3-clock image, I assume they both shall be full page images. If yes, they both also should cover the bleed on their outer edges. If they don't (as e.g. the gray gradient currently) than the printed result might show a thin paper white border if the cutting machine doesn't cut 100 % perfectly. (By the way, this is what bleed was invented for: to avoid visible 'flickering' of full page images or background colours caused by imperfect cutting. Thus you print more of your full page image to have some* printed / inked area to cut. This *some is the width of the bleed.)

The spine (= inner page edges) appear to be okay in your last screenshots: they show a full page image + the part of the opposite page which represents the bleed. Again, the bleed will be cut + the spine will be bound and thus slightly hide eventually imperfection.

If you want to (or currently have) the full page images in your layout partially placed on the opposite page then you can do that of course, too. The printed result will show it accordingly. (like in your screenshot with text and image overlapping).

There is one design aspect I would call "wrong": the small distance between the text and the spine. Depending on the bind technique it may make it hard to see the full text in the printed result because it slightly "disappears" in the possibly curved page centres of the final bound result (or may require to press the medium to make it fully flat).

Yes, I agree, if your initial (or current) layout has the full page images placed to the page edge only then you should (or will even have to, if your printer complains / demands) increase the frames so the images cover the bleed at their three outer edges, too. And yes, at 200 pages this is an unpleasant work (but, you may admit, it could have been avoided from the beginning / will not happen to you again).

[kamelus]

14 hours ago, thomaso said:

It depends what look you want to achieve. It is a little guessing with your screenshots only (I can't open Affinity V2) without seeing page vs bleed edges. Thus it gets more clear if you export with crop marks since they will indicate page vs bleed areas. (compare the PDF exported by @Old Bruce)

On the left page the gray gradient appears not to cover the bleed though the layout implies it should. If it should then increase this frame on its 3 outer edges.

The right brownish image looks smaller than the right 3-clock image, I assume they both shall be full page images. If yes, they both also should cover the bleed on their outer edges. If they don't (as e.g. the gray gradient currently) than the printed result might show a thin paper white border if the cutting machine doesn't cut 100 % perfectly. (By the way, this is what bleed was invented for: to avoid visible 'flickering' of full page images or background colours caused by imperfect cutting. Thus you print more of your full page image to have some* printed / inked area to cut. This *some is the width of the bleed.)

The spine (= inner page edges) appear to be okay in your last screenshots: they show a full page image + the part of the opposite page which represents the bleed. Again, the bleed will be cut + the spine will be bound and thus slightly hide eventually imperfection.

If you want to (or currently have) the full page images in your layout partially placed on the opposite page then you can do that of course, too. The printed result will show it accordingly. (like in your screenshot with text and image overlapping).

There is one design aspect I would call "wrong": the small distance between the text and the spine. Depending on the bind technique it may make it hard to see the full text in the printed result because it slightly "disappears" in the possibly curved page centres of the final bound result (or may require to press the medium to make it fully flat).

Yes, I agree, if your initial (or current) layout has the full page images placed to the page edge only then you should (or will even have to, if your printer complains / demands) increase the frames so the images cover the bleed at their three outer edges, too. And yes, at 200 pages this is an unpleasant work (but, you may admit, it could have been avoided from the beginning / will not happen to you again).

Hi Thomaso

 

i did what you said ( i have to confess except removing the picture frames )

 

here is the result with the quotes mark

 

and the PDF generated with the printing marks

 

what do you thing ?

 

KBFOTOART_LIVRE_QUOTIDIEN_PAYSAGE_V_L.pdf

[thomaso]

Yes! This is a perfect use of bleed. And also the text width looks more safe with its larger margin to the spread centre / pages spine.

For the final print PDF you should ask your print provider for the required export settings, respectively with or without crop marks, as recommended before by @Old Bruce.

[ If you haven't done the image frame bleed adjustments to all 200 pages already:
You could alternatively try to get all content increased by the bleed size via the "Spread Setup" in two steps:

1. Reduce the page sizes by the width of the bleed without scaling.
2. Resize the pages to their initial (and wanted) size but now with scaling activated.

This will reduce the amount of individual adjustments for the image frames. But note, it also increases in step 2. all other objects of the spreads. ]

Edited December 26, 2022 by thomaso

[kamelus]

il y a 31 minutes, thomaso a dit :

OUI ! C'est une utilisation parfaite du fond perdu. Et aussi la largeur du texte semble plus sûre avec sa plus grande marge au centre de la page.

Pour l' impression finale du PDF , vous devez demander à votre fournisseur d'impression les paramètres d'exportation requis, respectivement avec ou sans hirondelles, comme recommandé par@Vieux Bruce.

[ Si vous n'avez pas encore effectué les ajustements de fond perdu du cadre d'image sur les 200 pages :
vous pouvez également essayer d'augmenter tout le contenu de la taille de fond perdu via la "Configuration de la diffusion" en deux étapes :

1. Réduisez les tailles de page de la largeur du fond perdu sans mise à l'échelle.
2. Redimensionnez les pages à leur taille initiale (et souhaitée), mais maintenant avec la mise à l'échelle activée.

Cela réduira la quantité d'ajustements individuels pour les cadres d'image. Mais notez qu'il augmente également à l'étape 2. tous les autres objets des spreads. ]

Thanks Thomaso for your precious Help

 

But i Think that i will correct manually the adjustment to be sure to have the control of each page it's a lot of work but no matter hoping that the result will be here 

 

will let you know