New feature for brush tools.

[mac.]

Not sure if this already exists somehow, but had a thought it would be cool to be able to implement some sort of vector line so you can use a brush or imported brush to for perfect shapes. 

As in, you select a shape, you set up a 'vector' path, select the brush tool with whatever brush you want to use, then when you put your brush down on a drawing pad or click with a mouse it locks on to the 'vector' line so it cannot create a shape outside of the shape chosen. 

It would make drawing circles and set shapes much easier to create with the brush tool and if using a drawing pad, you could focus more on pressure instead of trying to draw the shape. Which is generally the main reason why this would be a good feature.
I don't think the Rectangle Tool has this feature but it could be an addition option when held down to choose from, and the shapes are already there. Maybe it could be a feature within the stroke line options?

If this is already a thing it would be cool if someone could direct me to it or a tutorial. 

Thanks.

[GarryP]

Welcome to the forums @mac.

This sounds like Vector Brushes, which are available in Designer, but I can’t be sure from the description – see attached image which is part of a page taken from the Help of Designer.
If you can give us some kind of visual example that might help us to figure out what you are looking for and whether it is already available.

Note: If you don’t know if something is already available then it’s better to ask a question about it in the Questions section of the forum, rather than making a Feedback thread.

 

[iconoclast]

I think mac. asks for a feature in Photo, that makes brush strokes trace vector curves, like there is e.g. in GIMP and as far as I remember in Photoshop too. As far as I see, there should be this option in Photo too, because there is this brush symbol in the stroke panel, that doesn't seem to have any effect. So I suppose this option already exists and it is simply a bug that it doesn't work.

[PaulEC]

13 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

there is this brush symbol in the stroke panel, that doesn't seem to have any effect. So I suppose this option already exists and it is simply a bug that it doesn't work.

I seem to remember that this has been raised before and is "by design" for compatibility. (Although you can't add a vector brush stroke in Photo, you can change a stroke (originally made in Designer) to a "normal" stroke, then go back to the vector stroke using this option in Photo.)

[GarryP]

13 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

that makes brush strokes trace vector curves

I don’t understand how that is different to Vector Brushes.
Do you mean that it applies Raster Brushes along a vector, or something else?
Can you give an example or a link to some documentation that explains it?

I think the Brush Button in the Stroke Panel in Photo is there because you can bring a document – which uses Vector Brushes – into Photo from Designer and the user can switch stroke-types back and forth but the user cannot apply new Vector Brushes, or something like that. Edit: Like what PaulEC said above.

Edited July 16, 2022 by GarryP

[PaulEC]

1 minute ago, GarryP said:

Like what PaulEC said above.

But I think you worded it better!

[iconoclast]

12 minutes ago, GarryP said:

I don’t understand how that is different to Vector Brushes.
Do you mean that it applies Raster Brushes along a vector, or something else?
Can you give an example or a link to some documentation that explains it?

I think the Brush Button in the Stroke Panel in Photo is there because you can bring a document – which uses Vector Brushes – into Photo from Designer and the user can switch stroke-types back and forth but the user cannot apply new Vector Brushes, or something like that. Edit: Like what PaulEC said above.

OK, thanks for that hint, I will check it out. But the obvious difference is that you have completely different brushes in Photo, with much more opportunities. I often miss the opportunity to trace shapes or pixel selections or very fine modelled curves with the very nice Photo Brushes, like I can easily do it in GIMP. In that case with GIMP Brushes, of course.

[GarryP]

9 minutes ago, PaulEC said:

But I think you worded it better!

I don’t think I worded it particularly well, but if either explanation gets the idea across reasonably well then that’s good enough for me.

----

It would be nice to hear back from the OP so we know what they are asking for rather than guessing.
If the request comes down to ‘Just do it like GIMP’ then that would be slightly disappointing for me, I prefer to see requests which ‘stretch’ current functionalities in interesting ways rather than simply ‘do what they do’, but a request is a request.

[iconoclast]

OK, I checked it and it seems that you are right. Nice option, even I'm not sure at the moment if I will ever need it. Possibly some kind of hint, a symbol or so, near the button, that it is only Designer-Brush-related, could prevent a lot of confusion about it.

Anyway, if the tracing option, I was talking about, really is what mac. suggests, I support his suggestion. Otherwise I would like to suggest it.

[PaulEC]

Of course, the best option would be if it were possible to use raster brushes, as well as vector, for strokes! (Which, I think, is what the OP was asking for!)

[iconoclast]

Just now, PaulEC said:

Of course, the best option would be if it were possible to use raster brushes, as well as vector, for strokes!

There may be technical reasons why this option doesn't exist yet, but it is not easy to understand for the average user. Even because most vector brushes in Designer aren't really vector brushes, but only pixel textures aligned to vectors. I think this should also be possible for Photo. And it would be desirable, I think, even because the brushes in Designer are much more limited than the ones in Photo.

[mac.]

Sorry for the delay, been busy valeting the car!

I'm terrible with describing things and apologies on this maybe being in the wrong place. I'm not very well acquainted with forums and rules.  

The vector brush is kind of what I'm talking about but from what I gather with that it doesn't include the 'lock' while drawing it yourself with a drawing pad or mouse. 
The vector brush seems limited, as in it's just using the vector path to imprint the brush style on. I could probably get close with it if you can change the pressure throughout the path line. I'm think you can as I've used it somewhere before but not sure whether that was in PS years ago. It just takes away from the physical creative aspect for me. 

The main point I was trying to get to was setting a vector path, then when using a drawing pad and pen the pen 'locking' to the vector path so you can't go outside of it and focus on the pressure and flow naturally. 
I'm not sure how else to word it. 
PaulEC I think, get's what I'm talking about with "raster brushes, as well as vector, for strokes!" Yeah, thinking about it this is what I'm talking about, I forgot that brushes were raster brushes! But having the ability to lock the raster brush to the vector path so you don't have to focus on accuracy.

Edited July 16, 2022 by mac.

[mac.]

2 hours ago, iconoclast said:

OK, I checked it and it seems that you are right. Nice option, even I'm not sure at the moment if I will ever need it. Possibly some kind of hint, a symbol or so, near the button, that it is only Designer-Brush-related, could prevent a lot of confusion about it.

Anyway, if the tracing option, I was talking about, really is what mac. suggests, I support his suggestion. Otherwise I would like to suggest it.

Yeah this is probably along the lines that I was meaning, like a tracing lock.

[iconoclast]

9 minutes ago, mac. said:

Yeah this is probably along the lines that I was meaning, like a tracing lock.

OK, but what I was talking about would mean, that you first draw the vector curve, then choose a brush and let Photo trace the curve with this brush. You wouldn't have much influence on the changing brush-thickness by pressure.

What you pointed out in your post before sounds like the vector as a sort of flexible magnetic guideline you are tracing manually. The only app I know that has something similar is ArtRage, where you can create stencils of the shape you need and use them as a magnetic guide. It is a very nice feature, but not exactly what I depicted above.

[mac.]

1 minute ago, iconoclast said:

You wouldn't have much influence on the changing brush-thickness by pressure.

Ah right, yeah I was meaning to have control over pressure without worry over accuracy. Do you mean like it does in Designer? 

 

 

3 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

the vector as a sort of flexible magnetic guideline you are tracing manually

This but it doesn't necessarily need to be vector, could be raster path too. I was just using vector paths as an example.  

[GarryP]

I thought I was close to understanding the requirements until the last couple of posts - I think I was way off.

It might be useful if you go through the process step-by-step explaining each step, one step/post at a time, garnering a consensus for each step before posting the next step, etc.
Otherwise it could get tricky with different people trying to understand and questioning different steps at the same time.

[mac.]

Okay. 
Ideally this would be when using a drawing tablet so you can apply different natural pressure.

Setting down a vector path or something like a raster path
Select a raster brush
When touching down on the pad, the brush would lock to this path providing the ability to trace the line perfectly

-This next section may be a bit of a stretch-
You wouldn't need to be accurate as you'd be locked to the vector/raster path but you'd need to somewhat follow the pattern e.g. up/down left/right so the program could recognise where it should be on the vector/raster trace path
Meaning you could purely focus on the pressure and getting the flow you naturally would produce.

I realise this is achievable via Designer with the vector path brushes there but as I mentioned before, just takes away from the natural flow when drawing. I can never quite get the pressure flow right with the Pressure function within the Stroke option. 

The amount of times I'm sat hovering over my Undo button on the pad, trying to perfect the perfect natural pressure flow, sometimes I get the line perfectly like I'd like it but the pressure is off so have to redo it. Thus, losing the perfect shape all to get the natural flow.  

Maybe I'm making a bit of a mountain out of a mole hill and it would be an obsolete feature but it would take away all the trail and error.

 

[iconoclast]

Is it something like this you are looking for? There are three modes: one uses the edge of the shape as middle axis for the brush stroke, on uses the edge as a guide and cut edge to the stroke, and one is simply like a mask. Only the first two ones are magnetic.

 

[mac.]

7 minutes ago, iconoclast said:

Is it something like this you are looking for? There are three modes: one uses the edge of the shape as middle axis for the brush stroke, on uses the edge as a guide and cut edge to the stroke, and one is simply like a mask. Only the first two ones are magnetic.

 

 

Imagine that the outline of that stencil is just a line or path, the brush that they would be using would be locked to the path line when the pen would be pressed onto the drawing tablet. 

[iconoclast]

1 minute ago, mac. said:

Imagine that the outline of that stencil is just a line or path, the brush that they would be using would be locked to the path line when the pen would be pressed onto the drawing tablet. 

As I said, the first two modes are magnetic, so that the brush strokes are locked to the edge you are tracing. You can see that if you take a look at the circle that represents the cursor. As long as it stays inside the stencil, it will follow its edge. The third mode is only something like a predefined mask. Not magnetic.

[mac.]

Yeah but it's not using the edge line as the centre point. Garry had it right, it would be something to the effect of a Vector brush but I'm talking about added the ability to control the pressure free hand but the brush be locked to the path line. 

I've done a very rough drawing to try simulate what I'm on about. Garry would be right in it's essentially Vector Brush but using the raster Brush instead and having it locked to a path. EDIT: but being able to draw to the vector or raster path instead of just assigning a brush to the vector line itself, as in Designer you can do.

You'd start by laying down the vector/raster path, whether it would be programmed to allow a raster brush on vector path or a new raster path for this purpose. 
There's the free hand line trying to follow the path line but obviously it's never going to be perfect (I also did it quickly with a mouse since my tablet isn't plugged in, so imagine there's different pressures along that line)
Then there's the locked to the path line brush where the programs recognised the pattern but locked the brush to the line so you don't have to worry about drawing the perfect circle while getting the pressure information down for the program. 
 

Edited July 16, 2022 by mac.

[iconoclast]

As I said and as you can see, the first mode uses the edge of the shape as the middle axis for the brush stroke. The second mode puts the stroke to outside the edge. The third one is definitely not what you are looking for.

[mac.]

1 minute ago, iconoclast said:

As I said and as you can see, the first mode uses the edge of the shape as the middle axis for the brush stroke. The second mode puts the stroke to outside the edge. The third one is definitely not what you are looking for.

It does, and that would be ideally what I was talking to. I was looking at the fact that the stencil covered half the area up, but I see what you're getting at now. 
It would be the first without the stencil erasing the other half of the brush.