Import file as new layer ++ Photo iPad

[bizbeblu]

Okay, I know I got here on the short bus, but this is driving me crazy. I cannot, in Photo iPad, open/import/place or whatever a file into a current project as a new layer. Past that, I'm not getting masking down right, and finally how do I protect a layer so I can work on another one without affecting others? I've known it as an "alpha lock" in other applications. Here in each layer one can choose "lock" -big red icon. Doesn't seem to do anything.

Seriously, I've searched, watched, read all the official stuff on iPad photo. Simply don't see it. Also checked elsewhere. There are multiple "You're a newbie so we'll help you out." Yet not a one of them addresses these questions - or if they do I've missed it.

 

I suspect a large part of my problem is that after 20 years of extreme combat with Ps, that's how I think things are done even though much of Ps demands are lame and/or stupid. The software you can work is better than the unknown you have to learn. (Similar to the sentiment: The spouse who beats me is better than an unknown.) I'd like to say that's not true, but… shrug. I will remark that in Affinity's direct competition - Procreate -this is a breeze. Had to fuddle for a bit but straight forward. Photo is much more powerful and precise, but if I can't master the layer - well can't use the program.

Won't go into detail as to why this is time critical other than to note it's part of an effort to keep our little town's old folk alive.

Thanks for any assistance.

Robert  Ajo, AZ

[MEB]

Hi bizbeblu,
Welcome to Affinity Forums
With the document open, go to menu Commands (the ellipsis icon on the top let of the interface) and select Place (either from Photos app or cloud). To lock a layer, select it, tap the menu icon in the Layer Studio label (on top) and select Lock. If you want to work on a layer without affecting the transparent parts (alpha lock) you can enable Protect Alpha for each tool that support it in the context toolbar on bottom (for example Paint Brush tool) or go to the Channels Studio and tap the pencil icon in the respective layer's alpha to protect it from being edited.
What issue are you having with masking exactly?

[bizbeblu]

Knew I was going to be right dumb! Wow. Thanks. Talk about service. I know I've successfully done that in the past, but I often figure a thing out then push on with the project w/o stopping to consolidate what I've learned. Okay, got the cloud background in place for the ladies - they really love sitting there in isolation. "It's like I'm in kindergarten with a coloring book and a huge set of crayons, except I NEVER MAKE A MISTAKE!"

The sky pix arrived in a new layer. It was above the foreground (labeled background by the interface.) i.e., the original file. Had to carefully move it up - layer manipulation seems rather picky. Fiddled aabit moving original layer above the import, selected mask, and I can paint the BG - that is the imported layer - without touching the foreground.

When I try to do the reverse - paint original image without infringing on the sky it fails, i.e., the lower/masked sky isn't protected. Tried setting lock with no joy. Yes, I've selected the proper layer. Do I have to release the first mask, reorder the layers, set a new mask to protect it? Thanks much.

Oh, and exactly what does "locking" do for the layer? I've come across it in the tutorials but narrator goes past without showing result.

Robert

[AllAppsUser]

The lock only seems to stop you moving things. That’s Objects on the layer, and the layer itself in the stack. (It does not stop you moving other layers that change its order though).
 

Locking a layer does not stop the other tools such as brush, smudge etc., etc., messing with the "locked" layer. Only the move tool seems ‘locked’ (I’ve not tested them all)

The "locked" layer’s ‘protection’ is minimal to near enough zero IMHO
 

I have no idea why it works this way - only stopping the move tool.

This software is at version 1... that means it has a long way to go yet. (I’m a user of Photoshop since that was at version 1...)

 

edit: I’m actually loving this software on the iPad. I’m accepting it has a lot of "foibles" in need of ironing out and learning to work with them.

[MEB]

@ProDesigner,
The lock prevents the layer from being selected (and thus transformed/edited) on canvas only. If you select a locked layer from the Layers panel (which we consider a deliberate action) you can still edit it/paint on it without having to unlock it first (but not transform it - move, scale etc). This is by design.

[AllAppsUser]

Thanks for the clarification @MEB.

I think this is what @bizbeblu may be struggling with.

Me, I wasn’t even aware you could choose layers from the canvas in Photo. (I know you can do it in Designer).

[bizbeblu]

Okay, got the lock - perhaps it needs a different or more precise name? To me, lock means can't touch. Am I alone in this?

 

Now, working on a piece. Got the sky. Still having to fiddle about a bit, but finally moved the original layer above the new cloud layer. I then said mask it. Befuddled me a bit till I realized I'd not erased anything on the masking layer so duh, couldn't see anything. Finally got that figured out so on to selection. Does it really take this many steps?

1. Proper layer selected
2. Tap selection icon
3. Tap "smart selection brush" from left menu side.
4. Carefully begin moving selection brush about. Can't get precision I need, but still learning?
5. Ready to cut out the selected piece.
6. With ants marching, change persona to photo.
7. Click the 3dot . . .
8. Select pasteboard -> cut
9. Change back to select persona
10. Back to 3dot -> deselect. Then reselect the "smart"  Begin anew. Slow.

Got to be a better way. Trying to "refine edges" overlays everything in red. Move cursor about. Click go. No change. Flood selection doesn't seem to do anything. Sigh, I'm obviously not holding my mouth right.

Again thanks.

And yes Pro, at it when there when Ps had no version number. Also Pagemaker. Had the rare distinction of submitting the first digitally produced/printed dissertation in University history to the little old lady who made sure the format was correct. She was a legendary curmudgeon. Doc students were terrified of her. "Your margins are 1/4" too wide." Went home to my "skinny Mac," changed margins, down to friend with the LaserWriter, reprint, showed up at her door. She wasn't happy to see me. Handed her the document - ≈240 pages, see gazed at it wide eyed, "How did you get this typed so fast?" Shrugged, "Didn't. Printed it out on a laser printer." With a horrified look she squawked, "The format specification clearly calls for a typewritten document. This isn't."

"No," I said. "It calls for a document with this font - Courier 9 point - and with this layout. Not a word about a typewriter." Took a couple of days, but wasn't a thing she could do. You have any idea how much money I saved not having type/retype/type/retype?

Having engaged in a bit of "back then," I've just started using Publisher. Outstanding. Worlds - no universes - improved over the original, and no MafiaRent. Done two small projects will do many more.

[AllAppsUser]

Locked.. sometimes

I'm with you on 'locked' means it's... locked..  not half locked, or sometimes locked. It's a bit like being half pregnant <- just doesn't work as a concept.

Also, if it's effectively unlocked by deliberately picking it, then surely the lock icon should disappear? It's unlocked, but still has a lock icon on it... keh, like why? Confusing.

I get their logic though, now it's explained. So I can work with it, and anyone who works with layers in a pro capacity will be disciplined with layers anyway. That's what it forces - a need for more discipline than in Ps. I'm cool with that.

Selecting things

That's the workflow I've ended up with.

I did think it was a right royal pain in the... at first. Especially as the 'Hide UI' is so easy to trigger with the Apple Pencil. I'm resisting turning it off though, so I learn. I'm getting used to it now a bit. Dunno if there's a better way.

Someone might happen along and share a 'better way'.. hopefully?

General comment

I have to say, now I've taken the plunge and commited to switching, having watched this software developing for quite a while now (timing my run, hopefully just ahead of the curve), I'm liking it a lot and as you say... no more rent!!! I have to hand it to Serif, they're coming good with it. I hope the Affinity app set matures in a good way. It's a great start. The joy of working on a portable 'small' tablet with pro software like Photo & Designer is quite something. And Publisher (currently only Desktop) is not a bad stab either.

[AllAppsUser]

12 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

Trying to "refine edges" overlays everything in red.

That's revealing the/a mask as an overlay over your image (I think..). Nothing is selected though so using flood selection won't work ... there isn't a selection to flood. It's showing the extent of your mask.

Called "Quick Mask Mode" I believe. "Selection persona" > three dots (Command menu) > Selection as layer (toggle on and off). Though just choosing another layer in the layers "studio" switches it off too.. I've just discovered.  Not played with it much myself yet.

I think it's the same thing as in Photoshop under the Select menu - called 'quick mask' there too.

[DM1]

2 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

Trying to "refine edges" overlays everything in red. Move cursor about. Click go. No change. Flood selection doesn't seem to do anything. Sigh, I'm obviously not holding my mouth right.

If you 'placed' an image it will likely import as an 'image' layer. You’ll need to rasterise the layer to manipulate 'pixels'. 

[DM1]

Once you select and mask your sky, you can clip new background to image and position layer below mask for new background to appear. No further refining need.  In example below I have already masked the original sky. 

[bizbeblu]

DM1, nice pix of an old "English Village." A former girl friend of mine from Wellington NZ once told me, "Nothings more English than a Kiwi." Don' think that's quite as true in Oz.

Still struggling with masking/clipping. I’ve got the “place file” (on a new layer) working. Thanks. Twice I’ve been able to move the background up and clip the new layer but can’t predictably repeat no matter how carefully I work or many times I try.

Failed process

Open new image from Cloud

PhotoPersona -> Place (additional) new image (from Cloud)

Drag over original

So, there it is - new layer with 2nd image

I can’t seem to “release” either layer unless I click on Photo -> or such command. The two layers remain “bonded” or move together. The minute I try to “mask” or move or any operation in the layer panel, they can’t move independently.

Just tried again.

Opened new image from cloud

Went PhotoPersona -> 3dot ->Place

Select new (second) file.

Follow instructions to “spread” the new 2nd image over 1st.

That done, I have 2 layers with the 2nd one on top of the original

Then I’m stuck.

I cannot get the this new selected/spread out layer to release no matter what I do.

Have tried every way I can think of to get them loose from each other, including switching to Selection Persona -> 3dot -> Deselect.  Also, PhotoPersona -> 3dot -> Pasteboard ->Paste. No joy. Behavior of layers doesn’t change no matter what I’ve tried.

My guess? I know how to do this in Ps, but there’s some subtle something in Photo that makes all the difference.

Enlightenment appreciated.

[DM1]

3 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

cannot get the this new selected/spread out layer to release no matter what I do.

Check the layer studio. Is their only one layer highlighted? Only the layer you want to move should be highlighted. If more than one, just place a finger on a layer and slide it to left (on the ones you don’t want selected).

Filters and mask layers only effect layers placed underneath them in AP so positioning of layers is important. I’ve attached some info on clipping and masking in AP as it may be different in PS.

Also make sure you have Move tool (Arrow) active, not the View tool (Hand).

[bizbeblu]

Ah, Hah! DM1, thank you much for the illustrations. Not only did they provide a nice remainder of mask/clipping mask but the attached pix show, what for me, was the critical information. The key is the fact one must press and hold to select then do that bit of wiggle dance to  separate move a layer. And bright light moment was seeing the horizontal and vertical bars you illustrated. Just had never seen that. Using an Apple pencil makes it harder to "grasp." Don't get me wrong, love the pencil. I'm stunned to watch the infinity gurus whip that stuff around with their finger tips. Shakes his head and there lays the tale.

So many things I like about this program. So many frustrating interface details. Select is good becoming great and I know I haven't gotten it right. RAW development is not bad. I suspect I haven't delved in deep enough. Seems a bit to automated. The up to 7 step tango to do a simple thing such as select, then delete selection is irritating. Still can't find a way to protect each layer as I work on the other. But this program has lots of nice stuff.

A note to the brass. I've bought everything you guys have ever produced. I use Design and now Publish as my main tools in each field. Bought the design book and now publish. Was absolutely blown away when it arrived in two days. Amazing. Both books are beautiful and the projects challenging. My only critique is that you brush too fast over the "interface" and don't really offer operational details. My guess - from the times that I taught/did interface design at the UWashington School of Engineering. The engineers, programmers, makers, are writing the help. To knowledgeable and sort of skip over key actions because they are instinctual. Again, thanks much.

Oh, the preference panel under tools has a linear chart for touch pressure. Does pulling the line up make tool require harder pressure? Down less? I'm finding with an Apple pencil that I'm having to tap 3-4 more to open things like line size and opacity. Also rate of change when attempting to any set anything (drag across a button right/left) is non-linear. Frustrating.

Thanks again.

 

Note if anyone from Affinity is watching. I've completely underestimated just how different a pad/tablet interface is from that of a current desktop computer. Not sure how to adapt. 50 years of doing things with files and mouse… Well onward thru the fog.

Robert

[AllAppsUser]

Yeah, thanks from me for that @DM1

@bizbeblu I’ve attached something might add a little more for others who happen in here, if not for you too.

The mask layer has a small symbol on it (ringed in yellow).

The vertical bar on the left is an odd one. When creating a mask layer from the layers menu, it appears. If you then drag that mask to another layer, the vertical bar changes and looks like any other grouped or clipping layer. Odd.. not sure I understand that.

Notice how grey and black do two different things. I could have put bright yellow dots on the clipping layer:

• I’d have got bright yellow dots on the blue.
• On the mask, the bright yellow would have been ... grey. Masks only accept tints of black. Notice also that the mask layer is solid white. I didn't fill it with white. That's how it comes, unless you choose "empty mask" when creating it and then it's black.

There is also a ‘cropping layer’... but let’s not add more confusion right now.
 

edit: replaced image with one that shows the checkered background in layers studio panel too for better understanding

 

 

[bizbeblu]

Okay, it's getting clearer. I fear even after all these years, I'm still hazy about the mask in particularly the clipping mask, and it's not like I haven't read multiple tutorials on the subject.

 

ProD, for the help. My process understanding. You started with a red slash. Created a pixel mask (clipping mask?) and back slashed (in black?) the original layer. You then added a second layer with the blue blob. Another mask with black dots. Both layers show the results of the masks/actions. Now, from experience I've learned that I can edit the blob without affecting the slash. But… I'm need to then edit the slash layer without bothering the blob. Haven't worked out how to do that.

Here's a quick example of the problem. First file is original (An example of our fine housing.) Second is the BW rendition of the original. Then is final rendering in iPad Photo. Last a screen shot (from Ps) of the BW file in process. with layers deleting/inserting sky. Turns out one can't export a pix w/o a background, so I had to delete sky again, then import the new cloud layer, then finish it. Also haven't figured out how to do a screen select copy. I'm finding Photo selection to be superior to Ps. Nice improvement. I'm also discovering that a lot of the Photo tools are superior. My only critique of the process is that I find Photo's BW rendering rather lame. Perhaps I haven't explored it enough, but will say that I hate anyone else's filter.

So final question. With this layer arrangement I can edit the sky (lower) without harming the shack (upper). If I want to edit the shack pix, e.g., paint it, I can't protect the cloud layer. Is there anyway to do this? Last final question. Would someone please direct me to a discussion of how to set pressure/response sensitivity? I'm using a pencil and find that it's taking as many as 4-5 taps to say select brush size. I basically can't manipulate layers except with finger. Frustrating and more so for some of the people I'm working with. They can handle a pencil, but arthritic changes make finger pointing difficult.

To all, thanks again.

Robert

[Alfred]

1 hour ago, bizbeblu said:

I find Photo's BW rendering rather lame

There are many ways to perform a B&W conversion!

 

[AllAppsUser]

Not sure I’ve followed completely, Robert ( @bizbeblu ).

The mask you’ve created for the bottom layer ( ref: PS screenshot, "Chopped Sky" ) . It can be dragged on to any other layer (or group) - I'm sure you know this.

I suggest changing the order of the layers to:

1. Sky2
2. Create new pixel layer here for hand tinting (Set to Hue or whatever)
3. BW convert
4. Chopped sky (not sure what role this is playing)

Then drag your mask from ”Chopped Sky" onto "Sky2" instead. Dragging it doesn't appear to change it to a clipping layer...

This way... Sky2 with it’s new mask sits above and is 'protected' - because all painting/tinting you then do, is below it. Sky2 also hides any hand tinting that drifts into the sky area so you don't need yet another mask.

I don't know if you've anything else planned for this image beyond this, so whether changing the layer order is feasible or not.

As I said, I'm not sure I've understood if this is what you're trying to create.

--

My very rough illustration of end result and suggested layer+mask order below. Hope it helps.

I had the hand tint layer (bright yella) selected when I screen captured. Though it looks like it might be grouped with Sky2, it's not.

------

For info:

I've used the Black & White adjustment layer at less than 100% opacity so some of the colour of the original photo seeps through. It creates the slight sepia effect in my image.

I did this randomly, for speed. The post above contains a link that goes into B&W conversions more fully.

 

 

 

 

[DM1]

8 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

Turns out one can't export a pix w/o a background,

Not so, for example Tiff, Png, PDF export formats both support transparent background.🙂
iPads file viewer shows white canvas but if you open back in photo the background will be transparent.

 

[DM1]

9 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

Also haven't figured out how to do a screen select copy.

If you mean how do I create a copy of my 'selection'; After making a selection, go to Channels studio and select the 'pixel selection' Alpha layer. Then tap the 3 dots on the right side of the layer and in the pop up menu, tap Create spare layer. Now you can reapply the spare layer (Selection) any time you want to.
 

[DM1]

14 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

My only critique of the process is that I find Photo's BW rendering rather lame. Perhaps I haven't explored it enough, but will say that I hate anyone else's filter.

The HSL adjustment may offer more options.?

 

14 hours ago, bizbeblu said:

With this layer arrangement I can edit the sky (lower) without harming the shack (upper). If I want to edit the shack pix, e.g., paint it, I can't protect the cloud layer. Is there anyway to do this?

If you select the shack layer and paint on it (creates a pixel layer clipped to shack) then paint will only appear on shack, not on sky.

You don need to export and reload a b/w image, just clip the adjustments to the shack and the effects will be limited to the shack.

Ive attached the file so you can see what effect is on layers. Selection is also saved to spare channel. You can reapply in channel studio using 3 dot menu.

Edit: will try uploading file later. Keeps failing for now.