PANTONE Guide

[.: NICKY G. :.]

I have a small problem.
I have an old Pantone Library (paper) with the Digital Library for Adobe in * .acb / * .ase format

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED) .acb
PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED) .ase

Affinity Designer has Pantone libraries saved in * .csv file.

How can I import these ADOBE libraries?
How can I get the library in * .csv file for Affinity?

[MikeW]

These are likely updated versions of the ASE/ACB files you have. Pantone changes their palette names. If so, they are in Affinity applications (perhaps not the iPad versions if I recall).

 

[.: NICKY G. :.]

7 hours ago, MikeW said:

These are likely updated versions of the ASE/ACB files you have. Pantone changes their palette names. If so, they are in Affinity applications (perhaps not the iPad versions if I recall).

 

I try to explain myself better:
I am aware that in AD there are several PANTONE libraries, both Spot and CMYK (updated), as you showed me.

My problem is this:
I have a very old Pantess Library of PROCESS CMYK (the one printed on paper) (but that works well for my purposes).
To find the chromatic reference through the numerical code on the printed library to the one inside AD, my bundle has the following example: E 133-8 (violet) that of AD has codes P 133-8 (green).
So they are different both as codes and as colors.

I already have the CMYK digital library suitable for my Pantone CMYK bundle only which is in ADOBE format.
I would ask for a way / method to convert my compatible Adobe Library to CSV format compatible for Affinity.

I hope I was clear.

[MikeW]

5 hours ago, .: NICKY G. :. said:

I try to explain myself better:
I am aware that in AD there are several PANTONE libraries, both Spot and CMYK (updated), as you showed me.

My problem is this:
I have a very old Pantess Library of PROCESS CMYK (the one printed on paper) (but that works well for my purposes).
To find the chromatic reference through the numerical code on the printed library to the one inside AD, my bundle has the following example: E 133-8 (violet) that of AD has codes P 133-8 (green).
So they are different both as codes and as colors.

I already have the CMYK digital library suitable for my Pantone CMYK bundle only which is in ADOBE format.
I would ask for a way / method to convert my compatible Adobe Library to CSV format compatible for Affinity.

I hope I was clear.

Yeah, that's what I meant about Pantone changing their color designations.

I've migrated Have you tried dragging those swatches into AD? It works with one or the other type, but they loose either the names r that they are spot color (or both, I cannot recall). There are tools that can be used to get the colors and names into a spreadsheet and then save them out in Serif's CSV format. It can sometimes go quick, other times not so much. A lot depends on what color model is actually encoded in the swatches.

If you would like, I can convert those two for you. Probably. Maybe. Like I mentioned, it depends on the makeup whether I can read them.

If you would like to keep them private (there's no need as regards the legality), send me a private message with a download link to a ZIP file. Else ZIP them and attach them to a response.

Mike

[.: NICKY G. :.]

2 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Yeah, that's what I meant about Pantone changing their color designations.

I've migrated Have you tried dragging those swatches into AD? It works with one or the other type, but they loose either the names r that they are spot color (or both, I cannot recall). There are tools that can be used to get the colors and names into a spreadsheet and then save them out in Serif's CSV format. It can sometimes go quick, other times not so much. A lot depends on what color model is actually encoded in the swatches.

If you would like, I can convert those two for you. Probably. Maybe. Like I mentioned, it depends on the makeup whether I can read them.

If you would like to keep them private (there's no need as regards the legality), send me a private message with a download link to a ZIP file. Else ZIP them and attach them to a response.

Mike

Here are the libraries.
If you can, then kindly explain to us also how to do it.
thank you <3

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED).ase

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED).acb

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (UNCOATED).acb

[v_kyr]

See also this related GitHub talk about Pantone colors in Adobe .acb and AD's .csv etc. ...

• https://github.com/colorjs/color-space/issues/17

It's mainly about the about the .acb file specification (https://magnetiq.ca/pages/acb-spec/) and a acb2xml conversion tool ( the coresponding github page) for conversion into readable XML.

See also:

• Add Pantone colors in Affinity Designer

[.: NICKY G. :.]

9 minutes ago, v_kyr said:

Vedi anche questo discorso su GitHub relativo ai colori Pantone in Adobe .acb e AD .csv ecc ...

• https://github.com/colorjs/color-space/issues/17

Riguarda principalmente la specifica del file .acb ( https://magnetiq.ca/pages/acb-spec/ ) e uno strumento di conversione acb2xml ( la pagina github corrispondente ) per la conversione in XML leggibile.

I managed to convert it to xml.
The problem that is not encoded with the specifications required by affinity in the * .csv file for color reading.
Now what do I do?

[v_kyr]

You need to convert the XML color reprasentations into that by AD usable csv format. - CSV usually stands for comma-separated value, thus it's probably in AD too a sort of text editable file (never looked into/at those). In other words, the XML color description of certain pantone colors has to be written into that CSV format then, so AD can read, load and make any use out of those values.

See also this thread: Missing Pantone Colours

[MikeW]

Here they are. They were RGB definitions, which is 2nd best to LAB and better than CMYK.

Mike

p-tone.7z

[.: NICKY G. :.]

41 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Eccoli. Erano definizioni RGB, che è la 2a migliore per LAB e migliore di CMYK.

Mike

p-tone.7z

I'm sorry to say, but you can't find the color values with the printed library.
However, the source library I provided to you works fine.
I do not understand why this change in color values.

[MikeW]

13 minutes ago, .: NICKY G. :. said:

I'm sorry to say, but you can't find the color values with the printed library.
However, the source library I provided to you works fine.
I do not understand why this change in color values.

I don't understand why you cannot find the color numbers. First, they are sorted. Second there is a search field at the bottom of the swatches panel.

What color can you not find? The files I provided are identical in name as to how they show up in Illustrator.

[.: NICKY G. :.]

Just now, MikeW said:

Non capisco perché non riesci a trovare i numeri dei colori. In primo luogo, sono ordinati. Secondo c'è un campo di ricerca nella parte inferiore del pannello Campioni.

Che colore non riesci a trovare? I file che ho fornito sono identici nel nome di come appaiono in Illustrator.

compare the Affinity values of the converted library, with the values of the printed version.
The values are found in Ai. as in the photo

[MikeW]

Make sure to either overwrite or first delete the former version before adding this one. Make sure AD is not running.

If this one is acceptable, I'll do the Uncoated version.

Mike

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED).csv

[.: NICKY G. :.]

1 hour ago, MikeW said:

Assicurati di sovrascrivere o cancellare prima la versione precedente prima di aggiungere questa. Assicurati che AD non sia in esecuzione.

Se questo è accettabile, farò la versione non patinata.

Mike

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED) .csv

seems to work great !!!
Thank you so much ... I owe you a beer.

anyway if you can illustrate the procedure, so let's learn something new today

[MikeW]

1 minute ago, .: NICKY G. :. said:

seems to work great !!!
Thank you so much ... I owe you a beer.

anyway if you can illustrate the procedure, so let's learn something new today

I'll be back in a few minutes with the uncoated version. 

In the meantime would you spot check the printed version of the uncoated guide and compare the cmyk values? They appear to be the same in my spot check. There are a few rgb values that are different according to Illustrator though.

These palettes are document color space specific. In that there are both rgb and cmyk values. So in a cmyk document you get the cmyk numbers but in an rgb document you'll get rgb numbers.

[.: NICKY G. :.]

6 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Torno tra pochi minuti con la versione non patinata. 

Nel frattempo, dovresti verificare la versione stampata della guida non patinata e confrontare i valori di cmyk? Sembrano essere gli stessi nel mio controllo in loco. Tuttavia, ci sono alcuni valori di rgb che sono diversi secondo Illustrator.

Queste tavolozze sono specifiche dello spazio colore del documento. In questo ci sono entrambi i valori di rgb e cmyk. Quindi in un documento cmyk ottieni i numeri cmyk ma in un documento rgb otterrai numeri rgb.

I understand it, but normally these colors are used for CMYK, so there are no problems.

The only thing AD has a little lack in my opinion.
In practice I create a new file and choose if I want to work in CMYK, RGB ...
Now the color libraries as I understand them have both CMYK and RGB colors in the same color and depending on whether I'm working in CMYK or RGB, apply the appropriate color percentages.

The problem arises:
1. when I have an open document I don't see in which color space I'm working in which color profile I'm using.

2. Yes I should make document settings and go see but it is not immediate.

3. when I select a color from the library and go to the color selector to see the percentages of RGB. CMYK, #hex, HSL, ... I don't immediately understand which is the right value to read applied to that color, they are all valid but it is not understandable also because the color method in use of the document is not displayed.

[MikeW]

All I really cared about was whether the cmyk values were the same between your printed versions.

Here's the uncoated version. I hope I grabbed the right one...

 

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (UNCOATED).csv

[.: NICKY G. :.]

25 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Tutto quello che mi importava era se i valori di cmyk fossero uguali tra le versioni stampate.

Ecco la versione non patinata. Spero di aver afferrato quello giusto ...

 

PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (UNCOATED) .csv

YES OK!

A courtesy, can you export the list to me with only the CMYK numeric values of the csv file?

es. PANTONE E 1-2 C, 255,234,0,0,3,100.0

I would like only this data: 0,3,100,0

[MikeW]

2 minutes ago, .: NICKY G. :. said:

YES OK!

A courtesy, can you export the list to me with only the CMYK numeric values of the csv file?

es. PANTONE E 1-2 C, 255,234,0,0,3,100.0

I would like only this data: 0,3,100,0

I can, but...

That is exactly what you get n a CMYK document.

I can take out the RGB but they to translate to the CMYK the same as the cmyk definitions because they are in the same, dual defined csv file.

But sure. I'll be back in a bit. I have the teapot on...

[MikeW]

Ok. I am thinking that Serif's spot color csv files cannot contain only cmyk values.

I believe the rgb is needed for display purposes. Serif would need to either confirm this or provide a sample csv with the 2 lines for the header and just a single color because I cannot make a cmyk only csv that displays properly. 

So at this point these types of palettes are limited to rgb or rgb+cmyk.

However, the provided ones work without issue.

[.: NICKY G. :.]

3 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Ok. Sto pensando che i file csv di tinte piatte di Serif non possono contenere solo valori di cmyk.

Credo che l'RGB sia necessario per scopi di visualizzazione. Serif avrebbe bisogno di confermare questo o fornire un campione csv con le 2 linee per l'intestazione e solo un singolo colore perché non riesco a creare un csv solo CMYK che sia visualizzato correttamente. 

 Quindi a questo punto questi tipi di tavolozze sono limitati a rgb o rgb + cmyk.

Tuttavia, quelli forniti funzionano senza problemi.

I'll explain, I don't need a working CSV in Serif.
I just need you to be able to extrapolate the CMYK numerical list
example of the first 16 numbers in the list:

0,3,100,0
0,3,100,0
0,0,100,0
0,0,85,0
0,0,70,0
0,0,55,0
0,0,40,0
0,0,25,0
0,0,10,0
0,3,100,10
0,3,100,10
0,0,100,10
0,0,85,5
0,0,70,5
0,0,55,5
0,0,40,5
0,0,25,3
0,0,10,3
....

[MikeW]

With or without the color names?

As it is a csv, any spreadsheet application can import it. The values will be in separate cells. Those cells can be highlighted, copied, and the pasted into a text editor. Then, if you desire the commas instead of the tabs that will be separating the values, you can search for the tab character, and in replace field, type a comma. Then do a replace all.

You'll then have that list.

[v_kyr]

Here are converted versions of your above "PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (COATED).acb" and "PANTONE 4-COLOR PROCESS (UNCOATED).acb" files.

1. I've converted that acb2xml prog over to OS X (Unix) and then used that in order to generate the Pantone XML files.
2. I've written a small prog which then converts the for you relevant XML portions (via a customizable SLT stylesheet file) over into a CSV delimited text file.

• pantone_coated.csv
• pantone_uncoated.csv

Note however, that I didn't sorted any of the color entries during the ACB -> CSV conversion processes. So the generated CSVs look like this ...

Quote

cyan,magenta,yellow,black
100,0,0,0
0,100,0,0
0,0,100,0
0,0,0,100
...
0,5,100,0
0,3,100,0
0,0,100,0
0,0,85,0
...
...

In case you need the prog to convert those Pantone color XML files into CSV yourself let me know.

[.: NICKY G. :.]

6 hours ago, v_kyr said:

1. I've written a small prog which then converts the for you relevant XML portions (via a customizable SLT stylesheet file) over into a CSV delimited text file.

you should show me, show me how to do this step. the conversion to xml I had done well but then I could not use the data obtained.

I think AD should show the color percentages with a tooltip when stopping above (color percentages depending on the color space used in the document, then RGB if you're using an RGB document, CMYK if it's CMYK).
Currently it is very inconvenient to know the color percentages, you have to go to the sample and click color selector to see the data.

I will post this idea to the developers.

 

 

[v_kyr]

5 hours ago, .: NICKY G. :. said:

...the conversion to xml I had done well but then I could not use the data obtained.

Ok, even I'm not sure you will understand the prog code behind the little Xml2Csv conversion tool at all, I will try to explain in simple words what it does and how to use it.

Since I'm lazy with such things and like portable solutions (between Win and Mac) I made a little Java prog which reads and parses that Pantone XML file tag structure with the help of a defined XSL stylesheet. That stylesheet.xsl file looks like that here ...

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<xsl:stylesheet xmlns:xsl="http://www.w3.org/1999/XSL/Transform" version="1.0">
   <xsl:output method="text" omit-xml-declaration="yes" indent="no"/>
    <xsl:template match="/">
        name,alias,cyan,magenta,yellow,black
        <xsl:for-each select="//color">
        <xsl:value-of select="concat(cyan,',',magenta,',',yellow,',',black,'&#xA;')"/>
        </xsl:for-each>
    </xsl:template>
</xsl:stylesheet>

... where this part of that stylesheet ...

<xsl:for-each select="//color">
    <xsl:value-of select="concat(cyan,',',magenta,',',yellow,',',black,'&#xA;')"/>
</xsl:for-each>

... tells to concatenate the color values separated by commas (the commas can be changed to semicolon, tabulators or what ever makes sense here instead). So this helper XSL stylesheet file defines and sets up the way how the whole XML conversion will be made.

The next thing is that we need is a little Java program which can deal with reading in XML and then convert that with the help of the above shown stylesheet.xsl file into CSV text. The corresponding Java source file looks like this ...

import java.io.File;

import javax.xml.parsers.DocumentBuilder;
import javax.xml.parsers.DocumentBuilderFactory;
import javax.xml.transform.Result;
import javax.xml.transform.Source;
import javax.xml.transform.Transformer;
import javax.xml.transform.TransformerFactory;
import javax.xml.transform.dom.DOMSource;
import javax.xml.transform.stream.StreamResult;
import javax.xml.transform.stream.StreamSource;

import org.w3c.dom.Document;

class Xml2Csv {

    public static void main(String args[]) throws Exception {
        if (args.length == 3)  {
            File stylesheet = new File(args[0]); // A stylesheet.xsl file
            File xmlSource = new File(args[1]);  // A .acb color based XML file

            DocumentBuilderFactory factory = DocumentBuilderFactory.newInstance();
            DocumentBuilder builder = factory.newDocumentBuilder();
            Document document = builder.parse(xmlSource);

            StreamSource stylesource = new StreamSource(stylesheet);
            Transformer transformer = TransformerFactory.newInstance().newTransformer(stylesource);
            Source source = new DOMSource(document);
            Result outputTarget = new StreamResult(new File(args[2])); // Output a CSV text file
            transformer.transform(source, outputTarget);
        }
        else
            System.out.println("Usage:  java Xml2Csv file.xsl file.xml filename.csv");
    }
}

... and is a CLI (command line interface) prog, meaning one has to run/start it from a terminal/console. - Note that you will need an installed Java 8 Runtime Environment (JRE 8) on your computer in order to run/execute precompiled Java code. So to be able to run the compiled Java prog (the Java.class file) then you need an installed JRE 8.

The above little program (the Xml2Csv.class file) uses three arguments, the first is the "stylesheet.xsl" definitions file to use, the second the XML input file to work on, and last the CSV output filename to generate. - So it's then executed like this ...

Quote

C:>   java Xml2Cvs stylesheet.xsl pantone.xml output.csv

Here are the related files for reuse archived in a ZIP-file:

• xml2cvs.zip