Characters are changed at file open (split)

[Luca2024]

guys let me add another problem.
I have a document where i have a paragraph that uses myriad variable in different flavour (bold, condensed etc...). The problem is that the characters are changed at file open so, doesn't matter if I change the font, I lose the original text).
Here a sample (on the right the curves version how it should look like):

[walt.farrell]

1 minute ago, Luca2024 said:

guys let me add another problem.
I have a document where i have a paragraph that uses myriad variable in different flavour (bold, condensed etc...). The problem is that the characters are changed at file open so, doesn't matter if I change the font, I lose the original text).
Here a sample (on the right the curves version how it should look like):

Are you sure you have that font installed on your system?

What kind of document do you have, and which Affinity application are you using? Which release of the application?

Are you Opening the document, or Placing it?

[Luca2024]

Just now, walt.farrell said:

Are you sure you have that font installed on your system?

What kind of document do you have, and which Affinity application are you using? Which release of the application?

Are you Opening the document, or Placing it?

Yes Walt. Let me explain.
If I create a new document in AFF designer i can have all the font variation I need. It works.
The problem starts when I import an Adobe CC or CS file and ok you can think I can change the font once I open.
That's the problem. 
At the Adobe CC/CS file open that change the text  so I can't do anything. I need to retype the document.

[walt.farrell]

3 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

The problem starts when I import an Adobe CC or CS file

So, it's a .psd file? Or something else?

Was it created on your system, or somewhere else?

Are you Opening it? ("Import" is not a precise term.)

[Luca2024]

ok .
I have a file in Adobe Illustrator format Adobe CS (previous adobe version file type).
I open it with AFF Designer : no warning of font.
the file is imported 75% but part of the text is changed

[walt.farrell]

3 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

I have a file in Adobe Illustrator format Adobe CS (previous adobe version file type).
I open it with AFF Designer : no warning of font.

In that case, Designer is opening the PDF file within the .ai file, and is depending on whatever information the PDF contains.

If you can share the file, someone should be able to explain further.

[Luca2024]

5 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

In that case, Designer is opening the PDF file within the .ai file, and is depending on whatever information the PDF contains.

If you can share the file, someone should be able to explain further.

I agree with you Walt. It is the PDF import (maybe not the variable font anymore). I am doing some tests. Unfortunately I cannot share the file publicly as it is a commercial project, but I could provide it to Affinity support in case of for investigation purposes.

[Luca2024]

Update: I was not able to export from Adobe Illustrator that paragraph made by Myriad variable concept to AFF Designer  even if the entire paragraph is all made by "semibold" (1 type used).

No way

[walt.farrell]

15 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

Update: I was not able to export from Adobe Illustrator that paragraph made by Myriad variable concept to AFF Designer  even if the entire paragraph is all made by "semibold" (1 type used).

No way

Can you prepare a new sample document that you could share to demonstrate the problem?

[kenmcd]

39 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

Myriad variable concept

The Myriad Variable Concept font is an OpenType-PS OTF variable font,
not the typical OpenType-TT TTF variable font (of which 99%+ are).

I do not know if Affinity even supports OTF variable fonts - I don't think so.
Most applications do not.
Adopey is one of the few who do.

That is probably why it is not working.

Anyway, this discussion does not belong here.
You should ask support questions in the support forums.

[Luca2024]

the font works flawlessly (pfa). The problem is in the import of AI file (i.e. PDF). I don't need any support anyway, I am exploring the possibility to convert my files that's why I bought (and financed) the Affinity suite team with my contribute.. I am interested in the discussion.

[fde101]

13 hours ago, Luca2024 said:

The problem is in the import of AI file (i.e. PDF)

This is not entirely an import problem, but a limitation of the PDF format itself, as PDF does not support variable fonts.  When you export a PDF from a document which contains variable fonts, a non-variable substitute for the font is created and embedded in the document.

Currently there is a limitation in that fonts embedded in PDF files are not used by the Affinity applications, so that non-variable substitute is not used for the imported PDF, and some other font will be substituted in its place.  This one is an import limitation, but even if the embedded font were used, it would no longer be the original variable font you started with.

[Luca2024]

1 hour ago, fde101 said:

This is not entirely an import problem, but a limitation of the PDF format itself, as PDF does not support variable fonts.  When you export a PDF from a document which contains variable fonts, a non-variable substitute for the font is created and embedded in the document.

Currently there is a limitation in that fonts embedded in PDF files are not used by the Affinity applications, so that non-variable substitute is not used for the imported PDF, and some other font will be substituted in its place.  This one is an import limitation, but even if the embedded font were used, it would no longer be the original variable font you started with.

I am not a PDF specialist (but I am a former frontend coder so I am not a newbie).
I made a simple test.

1) Created an affinity designer new document
2) added a paragraph and typed three simple lines with variable fonts flavours
2) export as pdf by embedding fonts and subsets.
3) import the PDF into Adobe Illustrator.
Guess what?
Illustrator KEPT the Myriad variable concept reference AND allowed to edit flawlessly.
I still think there is something to fine tune in the PDF import for Affinity Designer to be competitive with Illustrator on this side.

[walt.farrell]

1 hour ago, Luca2024 said:

Guess what?
Illustrator KEPT the Myriad variable concept reference AND allowed to edit flawlessly.

If you examine the PDF internals (i.e., with a text editor or a hex viewer) you may find that it has a large encrypted section which (if we could view it decrypted) would have a complete Illustrator file in it. And that is what Illustrator is using to allow editing, not the actual standardized contents of the PDF file.

See the following post (and the ones following it):

 

[kenmcd]

He created the PDF with Affinity - which embedded the fonts in a way that can be identified correctly in other applications. 

What we have not seen is the PDF created in AI - which has probably embedded the variable fonts in a way that cannot be identified correctly in non-Adopey applications.

But we cannot check this as your request for a sample PDF has been ignored.

[Luca2024]

25 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

If you examine the PDF internals (i.e., with a text editor or a hex viewer) you may find that it has a large encrypted section which (if we could view it decrypted) would have a complete Illustrator file in it. And that is what Illustrator is using to allow editing, not the actual standardized contents of the PDF file.

 

 

@walt.farrell I know exactly how Illustrator works (despite I didn't x-rayed the PDF) and i know Illustrator blows the PDF with the illustrator section but I generated the PDF with AFF Designer! Then I opened with Illustrator

Now, do you mean that AFF Designer ALSO reserve an Illustrator compatibility "box" inside the PDF?
In this case, why is it not able to use that back?
 

[Luca2024]

2 minutes ago, kenmcd said:

He created the PDF with Affinity - which embedded the fonts in a way that can be identified correctly in other applications. 

What we have not seen is the PDF created in AI - which has probably embedded the variable fonts in a way that cannot be identified correctly in non-Adopey applications.

But we cannot check this as your request for a sample PDF has been ignored.

@kenmcd I try to replicate the error and I will change the text inside to give you a broken PDF. I am sorry that is part of a commercial product I can't expose it without explicit permission.

[Luca2024]

Here it is the "sample file" guys.

test6 copia.pdf

[walt.farrell]

33 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

Now, do you mean that AFF Designer ALSO reserve an Illustrator compatibility "box" inside the PDF?

No, it can only do that with TIFF files.

Sorry; I misunderstood which application you generated the PDF with.

Still, as already mentioned by someone above, the Affinity applications cannot use fonts that are embedded in the PDF. You must have the fonts installed locally. The Adobe applications do not have that limitation, so if you embedded the font in the PDF then Affinity will have created a static instance of the font, and Illustrator would be able to use that static instance.

[fde101]

6 hours ago, Luca2024 said:

KEPT the Myriad variable concept reference AND allowed to edit flawlessly.

Does it still show the variable axes and allow them to be modified, or are you just trying to edit the text itself?

[Luca2024]

4 minutes ago, fde101 said:

Does it still show the variable axes and allow them to be modified, or are you just trying to edit the text itself?

works perfectly. It keeps fonts and subtype and you can type back. OF course I have the font installed.

[fde101]

Interesting.  I would expect the text to still be editable for the reasons that @walt.farrell outlined above - it would be working with the static copy that was saved in the document - but I would not have expected the custom axis values to remain editable.  If they are just the presets from the font I might imagine how that could work, but not if they were custom axis values...

[walt.farrell]

39 minutes ago, Luca2024 said:

works perfectly. It keeps fonts and subtype and you can type back. OF course I have the font installed.

But is it a static font, or do you have adjustable axes like the original variable font?

[Luca2024]

3 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

But is it a static font, or do you have adjustable axes like the original variable font?

everything
  

[kenmcd]

4 hours ago, Luca2024 said:

Here it is the "sample file" guys.

test6 copia.pdf 314.54 kB · 1 download

The characters encoded behind the glyphs for the Myriad Variable Concept font text are just nonsense.