Problem exporting to SVG format

[P_Nog]

Hello,
Let's see if someone can help me in this situation.
Sometimes I need to export files in SVG format to use with a Brother Scan 'n Cut machine software.
I've done it dozens of times without any problem exporting from Illustrator, but yesterday, when doing it from Infinity Designer something strange happened.
It was a A5 size vector that, when imported by the software of the machine, appeared with the size of an inch on its longest side. I've tried with all the SVG presets but the same thing happens every time.
Thank you in advance for any help.
Regards,

[Wosven]

HI @P_Nog ,

Don't forget to search the forum with your machine's name or the intend:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/search/&q=Brother Scan 'n Cut&quick=1

 

 

Or:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/search/&q=laser cut&quick=1

 

[P_Nog]

55 minutes ago, Wosven said:

HI @P_Nog ,

Don't forget to search the forum with your machine's name or the intend:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/search/&q=Brother Scan 'n Cut&quick=1

 

Thank you, but looking at these posts date, it seems that after four years the problem persists

[Wosven]

Some found solutions, you just need to search and tests them to find the one that work for you

 

 

[P_Nog]

On 1/27/2022 at 7:50 AM, Wosven said:

Some found solutions, you just need to search and tests them to find the one that work for you.

 

 

Thank you once again.
Unfortunately, after several attempts with different options the result is always the same and I can't find any way to export the SVG file in its original size. I export an A5 size vector and when importing to Brother Scan 'n Cut it has one inch.

[Wosven]

From what I remember reading those threads, you need to export with a specific resolution, but since I don't own such machine, I just read the threads by curiosity, and can't do tests.

Another solution is modifying part of the SVG code in a text editor. Perhaps you can compare the code of 2 files exported to SVG by different apps, to find the options you need exporting SVG from AD, with the less manual modification to do later (if it's not possible to get it right from the start).

[P_Nog]

6 hours ago, Wosven said:

From what I remember reading those threads, you need to export with a specific resolution, but since I don't own such machine, I just read the threads by curiosity, and can't do tests.

Another solution is modifying part of the SVG code in a text editor. Perhaps you can compare the code of 2 files exported to SVG by different apps, to find the options you need exporting SVG from AD, with the less manual modification to do later (if it's not possible to get it right from the start).

I tried with different resolutions already but the outcome was the same.
About changing the SVG code in a text editor. I haven't the slightest idea how to do that
I'll try a few more options, if any, and then I'll give up.
It seems that a simple "Export as" command in AD is something at the level of a quantum physics treaty
Thank you so much for your help nevertheless.

[Paul Mc]

Hi @P_Nog the export uses the pixel resolution setting under the Document or editable after clicking the More... button, when doing the Export:

So my 50mm green square above is exported at 50 / 25.4 * 72 pixels on each side.

From the SVG file created:

width="141.732" height="141.732"

A simpler example would be a 1 inch square at 72 DPI which would appear in the SVG with a width and height of "72"

Because your Vinyl cutter has a 300dpi scanner I'd try using a value of 300 as the Use DPI: parameter. If you used 72 DPI in your test you would expect the cutter to operate at roughly a quarter of the side length or a 1/16 of the area.

An A5 design would be approximately 5 7/8" x 8 1/4" which if rendered at 72DPI when 300DPI is expected would appear at a size of 1.41" x 1.98" - is that near to what you observed or was it smaller than that?

[P_Nog]

On 1/28/2022 at 11:59 PM, Paul Mc said:

Hi @P_Nog the export uses the pixel resolution setting under the Document or editable after clicking the More... button, when doing the Export:

So my 50mm green square above is exported at 50 / 25.4 * 72 pixels on each side.

From the SVG file created:

width="141.732" height="141.732"

A simpler example would be a 1 inch square at 72 DPI which would appear in the SVG with a width and height of "72"

Because your Vinyl cutter has a 300dpi scanner I'd try using a value of 300 as the Use DPI: parameter. If you used 72 DPI in your test you would expect the cutter to operate at roughly a quarter of the side length or a 1/16 of the area.

An A5 design would be approximately 5 7/8" x 8 1/4" which if rendered at 72DPI when 300DPI is expected would appear at a size of 1.41" x 1.98" - is that near to what you observed or was it smaller than that?

Hello Paul,
Thank you very much for your clear and concise explanation. It was very kind of you.
The problem is that I already exported with three different options.
“Use document resolution”, (which is 300dpi), 72dpi and 300dpi, but the outcame was always the same regarding the size of the file after imported into Scan ’n Cut. There's certainly some important parameter I'm neglecting, but I can't figure out which one.

 

[Paul Mc]

The only other parameter that I can think of that might have any effect would be the Set ViewBox setting. You have it set here so that clearly isn't issue.

Do you have a simple SVG file which you know works correctly for a precise and predictable size of geometry? If you are able to share that on here, with a description of what it should generate, then I could take a look and see if there is anything obvious that is missing.

[P_Nog]

33 minutes ago, Paul Mc said:

The only other parameter that I can think of that might have any effect would be the Set ViewBox setting. You have it set here so that clearly isn't issue.

Do you have a simple SVG file which you know works correctly for a precise and predictable size of geometry? If you are able to share that on here, with a description of what it should generate, then I could take a look and see if there is anything obvious that is missing.

All the files I exported to SVG from Adobe Illustrator always opened in Brother Canvas Workspace with the exact sizes with no problem whatsoever.
Exported from Affinity Design, I still haven't been able to export a single file that opens with the correct size.
To make the situation even more difficult, I switched from PC to Mac and now I no longer have Adobe Illustrator to export a *ai file to SVG without this issue.

[Wosven]

It seems on the canvas workspace online, the only files that import correctly are the ones at 96 PPI, with or without relative coordinates.

Displaying a second ruler to get the dimensions in mm help when checking the import result

 

Settings I used to export:

test_dimensions.afdesign

test_dimensions_96PPP.svg

test_dimensions_96PPPno_relCoord.svg

 

Yoou should know that some apps will import at 72 or 96 PPI by default. CanvasWorkspace seems to import at 96PPI.

I tested with SVG at 72, 96 and 300 PPI, with or without relative coordinates, and only those 2 files seems correctly imported.

You'll have to do further tests, of course.

[P_Nog]

10 hours ago, Wosven said:

It seems on the canvas workspace online, the only files that import correctly are the ones at 96 PPI, with or without relative coordinates.

Displaying a second ruler to get the dimensions in mm help when checking the import result

 

Settings I used to export:

test_dimensions.afdesign

test_dimensions_96PPP.svg 19.37 kB · 0 downloads

test_dimensions_96PPPno_relCoord.svg 24.09 kB · 0 downloads

 

Yoou should know that some apps will import at 72 or 96 PPI by default. CanvasWorkspace seems to import at 96PPI.

I tested with SVG at 72, 96 and 300 PPI, with or without relative coordinates, and only those 2 files seems correctly imported.

You'll have to do further tests, of course.

 

Hello,
Thank you so much for your explanation and sample files.
I had some hope with the possibility of exporting at 96dpi as you advised me.
Unfortunately I must have some poltergeist around here because both my file and the one you kindly shared here (test_dimensions.afdesign) after exported on my computer, still appear reduced in Brother Canvas Workspace.
Can you please export my test_sample.afdesign file (attached) on your computer and see what happens?
I've already tried here and the problem remains.
Thank you so much once again.

test_sample.afdesign test_sample.svg

[David in Яuislip]

Try the attached file, I've changed

width="100%" height="100%" (which I don't think is much use to a cutter)

to

width="186.29mm" height="119.46mm" (as shown by selecting all three objects in your design file)

See if my poltergeist can beat yours!

test_sample-revised.svg

[Paul Mc]

51 minutes ago, David in Яuislip said:

width="100%" height="100%" (which I don't think is much use to a cutter)

I'd noticed this as well. It is kind of pointless for most real world uses of SVGs and really only applies when you embed this into something like a web page where the container defines the size.

I'd previously tried making the changes you suggested but never ended up with exactly the same dimensions on reloading the file back into AD. Of course, it is possible that AD is buggy in this area and this would never work but your changes might work downstream for the cutter.

There's too much experimentation and guesswork going on here we really need Affinity to step in and say exactly what's going on and whether this is achievable or not.

[David in Яuislip]

Oops, I had a bit of an Unbrainwave earlier, probably caused through lack of alcohol

Plan B is to clip the canvas to remove the margins then export to svg then change the width & height

This latest, greatest file opens in Photo and Inkscape with the correct dimensions

But does it cut?

test_sampleB.svg

[Wosven]

I'm not sure what is the problem, can you show the result on the app? I'm only using the CanvasWorkspace online, ant it seems the width and height are the same.

But ths ellipse isn't filled with black.

 

 

 

Wos_test_sample.svg

 

And my file is similar to yours.

 

 

[P_Nog]

2 hours ago, David in Яuislip said:

Try the attached file, I've changed

width="100%" height="100%" (which I don't think is much use to a cutter)

to

width="186.29mm" height="119.46mm" (as shown by selecting all three objects in your design file)

See if my poltergeist can beat yours!

test_sample-revised.svg 5.09 kB · 0 downloads

Hello David,
First of all, thank you so much for your help.
Half of the poltergeist has been resolved
Apparently the design elements did not suffer a decrease in size. but appeared as shown in the attachment image.

[Wosven]

And the file produced by the online site: Wos_test_sample.fcm

 

[P_Nog]

34 minutes ago, Wosven said:

I'm not sure what is the problem, can you show the result on the app? I'm only using the CanvasWorkspace online, ant it seems the width and height are the same.

But th eellipse isn't filled with black.

 

More and more weird.
The file on my Brother Canvas Workspace computer program (top) and on Canvas Workspace online (bottom).

[Wosven]

Effectively, there's a bug somewhere! Perhaps you need to notice them or update your app?

[P_Nog]

1 minute ago, Wosven said:

Effectively, there's a bug somewhere! Perhaps you need to notice them or update your app?

I already checked. I have everything up to date.

[Wosven]

And can you import the Wos_test_sample.fcm and have it rigth in your app? If so, you can use the online site until they find the problem or give you a solution.

[Paul Mc]

I've just found this nugget in a demo file:

 scal:dpi="72" x="0px" y="0px" width="864px" height="864px" viewBox="0 0 864 864"

This would make sense in informing the application what the DPI value is as it is otherwise omitted. Plus, the absolute pixel dimensions using px as the suffix.

Update: I think I may have jumped to the wrong conclusion here. It looks like SVG has no standard for DPI. scal: above probably refers to Sure Cuts A Lot - and not scale as I had thought. So it is probably proprietary setting that gets around the missing DPI problem within the Sure Cuts A Lot domain.

Having said that has anyone tried the px suffix for the dimensions? 

[P_Nog]

1 hour ago, Paul Mc said:

I've just found this nugget in a demo file:

 scal:dpi="72" x="0px" y="0px" width="864px" height="864px" viewBox="0 0 864 864"

This would make sense in informing the application what the DPI value is as it is otherwise omitted. Plus, the absolute pixel dimensions using px as the suffix.

Update: I think I may have jumped to the wrong conclusion here. It looks like SVG has no standard for DPI. scal: above probably refers to Sure Cuts A Lot - and not scale as I had thought. So it is probably proprietary setting that gets around the missing DPI problem within the Sure Cuts A Lot domain.

Having said that has anyone tried the px suffix for the dimensions? 

Paul, I tried that too, but it didn't work.