Jump to content
walt.farrell

Windows 10 BSOD with KB4517389 installed

Recommended Posts

Just FYI, I rebooted my Windows 10 laptop this morning to finish installing Windows update KB4517389, and after that I experienced several Windows failures, BSOD when using the menus in the Affinity applications. Once in Photo (don't remember what menu I item I clicked) and twice in Publisher using Text > Show Special Characters.

The failures pointed to ddflt.sys (or, perhaps, cldflt.sys)

After removing that update things are working smoothly again.

I understand that it is most likely an error in that Windows Update, and not in the Affinity Applications. I am not finding anything via Google (yet) about errors in that update.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And, for what it's worth, that Windows Update does not seem to cause problems on my desktop computer; only on the laptop.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am also on 18362.418, however I don't have that driver (I can't find any reference to it in %SystemRoot%\inf\setupapi.dev.log either).  

Are you able to find the location of the driver using Windows File Explorer search?  I.E. Searching for the following from 'This PC' in Windows File Explorer.

ext:(=.sys) name:(~="ddflt")

If so, does right-clicking the file and going to [Properties > Details] shed any light on what this driver is or what it does?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, - S - said:

Are you able to find the location of the driver using Windows File Explorer search?

I'm on Windows 10 Pro 64 bit v1903 build 18362.418.

I found a number of references to cldflt.sys.

The most recent is in C:\Windows\ System 32]drivers.  It's Product version 10.0,18362,387

The description is Cloud Files Mini Filter Driver.

Have not found ddflt.sys on my desktop

 

File properties.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Just FYI, I rebooted my Windows 10 laptop this morning to finish installing Windows update KB4517389, and after that I experienced several Windows failures, BSOD when using the menus in the Affinity applications. Once in Photo (don't remember what menu I item I clicked) and twice in Publisher using Text > Show Special Characters.

The failures pointed to ddflt.sys (or, perhaps, cldflt.sys)

After removing that update things are working smoothly again.

I understand that it is most likely an error in that Windows Update, and not in the Affinity Applications. I am not finding anything via Google (yet) about errors in that update.

I have a similar issue, I tested the Photo app for a few days (download from Affinity site), then bought Affinity Photo from Microsoft Store (thought it is a good idea...) and installed on my desktop. Every try to start the app results in a BSOD referncing to my 'cldflt.sys'. It is the same version as Greyfox showed above. 

Then tested the MS Store app on my Surface, and it works perfectly fine!

Reverting back to the downloaded test app on my desktop solved the issue, but it runs out in 5 days.. :-( 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, - S -.

I don't find it either. I suppose, given the colors used on the BSOD screen, and the tiny type, it could have been cldflt.sys rather than ddflt.sys, and there are other BSOD reports about that driver file.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Overnight Windows installed KB4517389 again, and the problem came back. cldflt.sys was one of the files installed by that update.

I have once again uninstalled KB4517389 (and again, that fixed the problem) and now I've hidden it so it won't install again.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, walt.farrell said:

I don't find it either. I suppose, given the colors used on the BSOD screen, and the tiny type, it could have been cldflt.sys rather than ddflt.sys, and there are other BSOD reports about that driver file.

That makes more sense.  When I posted the reply, the original post only mentioned ddflt.sys—which I haven't come across before.  Problems with cldflt.sys however have previously been reported in the bugs section:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/99381-saving-files-causes-computer-restart/&do=findComment&comment=533028

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

And, for what it's worth, that Windows Update does not seem to cause problems on my desktop computer; only on the laptop.

Although you mentioned it happening with menu items, is it possible it's actually triggering when trying to autosave in the background, which it does every 300 seconds?

Can you think of any differences between your desktop and laptop?  For example, does the laptop have different OneDrive settings to the desktop—such as OneDrive Files On-Demand set on the laptop to save space, but not on the desktop?  Or if OneDrive Files On-Demand is set on both, are there any applications installed on the laptop—which are not installed on the desktop—that may be interacting with the file system in the background, such as third-party antivirus?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's definitely not related to autosave.

First, I'm not using OneDrive for my files.

Second, I can open Publisher, create a new file, create a text frame, and click Text > Show Special Characters and it will crash every time. That takes a very small amount of time, much less than the 300 internal for the autosave.

OneDrive settings are default on both. It's enabled, and gets used when I take screenshots, but all my real cloud data is in Google Drive, when I use cloud data.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Affinity Photo writes to the below locations when selecting 'Show Grid' from the View menu.  Publisher does something similar with 'Show Special Characters'.

C:\Users\UserName\AppData\Roaming\Affinity\Photo\1.0\user\visibility_options.dat~temp
C:\Users\UserName\AppData\Roaming\Affinity\Photo\1.0\user\visibility_options.dat

It also writes to the same place when selecting 'Show Margins' and 'Show Guides'.  Does Affinity Photo crash when selecting these from the View menu as well?

Do you have 'Google Drive' installed on both the desktop and the laptop, or just on the laptop?  Same goes for any other cloud sync applications where they are on the laptop, but not the desktop (some desktop printers like HP for example sometimes install stuff like this when installing their software).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, - S - said:

Does Affinity Photo crash when selecting these from the View menu as well?

I had Publisher crashing using the Text > Show Special Characters menu and Photo crashing using View > Grid.

Both would write those as preferences to %appdata%\Affinity\... as you noted.

Yes, Google Drive is on both systems.

Thanks. I've mentioned this in the Microsoft community forums, and provided a dump.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@walt.farrell @SanMiguel 

I've just installed that update on my Windows virtual machine on the MacBook I'm running and not getting a crash in Publisher when using View>Special Characters.  Also haven't been able to crash Photo using the menus.   I'll try again tomorrow on my actual PC that's running Windows.

The DLL cldflt.sys does appear to be something to with a Cloud service, so I'd expect to see it more with saving than anything.  

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am running win 10 home with that update installed and have no issues.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Win10(1909)Home / Photo / Designer / Publisher & latest (beta) versions

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/12/2019 at 12:55 PM, - S - said:

That makes more sense.  When I posted the reply, the original post only mentioned ddflt.sys—which I haven't come across before.  Problems with cldflt.sys however have previously been reported in the bugs section:

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/99381-saving-files-causes-computer-restart/&do=findComment&comment=533028

 

It's worth noting that cldflt.sys isn't actually the driver (so it can't cause crashes itself), instead it acts as a proxy driver for your actual Cloud Storage provider (e.g. Google Drive, Dropbox One Drive etc). @walt.farrell do you have anything like the above installed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mark Ingram said:

do you have anything like the above installed

Yes, I have OneDrive, and Google Drive, but none of the files I'm using or that Publisher or Photo are using are in those folders.

On the other hand, I also have a continuous backup program that would be monitoring %appdata%\Affinity and might be trying to backup the .propcol files that the Affinity applications would be updating to remember my settings.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@walt.farrell It doesn't matter if you use it or not for affinity files but if it is enabled in windows.

do a google search for disabling one drive in Windows and see if this works for you


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Win10(1909)Home / Photo / Designer / Publisher & latest (beta) versions

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, haakoo said:

It doesn't matter if you use it or not for affinity files but if it is enabled in windows.

But if it's OneDrive related, and none of the Affinity files are using OneDrive, why would the error occur instantly when Affinity is writing to one of its files?


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here on Window 10 Version 1903 (build 18362,418) all updates installed, and no problem at all. OneDrive is running and Affinity apps open and save files to this folder without any problem.


Window 10 - 16 Gb - Intel I7 - 8700 - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Yes, I have OneDrive, and Google Drive, but none of the files I'm using or that Publisher or Photo are using are in those folders.

On the other hand, I also have a continuous backup program that would be monitoring %appdata%\Affinity and might be trying to backup the .propcol files that the Affinity applications would be updating to remember my settings.

Can you try disabling one or both of OneDrive and Google Drive and seeing if that stops the BSOD? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was referred to this thread from 

 

I was getting the blue screen when substituting fonts when opening a PDF in Designer version 1.7.3.481. 

Removing that Windows update permitted me to substitute the fonts, but the blue screen returned when I tried to save the edited file as an afdesign file.

Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@walt.farrell

Did you try uninstalling and reinstalling OneDrive and Google Drive?  Although I've seen a couple of cldflt.sys blue screen reports with other software (I.E. Keepass, Plex, Paint.net, a few AAA games) I've been watching a cldflt.sys bluescreen bug report with Visual Studio (due to it being a Microsoft product) and they've just replied with following:

Quote

This error may occur while OneDrive is syncing and there are multiple copies of the faulting driver loaded (cdtflt.sys) [sic].

You can try the following to work around the issue (we've internally verified these steps on a machine that consistently produced BSODs).

1. Open Add/Remove Programs from Control Panel
2. Uninstall Microsoft OneDrive
3. Reboot the machine
4. Install VS
5. Reinstall Microsoft OneDrive - you can download it from the official OneDrive site

Although this is for a different issue (this is a cldflt.sys BSOD when installing Visual Studio), it may be worth trying if you haven't already.

Looking at the release notes, there was a OneDrive client update on 02 October 2019 (19.152.0927.0012); I'm not sure whether or not this is related to the issue.  The official OneDrive download page is currently offering 19.174.0902.0013 (17 October 2019), however on the Release Notes page there is a link to an even newer version: 19.192.0926.0012 (13 November 2019), so I'd just skip straight to installing that version, instead of the version on the official download page.  You can see what version is currently installed on your machine as per this support article.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, - S - said:

Did you try uninstalling and reinstalling OneDrive and Google Drive?

Thanks. No, I haven't tried that. I have the 19.192.0926.0012 version of Onedrive installed, for what it's worth.

I'll try playing around with this some more.

Edit: Actually, at this point I've updated to Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), and I am fully up-to-date (with no updates that I have hidden), and I'm not having the problem any more. So I'm happy, and can't really help diagnose this further to help anyone else who may still be having the problem. Sorry.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.502 Beta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

These are the Terms of Use you will be asked to agree to if you join the forum. | Privacy Policy | Guidelines | We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.