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sveto

[aPhoto Windows] Curves Adjustment - Multiple Point Selection

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I have a curve adjustment layer and want to move two of the points at the same time. But i can't manage to select both points simultaneously - i tried Shift+Click, CTRL+Click, Alt+Click - nothing works.

I can't google this issue, because all i get is vector curves topics.

Please help.

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Why do you want to move them at the same time, rather than individually, @sveto?


-- Walt

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It's part of my workflow. I often establish a good combination of contrasts for different parts of the curve that i like and then want to raise or lower a broader part of the curve without destroying the relation between the points.

I find your question a bit strange. Is advanced use of curves so uncommon here?

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18 minutes ago, sveto said:

I find your question a bit strange. Is advanced use of curves so uncommon here?

I can't speak for others, but I've never adjusted more than one point at a time.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1909 (183623.476),
   Desktop: 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00GHz, GeForce GTX 970
   Laptop:  8GB memory, Intel Core i7-3625QM @ 2.30GHz, Intel HD Graphics 4000 or NVIDIA GeForce GT 630M
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.514 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.514 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.523 Beta

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Well, given that curves are one of my most used tools in postproduction, i'm a bit bummed right now, if i really can't select multiple points simultaneously.

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What editing app allows selection of more than one point on a curves adjustment? I've looked at all the ones I have, and they all only allow selecting a single point.


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OK, here's another thought.

Is it possible to stack adjustment curves without degrading the data, provided i work in 16bit?

 

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Simply lasso them while having the node tool selected. But you should also be able to Shift click and add/toggle selection. If you cannot do it, try if closing Photo and starting it again resolves the problem.

EDIT: Oops, sorry, did not read your question properly.

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4 hours ago, sveto said:

Is it possible to stack adjustment curves without degrading the data, provided i work in 16bit?

I'm not sure what you mean about degrading the data but you could stack as many Curves Adjustment layers as you want. For example, create one, select it, & duplicate it several times, then adjust each one as desired.

417354134_CurvesAdjstacked.jpg.33e47c064a26c60769d39c9fbc33ac4c.jpg


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I know that i can stack them. My question was if i'll get rounding errors and/or artifacts when pushing around the same tones multiple times in a row. I always work in 16bit per channel, but maybe it's not advisable to stack different curve adjustment layers on top of each other.

I need a clarification, because i'm looking for a workaround for not being able to select multiple points. I had the idea to do my fine adjustments on one curves layer, and then some coarser adjustments on another, etc.

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I think the only way to see if you get artifacts is to try it. 


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Am i expected to do multiple technical tests to determine if the software can deal with advanced editing? Do you realize that some artifacts could remain invisible until later in the workflow when you can't go back anymore because you are approaching the deadline?

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2 minutes ago, sveto said:

Am i expected to do multiple technical tests to determine if the software can deal with advanced editing? Do you realize that some artifacts could remain invisible until later in the workflow when you can't go back anymore because you are approaching the deadline?

What I mean is depending on what you consider an artifact, the number of adjustment layers you add & how each is set, the results would most likely be different for different images you apply them to.


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Well, i meant things like posterizing or color shifts. Very difficult to detect with the naked eye until (if) you do some serious further processing.

Isn't this an official forum? I'd normally expect people from Affinity to help here. Sadly, when it comes to the more technical issues and/or questions, i feel ignored.

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I guess I do not understand what you mean because Curve Adjustments inherently create color shifts. What else would you use them for?


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Ever done adjustments in 8 bit per channel? Ever saw the image degrade? That's what i mean. And probably other things that i can't think of.

I guess in 16 bit it is safe enough to stack 2 or 3 curve adjustment layers, but you never know. That's why i'm asking. I appreciate you trying to help, but i'd rather hear some statement from the Affinity staff, because they should know the technical details, right?

But they rarely read this forum, or do i have the wrong impression?

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8 or 16 bit, Curve Adjustments inherently create color shifts. Thus my confusion about what you mean by degrade.


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Rounding errors? (In the audio world we edit in 32 bit floating point resolution, just to avoid rounding errors.)

I don't know how much rounding errors play a role in image processing in 16 bit per channel data. That's why i'm asking.

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How would you define a rounding error in terms of the result? IOW, whatever the bit depth, a pixel can have only one color, right? So what would the magnitude of the error be in terms of the difference from whatever you would expect the resultant pixel color value to be? Unless it is more than one LSB, there would be no error, right?


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What I mean is you are the one adding several stacked Curve Adjustments layers, presumably to get some result you could not get with a single one. So to you what would constitute a rounding error in this process & how would it cause problems, either now or later on?


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If i could define that i wouldn't be asking. And as well - i wouldn't be asking if the software didn't force me to do that, given that i can't select multiple points in an Af.Photo curve.

My question is meant to prevent me from doing harm to my files that i could discover only later. Hell, even normal adjustments are hard to see when the eyes are tired.

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13 minutes ago, sveto said:

If i could define that i wouldn't be asking. And as well - i wouldn't be asking if the software didn't force me to do that, given that i can't select multiple points in an Af.Photo curve.

I don't understand why the inability to select more than one point on the curve at a time forces you to use stacked Curve Adjustments layers. What is it that you can't do, even if you have to adjust one point at a time?

17 minutes ago, sveto said:

My question is meant to prevent me from doing harm to my files that i could discover only later. Hell, even normal adjustments are hard to see when the eyes are tired.

Adjustment layers are non-destructive, meaning you can edit or delete them at any time. So how could using them cause harm to your files?

It all still boils down to how you define whatever it is you are trying to avoid, whether you call it harm, artifacts, defects, degradation, or whatever. Without a clear understanding of what you mean by that there is no way to answer your question.


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