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jackamus

Disappearing object nodes when moving guides

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No. I simply closed the current AD and tried to open the older version. I'll remove it from my Apps folder and re-download to see if this will make any difference.


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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This hasn't worked either! I'm told the trial has expired.

I'm satisfied that I've proved my point perhaps you could do the same thing to confirm it?

I drew an ellipse and then dragged a horizontal and vertical guide to the mid control points.

Edited by jackamus
spelling mistake

Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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Thanks Jack, I've replicated this and will provide my screen recordings as examples against the development log and request further information - apologies for any inconveniences!

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What is the 'development log'?

The issue now is has this feature been designed out of the current AD and if so why? Or is it a bug as was originally suggested?


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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1 minute ago, jackamus said:

What is the 'development log'?

We log all bugs on an internal system which is visible to Tech, QA and the Developers - this is what I'm referring to here :)

2 minutes ago, jackamus said:

 The issue now is has this feature been designed out of the current AD and if so why? Or is it a bug as was originally suggested?

I've asked for further clarification here and will respond in due course!

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In 1.6 the bounding box of the last selected object remained on screen when you dragged a guide to that object

In 1.7 the bounding box of the last selected object disappears when dragging a guide and then reappears when you let go of the guide.

(Presumably, this was done, in part, to reduce "screen clutter" when positioning a guide

In both cases, the guides would snap to the object, not to the bounding box's nodes/handles.  It just appeared that they snapped to the bounding box's nodes/handles because they were the same as the snapping points on the object.

Visually, "snapping" to the bounding box's nodes/handles was probably easier but technically it was not doing that and was, therefore, giving the wrong impression that it was.  

So it's probably a good thing that it was changed so others do not fall into this "trap" in the future.
 


Due to the fact that Boris Johnson is now our Prime Minister, punctuation, spelling and grammar will never be worried about ever again.  We now have far bigger problems to be concerned about.

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I find that an amazing explanation and not very satisfactory. How was it decided that it was 'screen clutter'? Did you get complaints from users?

The whole point of this is that even though the actual guide snapping is not to a bounding box or the control points, the effect, visually, that is what it the guide is doing. Visually it is a very helpful 'accident'.

Previously to using AD before it was first published I used DrawPlus for many years and did some great work on it - in fact I actually won a prize for the best piece of work for the month! In both DP and AD the bounding boxes and control points were always visible when moving  a guide.

What conceivable reason could there be after all these years of both DP and AD should the developers want to remover that feature in the last AD upgrade? Just because it worked accidentally is not a good reason. I would really like to know how the decision was made to remove it?

 

 

 


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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Because you were never snapping to these things.  The thing you were actually snapping to was/is obstructed by the selection box handles.

 

If you had two circles on screen - one selected and one not - you would be able to snap a guide to either of them.  So seeing the selection box on top of the one circle gives you nothing (other than the visual cue that I mentioned).  This is what is meant by visual clutter - UI devices that serve no purpose while an action is taking place.  All the handles are there until you drag one to start an action - they then become redundant.  For this reason we also offer the option to hide the selection box while transforming objects - because people want to see the document contents while performing actions, not the UI overlay.

 

Yes - in 1.6 we didn't hide the selection box when moving guides, and in 1.7 we now do.  That has changed - along with a raft of other major changes in 1.7 to how most of the tools work.  All very carefully thought out, and intended to improve usability.

 

I also don't understand what you are saying about having to zoom in to snap things more accurately...????? The whole point of snapping is that it will give you the exact same position regardless of zoom level - if the snapping result shows the snap, the position will be accurate.  If you are zooming in to position things, you are not snapping at all.  It appears to me that you are fundamentally misunderstanding a lot of how things are working in reality, and have come up with a set of technical superstitions that you are now struggling to shake off.

 

You need to re-read my explanations above - they are correct.


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Since my drawing are usually of the engineering  type many of the objects that I draw can be very close in terms of snapping and often I can't get a guide to snap to the node I want. That is because there is a node on another object that it is trying to snap to. So, as I said earlier, I either turn off the snapping and do it manually or I zoom in to accurately move the guide. Does this not make sense to you?

Having said all that I was vindicated when I downloaded AD 1.6.5 and saw that I was right and that bounding boxes and control points do not disappear when moving a guide in previous versions and I could do good work in the older versions.

But now I can't. You may think you have improved AD but as far as I'm concerned you haven't. You have taken a backward step and I am very disappointed. Again I ask you what was the reason for changing it? Were other users complaining about 'screen clutter'? If its not broken then don't fix it!

Also I resent your remark about 'technical superstitions' and I would like an apology for that and for telling me that it was never like that in the first place when it was! I felt that you were calling me a liar or that my 80 year old memory was failing! I was right all along about previous versions.

Whatever reason you give to explain away why it was changed, AD is less useful to me now that it was before - its harder work.

I would be interested to know how many other AD users feel the same!


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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First, thanks a lot for all your great apps!!! 

I have also a problem with this new feature. It definitely depends on the zoom level and the speed of moving the guide if I am able to find the snapping point, a lot of times I just miss it now because I am too fast.  The "snapping force" is not strong enough, when you move too fast and you have zoomed in a lot, you just move over the point and it will NOT snap. Of course it would snap and the position would be accurate, that is not the problem, I just miss it...

I can not understand why you would say, that users do not understand the technique or we do not use the tools correctly? Maybe different people use tools just in different ways?
I am dragging out a guide and move it over an object, using the settings from the snapping studio. What is wrong with that? I was able to place the guides without any problems in versions <1.7, now I have to move up and down a lot of times, its try and error for me...

The handles have been at least a good visible hint where the snapping is going to react. For me it was not redundant as you said, I lost some comfort.

Why not make it available as an option again? Or making an option to increase the "snapping force" ?

 

 

 

 

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Well

26 minutes ago, j.strackbein said:

First, thanks a lot for all your great apps!!! 

I have also a problem with this new feature. It definitely depends on the zoom level and the speed of moving the guide if I am able to find the snapping point, a lot of times I just miss it now because I am too fast.  The "snapping force" is not strong enough, when you move too fast and you have zoomed in a lot, you just move over the point and it will NOT snap. Of course it would snap and the position would be accurate, that is not the problem, I just miss it...

I can not understand why you would say, that users do not understand the technique or we do not use the tools correctly? Maybe different people use tools just in different ways?
I am dragging out a guide and move it over an object, using the settings from the snapping studio. What is wrong with that? I was able to place the guides without any problems in versions <1.7, now I have to move up and down a lot of times, its try and error for me...

The handles have been at least a good visible hint where the snapping is going to react. For me it was not redundant as you said, I lost some comfort.

Why not make it available as an option again? Or making an option to increase the "snapping force" ?

 

 

 

 

Thanks for backing me up on this one its greatly appreciated.


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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29 minutes ago, j.strackbein said:

Or making an option to increase the "snapping force" ?

"Snapping Force" is controlled by Screen Tolerance in the snapping settings.  Try increasing it to see if that helps you.

 

 

snapping.png


Due to the fact that Boris Johnson is now our Prime Minister, punctuation, spelling and grammar will never be worried about ever again.  We now have far bigger problems to be concerned about.

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.. good that we have talked about it ;)  I never used this slider in the snapping studio so far, which is called "Bildschirmtolleranz" in German, guess it is "screen tolerance" in english (in German maybe a bit misleading name..) this is increasing the "snapping force" I was complaining about.. "oh, those stupid users...." haha..

MEA CULPA :$

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On 9/24/2019 at 9:44 AM, Dan C said:

Of course I can! You can use Quicktime to record your screen, which is preloaded on all Macs. Please see the following link for information here -https://support.apple.com/guide/quicktime-player/qtp97b08e666/mac

Having discovered that AD 1.6.5 does not have the guide moving problem I would like to exchange my current AD for this older version. It did everything that I ever needed. How can I arrange this?

Also when the 10days trial period expires for AD 1.6.5 it is necessary to buy the current version. This being the case then why offer a 10 free trial for an older version?

When I used to use DrawPlus it was always possible to buy an older version much cheaper than the current version. Why can't the same thing be done with AD?


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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10 hours ago, jackamus said:

How can I arrange this?

Unfortunately you can't 'roll back' versions from the Mac App Store, you'd have to purchase an Affinity Store license to unlock older versions.

10 hours ago, jackamus said:

This being the case then why offer a 10 free trial for an older version?

All of our download versions act as a trial, and this isn't something we plan on changing. This does mean that you can 'trial' older versions, but that isn't our intent - unfortunately we can't stop the older versions from being trials when we release a newer update.

10 hours ago, jackamus said:

When I used to use DrawPlus it was always possible to buy an older version much cheaper than the current version. Why can't the same thing be done with AD?

Affinity is still in version 1.x - meaning there's only technically one version to purchase at one price. When we do release version 2, I suspect we may reduce the cost for version 1, but that's purely conjecture as there's no official word on this yet.

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Thanks Dan it all makes sense.

OK so how do I go about purchasing a license to buy 1.6.5 assuming the Serif do not plan to re-instate the disappearing bounding boxes and control points when moving a guide?

I think I have made a good case to put AD 1.7.2 back the way it was since it created more problems than it solved. It would appear to be an unnecessary  cosmetic change.

Edited by jackamus
Addition comment

Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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3 hours ago, jackamus said:

OK so how do I go about purchasing a license to buy 1.6.5

Simply purchase a license through our website, this will be compatible with any version 1.x install, and the features won't change should you choose not to update :)

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Sorry to be so dense but can you just give me a link straight to it please?


Mac OS X El Capitan Version 10.11.6

AD version 1.6.0

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