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again about the resizing


srg

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Not sure this is a bug but certainly something to clarify.

If I want to increase only the printing resolution (>DPI) I go to resize document, un-check the resample square, then type the number of DPI I want and click the Resize button.

When I do this I noticed that after I un-check the resize square the size of the image in pixel become inactive. This is what I think is correct.

But, when the size is in inches or other units but pixels, the size value in the window do not become inactive but follows the proportion with the pixels, ie. becomes smaller, i.e.  the number of pixels is fixed.

I do not think that this is correct since I do not want to change the size (dimension) of the image but only its DPI that AP must send to the printer.

I may be missing something.

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4 hours ago, srg said:

I do not think that this is correct since I do not want to change the size (dimension) of the image but only its DPI that AP must send to the printer.

If you start with a 1 inch by 1 inch document, at 100 DPI (really PPI, pixels per inch) then your document is 100 px by 100 px.

You want to print it at 300 DPI, so you tell Photo to increase the DPI to 300. You have two choices at that point:

  1. Do not resample. If you do not resample, then you end up with a document that is still 100 px by 100 px, becaue without resampling you cannot change the total number of pixels. However, by changing the printing DPI you are then printing 100 px at 300 PPI, and your image will be 1/3 inch by 1/3 inch.
    or
  2. Allow resampling. Your 100 px by 100 px image will become 300 px by 300 px, and at 300 DPI will still measure 1 inch by 1 inch.

-- Walt
Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases
PC:
    Desktop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 

    Laptop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU.
iPad:  iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard 
Mac:  2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1

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16 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

If you start with a 1 inch by 1 inch document, at 100 DPI (really PPI, pixels per inch) then your document is 100 px by 100 px.

You want to print it at 300 DPI, so you tell Photo to increase the DPI to 300. You have two choices at that point:

  1. Do not resample. If you do not resample, then you end up with a document that is still 100 px by 100 px, becaue without resampling you cannot change the total number of pixels. However, by changing the printing DPI you are then printing 100 px at 300 PPI, and your image will be 1/3 inch by 1/3 inch.
    or
  2. Allow resampling. Your 100 px by 100 px image will become 300 px by 300 px, and at 300 DPI will still measure 1 inch by 1 inch.

I was not clear.  My point is:

If there is a difference between DPI (a printer setting) and PPI (a screen setting), why the two are linked like they are now.

If: 

Scaling

Scaling will embed a specific print resolution into an image's metadata to force it to print at a specific dpi (e.g. 300 dpi). The image's pixel dimensions remain unaffected

then, unless I am missing something,  I should be able to force a different DPI without AP changing the size of the image no matter how the size is measured (pixels or inches or whatever) see the video

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It is somewhat confusing if not disconcerting I think how AP shows info when just changing DPI.
Yes, deselecting Resample dose allow the user to just change the DPI metadata. The confusion it seems to me creeps in when AP automatically starts changing the two Size fields at the top as the DPI is altered.
What AP is actually (helpfully?) doing is showing how big the image will now be if printed at the new DPI.
I can’t help but feel that these two Size fields should not be live updated in this way when just changing DPI, as at the bottom of the window this info is also being displayed live and more fully at the same time.
When a user only wants to change DPI they understandably expect that the two top Size fields to remain unchanged.
The trick I suppose is to try not to look at the top Size fields and to just look at the 'Description' at the bottom of the window.

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1 hour ago, srg said:

I was not clear.  My point is:

If there is a difference between DPI (a printer setting) and PPI (a screen setting), why the two are linked like they are now.

If: 

Scaling

Scaling will embed a specific print resolution into an image's metadata to force it to print at a specific dpi (e.g. 300 dpi). The image's pixel dimensions remain unaffected

then, unless I am missing something,  I should be able to force a different DPI without AP changing the size of the image no matter how the size is measured (pixels or inches or whatever) see the video

If you leave the units in that dialog set to px, then you will not see the dimensions change at the top when resample is not checked. It is only when you change to a non-pixel unit that you will see it change. That is because without resampling the numbr of pixels is absolute. But when you change the units, and also change the DPI (which only affects printing), and also say not to resample, you are changing the printing size of the image. And so, as @markw says, Photo is helpfully telling you what the size will be.

Presumably you are interested in knowing that, or you would not have changed the units to inches, or points, or whatever other non-pixel measurement you want to use. Also, presumably, you would want to know that as except for changing the print size there's no reason to change the DPI (that I know of).

-- Walt
Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases
PC:
    Desktop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 

    Laptop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU.
iPad:  iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard 
Mac:  2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1

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36 minutes ago, markw said:

It is somewhat confusing if not disconcerting I think how AP shows info when just changing DPI.
Yes, deselecting Resample dose allow the user to just change the DPI metadata. The confusion it seems to me creeps in when AP automatically starts changing the two Size fields at the top as the DPI is altered.
What AP is actually (helpfully?) doing is showing how big the image will now be if printed at the new DPI.
I can’t help but feel that these two Size fields should not be live updated in this way when just changing DPI, as at the bottom of the window this info is also being displayed live and more fully at the same time.
When a user only wants to change DPI they understandably expect that the two top Size fields to remain unchanged.
The trick I suppose is to try not to look at the top Size fields and to just look at the 'Description' at the bottom of the window.

I get your point but not that of AP: according to their on line Help, they tell me that resizing without resampling (box near Resample un-checked also called scaling) only changes the the Number of Dots Per Inch the printer will print as by AP order. Thus if  I want an image of a determined fixed size (the size I want) printed at various DPI,  the size of the image in pixel, inches or whatever should not change. It it does that means that there is a confusion between pixels and dots of the printer.

DPI also can be changed in the crop function further confusing the subject in my opinion since in this case I believe they scale the image. 

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25 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

If you leave the units in that dialog set to px, then you will not see the dimensions change at the top when resample is not checked. It is only when you change to a non-pixel unit that you will see it change. That is because without resampling the numbr of pixels is absolute. But when you change the units, and also change the DPI (which only affects printing), and also say not to resample, you are changing the printing size of the image. And so, as @markw says, Photo is helpfully telling you what the size will be.

Presumably you are interested in knowing that, or you would not have changed the units to inches, or points, or whatever other non-pixel measurement you want to use. Also, presumably, you would want to know that as except for changing the print size there's no reason to change the DPI (that I know of).

posted my previous not knowing you have posted this.

Still I look at the definition of AP help and I am confused: the size no matter in which measure should not change if I change only the order to the printer of how many DPI to print. Why there is no reason change the DPI? I want an image at whatever resolution I want ie at whatever DPI I want. The resolution of one image changes exactly with the DPI at which the image have been printed. 

Here is the definition of Scaling in AP Help:

Scaling will embed a specific print resolution into an image's metadata to force it to print at a specific dpi (e.g. 300 dpi). The image's pixel dimensions remain unaffected.

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7 minutes ago, srg said:

Why there is no reason change the DPI?

I didn't say there's no reason. I said the only reason is to change the size the image prints at.

Remember, without checking Resample the pixel dimensions (number of pixels) won't change. So, we know the user had a reason to change the DPI (to affect the print size), and we know the user had some reason to change the units from px to inches. Therefore we can assume the user is interested in knowing that size, which will change with the changed DPI. Therefore it is natural and appropriate for Affinity to show what that size will be. And since it does show the changed print size, the dialog is working as it should.

-- Walt
Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases
PC:
    Desktop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 

    Laptop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU.
iPad:  iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard 
Mac:  2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1

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21 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

I didn't say there's no reason. I said the only reason is to change the size the image prints at.

Remember, without checking Resample the pixel dimensions (number of pixels) won't change. So, we know the user had a reason to change the DPI (to affect the print size), and we know the user had some reason to change the units from px to inches. Therefore we can assume the user is interested in knowing that size, which will change with the changed DPI. Therefore it is natural and appropriate for Affinity to show what that size will be. And since it does show the changed print size, the dialog is working as it should.

Walt.Farrell

I hate this to become a back and fort but I must clarify: the reason I want to change the DPI is NOT to affect the print size but to affect the print resolution i.e.the  DPI as by the AP help manual I posted before.

you

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2 hours ago, srg said:

I hate this to become a back and fort but I must clarify: the reason I want to change the DPI is NOT to affect the print size but to affect the print resolution i.e.the  DPI as by the AP help manual I posted before.

In that case you must resample. If you change the DPI without resampling then (as I explained above) you will change the print size.

To increase the DPI without decreasing the print size you must increase the total number of pixels. In other words you must resample.

-- Walt
Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases
PC:
    Desktop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 

    Laptop:  Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU.
iPad:  iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard 
Mac:  2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1

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