Vertical Text

[capturleat]

Here having been encouraged to start my own new topic to an old, already asked question, after having googled and followed the top link to a thread which I then mistakenly resurrected by way of a reply, not noticing that it was in fact archived.  So to my query...

 

...joining others in being interested to know please, if someone who knows could tell us at what stage of development (if at all) is the function of being able to type vertically in Affinity Designer?  In any of the applications, in fact.  I own all three.  For my work, it's a fairly large thing to miss not being able to do and from what I can see, this has been a floating topic for several years now so, figured it could do no harm to ask again.  

[m.vlad]

Just make a textbox that's thinner than the letter width.

[walt.farrell]

Yes, that works, @mvlad, as long as:

1. You only need a single word. If you need a phrase, it doesn't work in my experience as the spaces extend outside the frame, leaving the words within the frame joined together. And
2. You are not trying to write several vertical lines of text. Actually, this can work, but each line will need its own text frame, which becomes somewhat cumbersome to design.

[m.vlad]

19 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

Yes, that works, @mvlad, as long as:

1. You only need a single word. If you need a phrase, it doesn't work in my experience as the spaces extend outside the frame, leaving the words within the frame joined together. And
2. You are not trying to write several vertical lines of text. Actually, this can work, but each line will need its own text frame, which becomes somewhat cumbersome to design.

1. can use a linebreak/enter (forgot the word for it) as space.
2. True, but at least you can have a consistent line spacing by having them all in a group and modifying the constraints for all of them so they don't scale horizontally.

[walt.farrell]

28 minutes ago, mvlad said:

1. can use a linebreak/enter (forgot the word for it) as space.

Thanks. I hadn't discovered that.

I think I understand your point 2, but would have to play with it. But as I don't need vertical text right now I'll save that for another day

[capturleat]

Thank you for trying to help, mvlad and for making that video, it was a kind effort.  As I had already previously told walt here though in another thread on the same topic, I am aware of that workaround.  I also have another, thinking that if there were a thread called 'Top tips and workarounds for features we miss' that would be a really excellent place for such things.  Even better though would be an answer to the question of my original post, still outstanding which is:

 

On 7/28/2019 at 9:19 PM, capturleat said:

interested to know please, if someone who knows could tell us at what stage of development (if at all) is the function of being able to type vertically in Affinity Designer?

 

The particular question I am asking, is why I had posed the question in an earlier thread to staff members specifically, though I changed the wording of that in this new thread to 'someone who knows', for the same and no reason other than because I believed it most likely that someone who works in development of this largely fantastic software, could provide a clear and definitive answer. 

 

So, is there anyone who is willing/able to tell us please? 

There are many of us who would appreciate knowing.

 

[walt.farrell]

Serif generally does not comment on the timing of features or the state of their development.

[capturleat]

Thank you walt, no I know it's not common for them to do so, however it has been known for them to provide an occasional indicator of something being worked upon, or even expected in the next update, that sort of thing so as I said, figured it could do no harm to ask again...

[ashf]

Serif said schedule of implementation is unknown though it's necessary in East Asia and I really want it.
Waiting for it for 5 years.
You can find many topics about vertical text in this forum.

[capturleat]

Well, their stating that the schedule of implementation is unknown, did at the time of that statement imply an intention at the very least then...good to know, thanks ashf.   Whether that intention still remains, I suppose only they can tell us, if they would. 

Have to say I'm pretty stunned to learn that something so fundamental can go by the wayside for so long.  I'd have thought the whole of East Asia to be a populace Serif ought to consider far more important than it seems they care to show.    

[ashf]

FYI, someone achieved vertical text by creating a custom font that's rotated 90 degrees then use it on a text frame that's rotated 90 degrees.
He said he used High-Logic FontCreator.
You don't need to create your new font from scratch, you can modify existing font such as Google Fonts.

 

[ashf]

1 hour ago, capturleat said:

Have to say I'm pretty stunned to learn that something so fundamental can go by the wayside for so long.  I'd have thought the whole of East Asia to be a populace Serif ought to consider far more important than it seems they care to show.    

Yes, on Twitter many Japanese Affinity users are complaining about vertical text(縦書き)
That's large parentage of entire Affinity related tweets. They just don't post here because they don't speak English.
https://twitter.com/search?q=affinity 縦書き&src=typed_query&f=live
 

[liumingming]

Chinese designers also need vertical text. There are 1.5 billion people in East Asia.

[capturleat]

21 hours ago, ashf said:

Yes, on Twitter many Japanese Affinity users are complaining about vertical text(縦書き)
They just don't post here because they don't speak English.

I bet they are indeed complaining.  Chinese users too.  I've read multiple threads now from you and others here also, as you said there are so many on this topic.   Many thanks also for the link/info on the custom font creation, that's inspiring.

How sad though, that this set of softwares is still only good for hobbyists for such a massive number of people, despite selling itself as fully professional.   Within the industry itself, not sure how much this might speak of the artistic world as a whole but one whose clients include Sony, Dreamworks, Marvel and many others who I've been writting with upon occasion over the last couple of years, had not even heard of Affinity until I told him of it recently.

-

21 hours ago, liumingming said:

Chinese designers also need vertical text. There are 1.5 billion people in East Asia.

Serif, please respond to this...

[walt.farrell]

22 minutes ago, capturleat said:

Serif, please respond to this...

Serif staff have responded previously. They recognize that it's a big missing feature, but it is also a big job to provide the support.

They generally do not comment on the timing of when new features will become available.

[ashf]

@capturleatThere are more topics than you found.
i.e. This topic. he is a distributor of Affinity in China, not an end user.
And he's asking his customers to request vertical text in this forum.
https://www.3rdway.com/2019/06/26/700/

 

[capturleat]

@ashf yes you are right I had not seen that thread and has been a good read.  The point you made when discussing the topic with Shi Lichuan about bringing an Asian Developer on board at Serif, I'd say is the best suggestion of all.  It would not only help but even perhaps is simply just necessary, if the task remains so gargantuan after five years then maybe it's time for them to concede.  Of course implementing this would no more be cheap than the undertaking be small (!) but ultimately, the rewards both for Serif and for East Asia along with all of us others needing vertical text, would be absolutely huge.  

[ashf]

There have been Chinese/Japanese input bugs since last year and they have been leaving it alone.
Because Serif don't know how to type Chinese/Japanese.
They fixed it partially in current beta finally but not completely yet.

[ashf]

Also it's not only Asian who suffer from the limitation of typography feature.
Middle Eastern as well.
Serif says support of vertical/rtl text is complex and time consuming so they have no plan to do right now(at least not in 2-3 years)
 

 

[capturleat]

So the problem extends to RTL script/type lacking in function also, that's massive...which while I am definitely glad to be informed, it is a sad thing to learn.   I must thank you though, for all the much valued information you have provided on this and other threads covering the topic.  

An exciting outcome from the approaching visit to Serif by one of your group, would be an Affinity Spotlight blog post announcing a new addition to the team, going fully international and in turn, truly earning that professional status.  I will hold that thought... 

[UncleMonkey]

Publisher needs to support right-to-left vertical Hanzi (Chinese character) text! So does Designer! Don't know if I'll buy Publisher without.
in Designer, if you don't want to wrestle with multiple one-character-wide text frames, there is a laborious workaround using a spreadsheet:

• paste your text into a Google sheet. (Excel will probably work as well)
• use SPLIT(), TRANSPOSE() and INDEX() to get the order you want - you'll have to add spaces to get line breaks right.
• adjust font and column width to taste.
• "print" the rearranged text to a .pdf on your machine.
• place the .pdf in your Designer document

The embedded .pdf will be editable , but anything you insert will push text right instead of down, so all you can practically do is replace characters one-for-one. This approach is troublesome, but it keeps all your text together.

 

TTC text - 第十章.pdf

[fde101]

On 7/28/2019 at 4:19 PM, capturleat said:

Here having been encouraged to start my own new topic to an old, already asked question

Whoever is doing that is violating forum guidelines:

Quote

• Please search first, it may well be that you have a suggestion that others also want. If so add your feelings to their thread.
• If you cannot find your idea, make a new post. Try to keep your post as concise as possible, and for the title of your post to describe the request as best you can.

...

• Please understand we can’t possibly do everything which is requested, but we try to make the best calls we can in terms of prioritising our work. Constantly nagging or being overly ranty that we haven’t implemented one of your suggestions will not help your cause, and such posts will be deleted.

https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/forum/52-feature-requests-suggestions/

[marcan]

Just adding another +1 to this. I and my Japanese friends need this feature to properly lay out vertical text in designs. The workarounds don't cut it; there are subtleties (such as how the character ー becomes vertical when written vertically, and kerning/centering issues, never mind multiple vertical lines of text) that mean you can't just use the narrow text box trick. It's just not professional nor practical.

I'm a developer, I know adding support for different text layouts is a big task, especially if the code was originally developed with the assumption that Western writing conventions are the only ones that exist - but really, this is a huge market you're missing out on. That's all of Japan, China, Korea, and all the other countries that use CJK scripts. It makes business sense to prioritize this feature. Keep in mind that most users from those countries are not comfortable English speakers, nor do those cultures encourage feature requests/complaints.

So you likely won't be getting direct feedback from Japanese users, they will just quietly not use Affinity software because it's missing features they need on a daily basis. If you want to see what Japanese users think about this problem, try searching Twitter. All of those posts are about the missing vertical text support in Affinity software.

Quote

DTPソフト、Affinity Publisherを使おうと思ったけど縦書き対応してないみたいなので、やっぱりInDesign使うしかないのかしら。

I thought about using Affinity Publisher for DTP, but it doesn't support vertical writing, so I guess I have to use InDesign after all.

Quote

Ａｆｆｉｎｉｔｙ、縦書き機能が付いてくれたら利便性が増すのになぁ……。

It would be so nice if Affinity supported vertical text...

Quote

少しの間Affinity Designer使ってましたが縦書きとか日本語フォントの扱いがダメダメでAdobeに戻りましたそれ以外は慣れればOKな良ソフトです

I tried using Affinity Designer for a while, but it can't handle vertical text or Japanese fonts properly so I went back to Adobe. Other than that, it's a good app once you get used to it.

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Affinity Designer、縦書きができないの痛いな スクリプトとか公開されてないだろうか……

Not being able to use vertical text in Affinity Designer is so painful... I wonder if there's a script or something to fix this...

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Affinity publisher、縦書き使えないことには日本でシェア広まらないのでは…

Without vertical text support, Affinity Publisher isn't going to be increasing its share in Japan...

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Affinity Publisherで縦書きがマトモに組める様になれば何も問題ないのにな

If only Affinity Publisher supported vertical writing properly, then there would be no problem...

Quote

Affinityは現在縦書き機能がなく、搭載予定もないので私の必要とする日本語組版ができない。サヨナラまた来世。

Affinity does not currently have vertical text support, and there seem to be no plans to add it, so I can't use it to do the Japanese typography that I need to do. Time to say goodbye.

Here's the hilarious hack that some users are using to get vertical text support in AD, using a font with rotated characters and then rotating the text box to compensate.

Please consider giving this feature more priority. The status quo is pretty bad. Nobody in Japan is happy with this, they're just yelling it out on Twitter instead of posting in the forum because that's the culture here.

[OscarKK]

New version and vertical text nowhere again. ☹️

[Haujet Zhao]

When processing images like that: 

Vertical text feature is creatically needed.