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Leading (in paragraph settings) should default to 120% rather than 103% - like in other design software.

Apart from 120% being the standard in other software like Adobe CS. 120% leading is known to be best practice in graphics design in general. It's just a better starting point that does not even have to be changed in most cases.

Moreover a leading value of 120% has even been the default in the successors of Affinity products.

If you don't want to change the default of 103%, please make the default leading value configurable in the settings dialog!

 

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120% leading likely comes from compatibility with MS Word, which is why ID & Q et all use it. Depending upon the font & language, 120% can be too loose or too tight.

You can change it to be a default, though. You need to make the change, update defaults and text styles.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

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120% is a standard in graphics design in general. This is explained in any good book about graphics design/typography.

Haha, yes, 120% can not be suitable, that's why you can change the value if needed. But in the majority of all cases 120% is the way to go - or at least to start with.

A deafult of 103% just makes no sense - unless you want documents with a lack of leading to become a synonym for being "made with affinity". Even PagePlus did it right - like the rest of the world.

 

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Sorry, but if you read about typography and calligraphy, you'll understand that Words "standard" 120% parameter is not a recommendation, and each font need different settings depending of its design (that's the whole purpose of these different designs, in fact: to combine purpose, lisibility and economy (economy: or how much text by page depending of the parchment/paper cost and selling price you want to achieve)).

Usually, you'll use the font's settings, done by the designer, or you'll accentuate it a little bit depending of  your design, if you have room or not in your page.

It's hard to teach not to use those 120%, since people trust too much "default parameters" instead of thinking and analysing their work, but usually 120% is too much and lines will look like independent lines in a title, or it'll be a pain to read a long text.

Reading good books or typographers’ blogs can help, for example:

http://paris.blog.lemonde.fr/

http://www.typogabor.com/

Here he talks more about "gris typo" and justification parameters since it's a reccurrent problem with ours apps, giving tip to be carefull of leading in the same way :)

 

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51 minutes ago, Wosven said:

people trust too much "default parameters" instead of thinking and analysing their work,

This is so true. 


MacBook Pro (13-inch, Mid 2012) Mac OS 10.12.6 || Mac Pro (Late 2013) Mac OS 10.14.5

Affinity Designer 1.7.2 | Affinity Photo 1.7.2 | Affinity Publisher 1.7.2 | Affinity Designer Beta 1.7.2.2 | Affinity Photo Beta 1.7.2.151 | Affinity Publisher Beta 1.7.2.458

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I would recommend to set leading for each style in pt. None of this default stuff.

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Still, 103% leading currently is the default in affinity products - and it's just plain stupid.

And it's totally out of question that the person in front of the machine still needs to think.

It's also out of question that a default is just needed as a starting point. Or would you really like to show a popup to ask the user for the desired leading when inserting text? LOL

Moreover, it's causing unnecessary pain when coming from any other competing product. 120% leading is the standard default value - like it or not.

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3 hours ago, designchris said:

Still, 103% leading currently is the default in affinity products

No, it's not, at least in Publisher. The default leading is taken from the font metrics. For example, for Arial it's 103%, but for Calibri it's about 122%.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.239), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.464 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.4464 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.458 Beta

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9 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

No, it's not, at least in Publisher. The default leading is taken from the font metrics. For example, for Arial it's 103%, but for Calibri it's about 122%.

For Gabriola it’s 170% (to allow for the optional swashes, some of which are huge).


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Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 1.7.1.404 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
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For my part, I am not too bothered by this, since we are able to set the leading as a percent or as a multiple in styles in addition to absolute. InDesign only allows "Auto" and absolute point sizes for paragraph styles (or am I mistaken?).

I do agree that the font default is often too narrow. Because we work in French, I always check to see if the descenders clash with accents on the capitals below. Here is a sampling of a few fonts with their default settings in Publisher. Some are okay, some not at all:

1034024677_ScreenShot2019-06-28at9_00_20AM.thumb.png.c14652eac42872387edb5eb906a16616.png

 

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6 hours ago, walt.farrell said:

No, it's not, at least in Publisher. The default leading is taken from the font metrics. For example, for Arial it's 103%, but for Calibri it's about 122%.

OMG - yes! Thank you for pointing that out!

I didn't notice that so far. Wow, that's changing the whole discussion.

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1 hour ago, Dave Harris said:

As Walk says, we get the default from the font metrics. You can however change that for new documents via Edit > Defaults > Save.

Can you elaborate on that, please, Dave?

I think I understand saving defaults, but in the context of adjusting paragraph leading, which needs to be relative to both the font and font size, what default setting are you suggesting we could adjust/save?

Thanks.

Never mind. I think that the hints from @Old Bruce and @MikeW are enough to enable me to play with this. Not that I plan to change it. I like the approach that you and the team have taken, Dave.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.239), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.464 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.4464 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.458 Beta

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24 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Can you elaborate on that, please, Dave?

I think I understand saving defaults, but in the context of adjusting paragraph leading, which needs to be relative to both the font and font size, what default setting are you suggesting we could adjust/save?

I think Dave means if you want 120% to be the default then feel free to set that as the default.

I would try it with some text selected in the No Style for Paragraph and Character then go to the Paragraph Studio. Select the leading and set to % and choose 120% and then go to Edit > Defaults > Synchronize from Selection and then Edit > Defaults > Save. I would not advise doing this because I think it is a foolish choice but if anyone wants to they can try. 

Again I would strongly advise to NOT do this.

I did it for my Space After Paragraph setting it to 0 points and that has stuck. I am happy with that.


MacBook Pro (13-inch, Mid 2012) Mac OS 10.12.6 || Mac Pro (Late 2013) Mac OS 10.14.5

Affinity Designer 1.7.2 | Affinity Photo 1.7.2 | Affinity Publisher 1.7.2 | Affinity Designer Beta 1.7.2.2 | Affinity Photo Beta 1.7.2.151 | Affinity Publisher Beta 1.7.2.458

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4 hours ago, garrettm30 said:

InDesign only allows "Auto" and absolute point sizes for paragraph styles (or am I mistaken?).

Yes, and since I use a grid for body text, I adjust leading accordingly for body text, and play around for titles and headers, etc. I don't need a popup, when the text feel right, I set the grid, the leading of paragraphs, and voilà! :)

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40 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Can you elaborate on that, please, Dave?

I think I understand saving defaults, but in the context of adjusting paragraph leading, which needs to be relative to both the font and font size, what default setting are you suggesting we could adjust/save?

Thanks.

Kinda like I mentioned in the first response...


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

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