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Andy Somerfield

Affinity Photo Customer Beta (1.7.0.135 - Gold Master Seed)

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8 hours ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

The problem with having it always set to "New" is that you can't use a modifier to add new parts to the selection while using that mode. In Photoshop you add to your selection by pressing down shift, which is a kind of a big deal for us painters who use the selection tool to block out shapes, while using the shift and alt modifiers to fine adjust our selections.

Yes, you can, on Windows and I presume on Mac. But you need to be using a mouse or a trackpad that lets you press both the left and right buttons at the same time. I haven't tried to figure out what might work using a stylus.

As shown on the status bar when in New mode, Drag+RightMouse will Add. So, just press the right mouse button, and hold while you press the left mouse button and start dragging. You can then release the right mouse button.

Unfortunately, if you only have a trackpad that won't let you press both buttons you're right that Add won't work in New mode, so you'll have to use the button in the Context Toolbar.

 


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.239), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.464 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.4464 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.458 Beta

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4 hours ago, ChristiduToit said:

@Andy Somerfield

Thanks for the quick response!
I actually much prefer having it the way it was where you set your preferences/custom settings for the selection tools and it stays that way when switching tools.
I've definitely encountered massive workflow issues with it resetting every time, as I often select those custom settings for a reason and wish to keep them that way until I decide to change them (in which case I will). I'm much more likely to use the same selection settings for a project then changing them, so I think it would be better to have them stay the way that I set them up rather than having them default to 'New' every time - custom settings, by nature, are after all there for the user to set things up the way they want.

Of course, I'm just one of many users, but if you prefer to keep it this way then I absolutely think that @Frozen Death Knight's suggestion of having a modifier key to add the little "+" next to the selection to add to your current selection would be incredibly useful - much like in PS holding down the Shift key will allow you to add to your selection without having to manually change the setting in the toolbar to "Add". Shift in Affinity is obviously used to add a straight line to the selection, so perhaps holding down Cmd would be a better option. That way you can create a selection, add to it by holding down (what every modifier key you choose to use) and subtract from it holding down the Alt key, allowing the user to sculpt out the perfect selection quickly and easily.
 

I would still put it as shift instead of cmd/ctrl, for the simple reason that shift in many other softwares are additive. I'd rather stick to the standard in this particular case.

After doing some quick testing, I also think that using the "Polygonal Lasso" setting should be toggable using ctrl/cmd so you don't need to hold the modifier key down while using shift and alt to add/remove parts of your selection. Holding down the current shift modifier for using it works, but I could see it getting a little uncomfortable while doing long sessions of detailed selections with the "Polygonal Lasso".

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24 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Yes, you can, on Windows and I presume on Mac. But you need to be using a mouse or a trackpad that lets you press both the left and right buttons at the same time. I haven't tried to figure out what might work using a stylus.

As shown on the status bar when in New mode, Drag+RightMouse will Add. So, just press the right mouse button, and hold while you press the left mouse button and start dragging. You can then release the right mouse button.

Unfortunately, if you only have a trackpad that won't let you press both buttons you're right that Add won't work in New mode, so you'll have to use the button in the Context Toolbar.

 

Thanks for letting me know (had no idea that holding down both did that). However, it's not really much of an option for me who uses a tablet to draw, as you said (also doesn't help that just holding down R click to add to selection doesn't work).

I can do some specific Wacom settings to make it function, but it seems a little bit backwards having to hold down both the L and R mouse buttons to do what one modifier key could do. Same could really be said about holding down alt+L click+R click to change brush size and hardness/softness with the Brush tool. These controls are not really made for pen and tablet use.
 

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9 hours ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

Right now shift switches to straight lines selection, which I think should be on ctrl instead, and "Add" should be on shift.

It is actually the other way around, and not broken.

 

You came up with quite a list of improvements, and it does look like Photo has made some big improvements for digital painting, though it still pales compared to Corel Painter... which kind of makes sense as that isn't really what it is designed for (neither is PhotoShop), but Painter is.  You might also want to check out Krita if you haven't already...  though if Photo is working for you, great.

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1 hour ago, fde101 said:

It is actually the other way around, and not broken.

 

You came up with quite a list of improvements, and it does look like Photo has made some big improvements for digital painting, though it still pales compared to Corel Painter... which kind of makes sense as that isn't really what it is designed for (neither is PhotoShop), but Painter is.  You might also want to check out Krita if you haven't already...  though if Photo is working for you, great.

In the latest Beta version on Windows it works just like that, so it is not the other way around as you stated. Unless you are using the live version only (haven't used that one in ages, so have no clue how it works there)?

Yes, Affinity Photo is still lacking stuff, as I stated. I am using AP for Beta testing so I can give feedback to the developers to get the software to a state where it is more suited for professional artists. I just made a compilation of improvements in 1.7 that were art related to the guy asking for them.

1.7 makes painting at least functionial, but we're still lacking stuff like brush dithering to fix this issue, GPU acceleration (Windows), creating a new brush from selection on a canvas (aka "Define Brush Preset" in Photoshop), more consistency with how modifiers behave for each tool that should have similar controls, and controls that work with a tablet (not this having to hold down R click and L click at the same time nonsense). If these core problems are solved, AP will be usable for professionals. Of course there are more stuff that can be done, but these things are the bare minimum as I see it.

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34 minutes ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

not the other way around as you stated

You were asking for straight line on control, and "add to selection" on shift.

It is the other way around: straight line is on shift, "add to selection" is on control.

At least on the Mac it has that arrangement...  and you are on the Mac part of the forum...

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10 minutes ago, fde101 said:

You were asking for straight line on control, and "add to selection" on shift.

It is the other way around: straight line is on shift, "add to selection" is on control.

At least on the Mac it has that arrangement...  and you are on the Mac part of the forum...

I think there has been a misunderstanding here. Just because it is that way on Mac or Windows (Windows has L click+R click for "Add" instead) doesn't change my stance on that I think it should be shift for "Add" and ctrl toggle for "Polygonal Lasso". I am saying that I want it to be that way, not that it currently is that way.

Also, I made it clear in previous posts that I am a Windows user, even going so far as calling the modifier ctrl and not cmd (plus, how can I be envious of Mac users having GPU acceleration if I am also a Mac user?).

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1 hour ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

Also, I made it clear in previous posts that I am a Windows user, even going so far as calling the modifier ctrl and not cmd (plus, how can I be envious of Mac users having GPU acceleration if I am also a Mac user?).

The modifier for this is control on the Mac, not command.  Macs do have control keys but they are used differently from the control keys on Windows.

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3 hours ago, aqcohen said:

The link seems broken.

Works for me (assuming you mean the download link at the top of this topic). Does it still fail for you?


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.239), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.464 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.4464 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.2.471 and 1.7.2.458 Beta

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On 5/31/2019 at 3:16 AM, Patrick Connor said:

This should be possible yes. We will try to get round to writing a guide to moving settings across from beta to release builds.

This would be fantastic. Since I'm fairly new to Affinity, I've actually been using the beta versions more than the non-beta so I'd love to take my settings with me.

 

14 hours ago, Frozen Death Knight said:

I would still put it as shift instead of cmd/ctrl, for the simple reason that shift in many other softwares are additive. I'd rather stick to the standard in this particular case.

I would too and never understood why it's counter to what is basically the standard.

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9 hours ago, Jeremy Bohn said:

I would too and never understood why it's counter to what is basically the standard.

It depends on what standard you are looking at.  If I have a Finder window open in a list view and have one thing selected, if I shift+click on something several entries later it selects contiguously, while a command+click gives me a discontiguous selection.

Most of these tools are offering a discontiguous selection (the selections don't need to touch each other), so going by the Finder (and nearly every other application on the Mac that allows discontiguous selection in a list view), in theory the modifier key should be command rather than control or shift.

That said, I checked against a few other photo/painting programs and they do all seem to use shift, so I could as easily argue that ALL of these programs get this wrong and they should all be using the command key, as you can argue that shift is some kind of "standard"...

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To csp, I am confused by your post and images as I use selection and refine often.  To be frank I have never seen that kind of problem in all the time and iterations of AP.   I have seen other issues with very delicate refining but never on such a simple job and the developers have risen to the challenge of solving most of those problems.   

Perhaps you should take a look at your cutout in black and white mode then use background and foreground to get the precision you desire.  

I agree with the developers.  If you have a problem lay out a course of action to help solve the problem. 

The consistent, carping criticism solves nothing.  

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7 hours ago, fde101 said:

It depends on what standard you are looking at.  If I have a Finder window open in a list view and have one thing selected, if I shift+click on something several entries later it selects contiguously, while a command+click gives me a discontiguous selection.

I would go by graphics apps, but I know what you mean. Actually, shift was the only way to multi-select in Finder until OS X as far as I remember so the shift key equaling ADD goes back from before the command key ever came into the picture.

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On 6/1/2019 at 3:26 PM, walt.farrell said:

Works for me (assuming you mean the download link at the top of this topic). Does it still fail for you?

Tried again and works normal.

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14 hours ago, fde101 said:

That said, I checked against a few other photo/painting programs and they do all seem to use shift, so I could as easily argue that ALL of these programs get this wrong and they should all be using the command key, as you can argue that shift is some kind of "standard"...

It's not necessarily about right or wrong if something is standard in these circumstances. However, following the standard will help people from other softwares to jump on board easier. It's like when Blender quite recently added the option to L click to select 3D objects in a scene, while having it set to R click since its inception in the 90's. It went completely against most standards of how software shortcuts were designed, and many ignored Blender because of it. To people who used the old method it was fine, but with industry standard shortcuts a lot of people started jumping on board, myself included.

Anyway, back to Affinity Photo; all of this could be solved if softwares started allowing people to customize tool commands a bit more freely like the modifiers and mouse buttons. That way more people can be happy, as I see it.

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On 5/31/2019 at 2:47 AM, Chris B said:
On 5/31/2019 at 2:26 AM, RNKLN said:

May I assume that the upcoming 1.7 App Store version will take the preferences from 1.6.X and not from the installed Beta?

Correct! Also, anything you have created (assets, brushes etc.) in the beta that you wish to keep, will need exporting so you can load it into the 1.7 App Store version when released. I would probably recommend doing this sooner than later. 

Obviously, not everyone using the Mac customer beta knows or has thought about this. Since some Mac users are almost certainly using the System Preferences > App Store option to automatically download & install app updates, they are not going to be very happy if/when they discover they can no longer run the beta to export these items. To mitigate that, I think that if possible it would be a good idea to send all the Mac beta users an email telling them about this ASAP. (I assume Serif has contact info for everyone who has downloaded the customer betas.)

 

On 5/31/2019 at 5:16 AM, Patrick Connor said:
On 5/31/2019 at 4:37 AM, thomasp said:

Is it possible to simply copy over all preferences manually - including window placement and so on and just have them work in the release (same for Windows)?

This should be possible yes. We will try to get round to writing a guide to moving settings across from beta to release builds.

This is something else that should be done ASAP, for much the same reason.


Affinity Photo 1.7.2, Affinity Designer 1.7.2, Affinity Publisher 1.7.2; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.153 & Affinity Designer 1.7.2.6 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

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13 minutes ago, R C-R said:

they are not going to be very happy if/when they discover they can no longer run the beta to export these items.

The betas and released products have always been separate

Once 1.7 is released I expect it to overwrite/upgrade the 1.6 version I have,  but not touch my 1.7 beta install

So I should still be able to run that 1.7 beta after I install the 1.7 released product so that I can export whatever I need to export from it. At least for 2-4(?) weeks until the beta expires.

1. Or am I wrong?
2. Or do Macs not work like this?

(I'm on Windows)

 


Due to the ongoing Brexit negotiations, punctuation, spelling and grammar will be used sparingly until further notice.

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5 minutes ago, carl123 said:

The betas and released products have always been separate

Once 1.7 is released I expect it to overwrite/upgrade the 1.6 version I have,  but not touch my 1.7 beta install

So I should still be able to run that 1.7 beta after I install the 1.7 released product so that I can export whatever I need to export from it. At least for 2-4(?) weeks until the beta expires.

1. Or am I wrong?
2. Or do Macs not work like this?

(I'm on Windows)

As I understand it, betas have a baked in expiration date after which they no longer will run. Usually, this is set far enough in the future that a new beta or a new retail update will be available before then. That would be no problem here, but at least in my experience with Macs, they also won't run if there is a newer retail version installed, where "newer" means any version with a newer creation date.


Affinity Photo 1.7.2, Affinity Designer 1.7.2, Affinity Publisher 1.7.2; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.153 & Affinity Designer 1.7.2.6 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

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1 hour ago, R C-R said:

As I understand it, betas have a baked in expiration date after which they no longer will run.

I could be mistaken, but this might only be for Publisher as the betas for the other two products require that the user already have a licensed released version installed and if they have those they will be eligible for the upgrades anyway?  I believe the time limit on the Publisher beta is to prevent people from using them long-term without buying a license after it is released?

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AFAIK, the MacOS Customer beta builds do recognise new Affinity Store builds as valid and will NOT stop working. Exporting can be done after the 1.7 update is live

AFAIK, the MacOS Customer beta builds do not recognise new Mac App Store builds as valid and will stop working [actually it prompts for a product key].  However, as soon as there is a 1.7.1 Customer beta build it will recognise the MAS 1.7.0 release build. For this case exporting NOW would seem the best option.

AFAIK the Windows Customer 1.7.0 beta builds continue to work when the Microsoft Store builds update to 1.7.0 or the Affinity Store build updates to 1.7.0. Exporting can be done after the 1.7 update is live

Publisher is a Public beta (not customer) and will expire as soon as the software launches (the day after). The first Affinity Publisher Customer beta will use the same save location and so a 1.7.1 customer beta will allow settings etc to be exported after launch. For this case exporting NOW would seem the best option, but I am sure we will make a Customer beta available shortly after launch for those who did not know to export now.


Patrick Connor
Serif (Europe) Ltd.

Latest releases on each platform 

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1 hour ago, Patrick Connor said:

AFAIK, the MacOS Customer beta builds do not recognise new Mac App Store builds as valid and will stop working [actually it prompts for a product key].  However, as soon as there is a 1.7.1 Customer beta build it will recognise the MAS 1.7.0 release build. For this case exporting NOW would seem the best option.

So if I understand what you are saying correctly, since I bought the Affinity apps from the Mac App Store, as soon as I install (automatically or otherwise) the first 1.7 update from the MAS, I will not be able to use my 1.7.x beta version. Thus, I should export NOW all the brushes, macros, etc. that are unique to my beta that I want to keep using with the MAS update. Do I have this right?

I do periodically export both these beta & retail items anyway, but over time it gets harder to know in each respective app which ones I have modified by adding, removing, or moving items from one category to another. So for example, I have purged some of the default retail brush categories of brushes I never use & combined others originally from different categories into one of the defaults & then deleted the category that just contained duplicates or ones I never use.

I suspect I am not alone in this, so I am hoping that whatever guide you may write for moving settings from beta to release builds will take this into account somehow. 


Affinity Photo 1.7.2, Affinity Designer 1.7.2, Affinity Publisher 1.7.2; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.2.153 & Affinity Designer 1.7.2.6 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

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On 6/3/2019 at 6:07 AM, R C-R said:

So if I understand what you are saying correctly, since I bought the Affinity apps from the Mac App Store, as soon as I install (automatically or otherwise) the first 1.7 update from the MAS, I will not be able to use my 1.7.x beta version. Thus, I should export NOW all the brushes, macros, etc. that are unique to my beta that I want to keep using with the MAS update. Do I have this right?

I do periodically export both these beta & retail items anyway, but over time it gets harder to know in each respective app which ones I have modified by adding, removing, or moving items from one category to another. So for example, I have purged some of the default retail brush categories of brushes I never use & combined others originally from different categories into one of the defaults & then deleted the category that just contained duplicates or ones I never use.

I suspect I am not alone in this, so I am hoping that whatever guide you may write for moving settings from beta to release builds will take this into account somehow. 

This is just something I kinda resigned myself that i had to do after every beta/update: reinstall all brushes, textures, assets, etc. It got to be such a hassle that I didn't bother to install any add-ons at all for a few dot releases .It would be great if the location of these add ons were in a unified location -- independent of versions, so that what I install on Designer, could be accessible (when appropriate, like for raster brushes) in Photo and Publisher. Maybe even for Layer FX,


2014 iMac, 3.5 Ghz Intel Core i7, Secondary Samsung SyncMaster B2430 display, 16GB RAM, MacOS10.12 || Magic keyboard w/numeric keypad, wireless trackpad, Kengsington Edge Trackball, Wacom Pro Large tablet || Flux Capacitor in a secure location

---

I encourage kids to go ahead and play on my lawn. I mean, how else can I make sure the death-traps work?

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