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larsh

PDF-X4, X3? Is all the same?

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Hi, some hours it needs to find out, that PDF is not PDF, and the PDF-export gives only good colors, if PDF-X4 is used, bilinear is set, while the setting: "PDF-print" out of APu is more grey. Is there a setting to make it better? PDF-X4 is near what I see on the APu screen (no exact calibration) and on the screen of Capture one. And it is accepted at blurb.de, where my prints are done. Best, lars


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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Hi, looks like APu changes them to CMVK. But it is fine to know the difference and understand why I created the images new half a doozen. I try to find colors of skin the first time... Very difficult for me. With the X4, may be the X1 too, it get a chance. Thanks, lars


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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It is not irrelevant, which output standard you have to use. Most printing companies reject X-4 and demand for X-3 for example.

You have to learn, that RGB and CMYK (which is necessary for print)  don’t relate 1:1.

First, RGB has a much wider color space than CMYK.

Second, there is no explicit mathematical correspondence between RGB and CMYK colours. This would be the case, if CMYK simply is CMY. But for printing reasons one needs to add „K“ and instantly every RGB colour has thousands and thousands of „correct" CMYK „equivalents“. This ambiguousness normally is controlled by colour profiles, which correlate RGB colour values to CMYK colour values under consideration of the used printing inks, output material and other decisive factors.

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Hi, thanks again. I know a little about the system. But nothing about the settings. It looks like that all the PDF with X make the same files, if bilinear or another in: MORE. They have more or intensiv color as other settings without X (CMVK; and the file is bigger). There is a test now sent to print with /X-4; we will see. Best, lars


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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Hi, see I right, that – whatever is set to EXPORT PDF / MORE – APu makes the same PDF-file? Only 72 dpi or 300 are different? What is PDF 1.6, please? Is it different to PDF/X-4? Is this PDF a CMVK-file? Are all PDF in CMVK? 

Why allways the PDF-titel in Vorschau/ View is an old one, which I used a month before? I took the old file in APu but gave it a new name for the next project. Thx, lars

 


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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So, 20 files PDF more... 

Seams to bring the best PDF 300 dpi: click on first table-EXPORT above: /X-4, nothing in: MORE (or in the middle set: CMYK, I´m not shure if necessary; a print comes)

To give the best PDF 72 dpi: above: PDF flatten, 72 dpi (raster), in MORE in the middle: RGB (it is for Web). This one is bigger than others but the colors are like APu.

(there are some test in PDF 1.7 = bad colors, "grey"). 


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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I think it is not the place to discuss PDF specifications here. It is a much to extensive theme – especially, if we don’t know, what your previous knowledge is. 

In (ver) short:

• Older PDF specifications for print(!) don’t allow RGB oder spot colours or transparencies.

• newer ones allow these options under certain circumstances (colour profiles, output intent, …)

• Most printing companies don’t like  PDF 1.4 or newer, because they want „flattened“ files (= transparency merged down)

If you want a short overview, Wikipedia is a good help.

 

And: Please, stop testing without knowing, what you are doing  (dpi and „raster“ are completely different things; 72 dpi image resolution has no meaning as long as we don’t know in which size the images are placed. This leads to nothing.

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Heaven, no. I´m not interested in PDF, not in APu or other programms etc. I only want to bring images from my camera (RAW) along Capture1 and APu to a workbook, printed, and for WEB in all the same colors. So I need a very few commands for a very simple user, that works (as it will if BETA is out). I wished never had heard about the table: MORE and thousand parameters and not to have 25 tests. Thanks for your help and to other help too! Bye. The next run in half a year making the next workbook... lars


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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33 minutes ago, larsh said:

I only want to bring images from my camera (RAW) along Capture1 and APu to a workbook, printed, and for WEB in all the same colors.

This is like asking for two different brands of red paint that will produce the same shade of blue.

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Sorry, I don´t understand (but may be the sense, that I´m stupid; in this field it is right). The problem is simple, and may be it is not me but APu; you may tell me. Have a look to the screenshot: APu, C1 = same colors, ok? (I try to learn skin colors). Below the Web-PDF – not so good, isn´t. It is made by APu PDF-Web. And then, if you like, go to:

http://www.larshennings.de/down/larshennings.de-CC-72.pdf p. 31. It´s from APu too, colors are better. But I don´t know how it is made; confused. (to do it with flatters was wrong). Best regards, lars

farbtest.jpeg


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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One suggestion: while you're in the learning phase and uncertain how things work and what you should be doing, it might be better to post your questions in Discussions and Suggestions for Affinity Publisher rather than in this forum, which is for reporting bugs.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 2004 (19041.388),
   Desktop: 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00GHz, GeForce GTX 970
   Laptop:  8GB memory, Intel Core i7-3625QM @ 2.30GHz, Intel HD Graphics 4000 or NVIDIA GeForce GT 630M
Affinity Photo 1.8.5.703 and 1.9.0.734 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.8.5.703 and 1.9.0.734 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.8.5.703 and 1.8.5.703 Beta.

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I tried to reproduce you issues. What I did:

  • I took an RGB image (profile: sRGB) and placed it in Publisher.
  • I exported this document as:
  1. CMYK, profile ISO Coated V2, X-3, PDF 1.7
  2. CMYK, profile ISO Coated V2, PDF 1.3
  3. RGB, profile sRGB, PDF 1.4
  4. RGB, profile sRGB, PDF 1.7

The results are absolutely as expected. Divergences are due to different color spaces (RGB – CMYK) But: The image was prepared in Photoshop (if you want: Affinity Photo) not to diverge too much, when converted to CMYK. This is necessary in every case, because color divergences between RGB and CMYK are widely inevitable.

If you encounter different results, there is no other way, than to get acquainted to color management – sorry …

compare.jpg

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THANK YOU, mac_heibu, THANK YOU VERY MUCH! That´s it. My RGB had Ad. 98. It must set in MORE... and runs. lars


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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Sorry: Adobe-98


AP 1.8.3 // AD 1.8.3 // APu 1.8.3: Capture One+ 12; MacBook Pro, OSX 10.14.6, early 2012 (ret), flsh 256 GB, RAM 16 GB; // Fuji X-Pro2, XF 18 - 55, XF 55 - 200 mm, nikkor 2.8/ 20 mm with shift 

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