Importing In Camera HDR Files

[Wanderer3]

I shoot landscapes with a Pentax K-1 which has an in camera HDR function, merging 3 images.  When I import one of these files the imported image appears to be one of the three RAW files and not the merged one.  I've looked in the Workbook and done a search for this but couldn't find anything.  I only recently started using Affinity.  My OS is Win 10.  Is there a way to import the merged file?  Thanks for any help.

[John Rostron]

Do you import all the files on the camera? It would probably have saved the HDR file as a jpeg.

John

[Wanderer3]

The files in question come out of the camera as DNG.  The camera uses two cards, one is used for raw, one for jpg, and these are the raw files.  I usually export files from Affinity as Tiff.  I hope this answers your question (I'm a dunce on this sort of stuff, being an old guy who has barely gotten out of the film age).  Thanks for the reply.

Mike

[IanSG]

I'm not a K-1 user but I've read that the in-camera HDR merge only works for JPEG.  If you're shooting in RAW you get the bracketted images but the merging has to be done on a computer.  You also have the option of discarding the over & under exposed images.

[John Rostron]

Have a look at this posting on the Pentax forum.

What I suggest for you to try and see what is going on is:

1. Start with a pair of empty SD cards.
2. Take a single set of HDR images.
3. Download the images on each of the cards  to your computer
4. Examine DNG and the jpeg files on your computer, not just on Affinity, but on any DNG viewer that you might have. 

I make the last suggestion because it may be that the three HDR images could be embedded in a single  DNG in an unspecified manner.

John

[IanSG]

This is worth a look too.

[Wanderer3]

1 hour ago, IanSG said:

This is worth a look too.

 

1 hour ago, IanSG said:

I'm not a K-1 user but I've read that the in-camera HDR merge only works for JPEG.  If you're shooting in RAW you get the bracketted images but the merging has to be done on a computer.  You also have the option of discarding the over & under exposed images.

That isn't the case with the K-1 which can do an in camera merge of 3 Raw files ( I assume JPEG also although I've never done that).  My problem is that on import of one of these merged files Affinity only recognizes one of them so I can't process the merged, HDR file the camera produced.  It may be that I will not be able to use Affinity for editing these files.

Edited February 5, 2019 by Wanderer3
addition

[walt.farrell]

4 minutes ago, Wanderer3 said:

That isn't the case with the K-1 which can do an in camera merge of 3 Raw files ( I assume JPEG also although I've never done that).  My problem is that on import of one of these merged files Affinity only recognizes one of them so I can't process the merged, HDR file the camera produced.

If the camera has already merged the 3 RAW images, wouldn't it only output 1 image? If you transfer all the files from the camera to your computer (as John Rostron suggested above) and look at them (in Finder or File Explorer) do you actually see 3 RAW images, or only the 1 merged image?

[Wanderer3]

20 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

If the camera has already merged the 3 RAW images, wouldn't it only output 1 image? If you transfer all the files from the camera to your computer (as John Rostron suggested above) and look at them (in Finder or File Explorer) do you actually see 3 RAW images, or only the 1 merged image?

I apologize for not being able to make this more clear.  Yes, the camera outputs a single merged image of three exposures - it does this automatically,  I don't have to take multiple exposures as one does for HDR processing in a computer.  So I have a single, already merged file but when I upload it to Affinity the merged photo isn't shown but rather another image that looks quite different and is apparently one of the three files the camera used for the merge.  I have not been able to find a way to upload the merged files the camera did into Affinity for processing.  Thanks for your input.

[John Rostron]

The impression I got from the Pentax Forum was that the three images are included in the single DNG file. Perhaps they are included as Layers. Have you tried looking at the Layers Panel for the DNG?

John

[Wanderer3]

4 hours ago, John Rostron said:

The impression I got from the Pentax Forum was that the three images are included in the single DNG file. Perhaps they are included as Layers. Have you tried looking at the Layers Panel for the DNG?

John

That may be true.  If the three images are not imbedded in the merged file how could Affinity find and extract one of the three, which it appears to me is happening, although I am not certain of that.  I do recall some discussion in the Pentax Forum if, after the merged HDR file was created,  all three images that went into it could be individually extracted but I don't recall what the conclusion was, or if there was one.

I tried to go into the Layers Panel as you suggested but have not used layers yet and didn't know what I was doing.  I didn't find any files.  Thanks again for trying to help me.

Mike

[walt.farrell]

Googling I found a couple of discussions stating that if you choose to use the in-camera HDR merge you need to use a Pentax utility to process the images before using them in other applications. One state4d that it was more common for users to simply use bracketing, and to do the HDR merge manually using their standard applications.

[Wanderer3]

I know that processing of Pixel Shift Resolution files can't be done by some editing programs and I downloaded RawTherapee (free) because it's recommended on the Pentax Forum for that purpose.  However I've found that Affinity can process PSR files and never used RawTherapee.  I was not aware that the same situation exists with the K-1 in camera HDR.

As an experiment I uploaded one of the in camera HDR files into each of the four editing programs I have in my computer, Affinity,  Photoshop Elements 14,  RawTherapee, and FastStone.  Just as in Affinity, the uploaded file's image was not the HDR image, but apparently one of the three files used in the HDR merge, in  both Elements and RawTherapee.  In FastStone however the image was the merged HDR one!  I find it ironic that the only one of the four programs that did this was the free, more basic and limited one.  Perhaps I can upload my HDR files to FastStone first, do some basic processing, and then move the files to Affinity for more processing.  I haven't had time to try that yet but will do so soon.

[walt.farrell]

1 minute ago, Wanderer3 said:

Perhaps I can upload my HDR files to FastStone first, do some basic processing, and then move the files to Affinity for more processing. 

Or, rather than FastStone, you could try the utility that Pentax provides

[Wanderer3]

4 minutes ago, walt.farrell said:

Or, rather than FastStone, you could try the utility that Pentax provides

According to posts on the Pentax Forum RawTherapee is the preferred program for these purposes, being more capable than the Pentax utility.  At least that's whats been said about PSR processing.  Why it can't import an in camera merged HDR file is a mystery to me.

[IanSG]

7 hours ago, Wanderer3 said:

In FastStone however the image was the merged HDR one! 

Are you sure it's working with a merged RAW image and not an embedded JPEG?

[Wanderer3]

As best I can tell in this case FastStone is working with a DNG 121 MB file.  Since each of the three files used in the merge was about 40 MB I believe it is the merged file.  But, I am not an expert in using these programs and haven't used FastStone in several years and don't recall much about using it at this point.  But when I look at the image in FastStone and look at the listed file properties DNG and 121 MB are what it says.  Thanks again for your help.

[IanSG]

10 hours ago, Wanderer3 said:

As best I can tell in this case FastStone is working with a DNG 121 MB file.  Since each of the three files used in the merge was about 40 MB I believe it is the merged file.  But, I am not an expert in using these programs and haven't used FastStone in several years and don't recall much about using it at this point.  But when I look at the image in FastStone and look at the listed file properties DNG and 121 MB are what it says.  Thanks again for your help.

I've just had a look at some of my K-5 DNGs with Fastone - it's displaying / editing the embedded JPEG.  If you type <ctrl> R it displays the image / file size of the image it's using.   The properties of the DNG files themselves are also correctly displayed, but that's not the data that's being edited.

[Wanderer3]

10 hours ago, IanSG said:

I've just had a look at some of my K-5 DNGs with Fastone - it's displaying / editing the embedded JPEG.  If you type <ctrl> R it displays the image / file size of the image it's using.   The properties of the DNG files themselves are also correctly displayed, but that's not the data that's being edited.

I think you are correct on this.  Upon exploring the merged file more in FastStone and attempting a simple edit, the resulting file was changed to JPEG.  I don't understand why all of the merged DNG properties would be displayed, as well as what was obviously the appearance of the merged HDR file,  and it would not edit that file but rather an embedded JPEG file.  It makes no sense to me but , as I explained  in the OP,  my knowledge of all of this rudimentary.  On a different note, after attempting to use RawTherapy for the first time and FastStone for the first time in years, I was struck by how counter intuitive and difficult to use they both were, at least to my weak brain.  Thank goodness for Affinity!

I'm still not sure now how to go about processing these 120 mb in camera merged HDR files but I'll keep investigating as I very much would like to do that.  Thanks to all for their help.

Mike

[R C-R]

14 hours ago, Wanderer3 said:

On a different note, after attempting to use RawTherapy for the first time and FastStone for the first time in years, I was struck by how counter intuitive and difficult to use they both were, at least to my weak brain. 

I doubt it has anything to do with your brain. RAW in general is much more complicated than it might seem -- see for instance James Ritson's "RAW, Actually" Spotlight article for more about that -- & adding HDR merging or any other specialized features to the mix makes it even more complicated.