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I don't know if they will do what you want, but there are options for Orphans and Widows in the Paragraph Studio, under Flow Options.


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.356), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.7.3.475 Beta

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garrettm30 You're right! 

Eliminate (one-letter or single-letter) conjunctions hanging at the end of the line by "Text > Find (Find and Replace)". A function similar to GREP from InDesign would be helpful :)

Zrzut ekranu (24).png

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Actually, I just learned in another thread that the terms widow and orphan are used for a different issue than that in English, and I think we may be confusing the issue here. At least, when I responded, I had the English usage in mind. In English, widows and orphans refer to single lines of text that get separated from the rest of the paragraph by page breaks. The widow and orphan control in Publisher is not what you are wanting.

GREP searches would help, and we have been talking about that in another thread.

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On 8/30/2018 at 9:48 PM, garrettm30 said:

As a side note, I like how they worded the options in such a way that helps one remember which is a widow and which is an orphan. I always get those backwards.

 

1341100394_ScreenShot2018-08-30at2_45_55PM.png.b3c0e19c30131aad9aaffcfda09c7459.png

There is no option to select number of lines for orphan/widow control.


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25 minutes ago, Petar Petrenko said:

There is no option to select number of lines for orphan/widow control.

True. That is intentional. Using widow and orphan control at all has the drawback that it makes the previous page look uneven because of the blank space at the bottom. If you made the blank space taller by a line, it would look even worse. Meanwhile the next page wouldn't be much improved by the extra line.

For this reason, some people allow orphaned first lines even while preventing widowed last lines. Widowed lines can look worse because they can be short lines; you might have just one or two words floating at the top of a page not connected to anything. An orphaned first line will always be a whole line, and that doesn't look so bad at the bottom of a page. Hence some people would rather have an orphaned first line than blank space at the bottom of the page.

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On 9/5/2018 at 6:22 AM, Dave Harris said:

Using widow and orphan control at all has the drawback that it makes the previous page look uneven because of the blank space at the bottom. If you made the blank space taller by a line, it would look even worse. Meanwhile the next page wouldn't be much improved by the extra line.

For this reason, some people allow orphaned first lines even while preventing widowed last lines. Widowed lines can look worse because they can be short lines; you might have just one or two words floating at the top of a page not connected to anything. An orphaned first line will always be a whole line, and that doesn't look so bad at the bottom of a page. Hence some people would rather have an orphaned first line than blank space at the bottom of the page.

Good points. Thanks for elaborating.

Related question: It sometimes occurs that there is only one word in the last line of a paragraph. Is there a term you use for this phenomenon? (I guess it's not called a widowed last line unless it comes after a page-break.)

And whatever the term you use for this one-word last line of a paragraph, is there a way to have the program avoid it by re-setting the text of the paragraph?

 


Using macOS 10.13.6,    Publisher 1.7.1.408,    and Publisher Beta 1.7.2.420.

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1 hour ago, cubesquareredux said:

Good points. Thanks for elaborating.

Related question: It sometimes occurs that there is only one word in the last line of a paragraph. Is there a term you use for this phenomenon? (I guess it's not called a widowed last line unless it comes after a page-break.)

And whatever the term you use for this one-word last line of a paragraph, is there a way to have the program avoid it by re-setting the text of the paragraph?

 

You should make a copy of your Body Paragraph Style and adjust these Word and Letter settings. Keep in mind not to change them drastically.

justify.png


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28 minutes ago, Petar Petrenko said:

You should make a copy of your Body Paragraph Style and adjust these Word and Letter settings. Keep in mind not to change them drastically.

Thanks, Petar. I see what you mean. I'll play with those settings to see if I can find a reliable solution.


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On 12/24/2018 at 3:54 PM, cubesquareredux said:

Good points. Thanks for elaborating.

Related question: It sometimes occurs that there is only one word in the last line of a paragraph. Is there a term you use for this phenomenon? (I guess it's not called a widowed last line unless it comes after a page-break.)

And whatever the term you use for this one-word last line of a paragraph, is there a way to have the program avoid it by re-setting the text of the paragraph?

Some people call them "runts". We don't currently have any support for avoiding them automatically.

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3 minutes ago, Dave Harris said:

Some people call them "runts". We don't currently have any support for avoiding them automatically.

Clearly not the most urgent need — but thanks for letting me know.


Using macOS 10.13.6,    Publisher 1.7.1.408,    and Publisher Beta 1.7.2.420.

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20 hours ago, Dave Harris said:

Some people call them "runts". We don't currently have any support for avoiding them automatically.

Automatically preventing runts isn't necessarily a good idea anyway. The issue isn't always that there is a single word but this single word's syllable count. For instance, I would be less likely to deal with the word accessibility than the word access. These decisions cannot be made by a check box or other type of entry box in the UI.

It is easy enough to, while paging a document, make decisions as to whether one should micro-track narrower/tighter the entire paragraph or use kerning in order to push more words into that last line or to pull that last word up into the body of the paragraph. Only a human can make that judgment. That human can see the context of how the pages balance and this would be incredibly difficult for a machine to do.

My 2 cents...

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25 minutes ago, MikeW said:

Automatically preventing runts isn't necessarily a good idea anyway. The issue isn't always that there is a single word but this single word's syllable count. For instance, I would be less likely to deal with the word accessibility than the word access. These decisions cannot be made by a check box or other type of entry box in the UI.

It is easy enough to, while paging a document, make decisions as to whether one should micro-track narrower/tighter the entire paragraph or use kerning in order to push more words into that last line or to pull that last word up into the body of the paragraph. Only a human can make that judgment. That human can see the context of how the pages balance and this would be incredibly difficult for a machine to do.

My 2 cents...

2 cents times 50, Mike.   So glad somebody with 3,360 posts and 1,219 returns suggested working with tracking and kerning to solve the “runt” problem.   Thought of suggesting it — because it is what I have been doing for donkey’s years — but didn’t want the usual suspects doubting my ability to work around much of anything.    Pretty funny, actually.  Happy New Year!! 


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Maybe it would be nice if we have this option in paragraph styles:
if one word is on a last line then use "Body text narrow" also use "Body text".


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7 minutes ago, Petar Petrenko said:

Maybe it would be nice if we have this option in paragraph styles:
if one word is on a last line then use "Body text narrow" also use "Body text".

What would that accomplish that the existing hyphenation options (in the paragraph style) don't handle?


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.356), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.7.3.475 Beta

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One style instead of two? :)


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12 minutes ago, Petar Petrenko said:

One style instead of two? :)

I don't understand. Example, please?


-- Walt

Windows 10 Home, version 1903 (18362.356), 16GB memory, Intel Core i7-6700K @ 4.00Gz, GeForce GTX 970
Affinity Photo 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta   / Affinity Designer 1.7.3.481 and 1.8.0.486 Beta  / Affinity Publisher 1.7.3.481 and 1.7.3.475 Beta

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On 12/28/2018 at 7:29 PM, Dave Harris said:

Some people call them "runts".

For now I tested manually adding non-breaking spaces before the last word if needed, but it's buggy: it can add hyphenation where the NBspace is :S 

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21 hours ago, jmwellborn said:

working with tracking and kerning to solve the “runt” problem

I mostly use font scaling for changing the length of text as it keeps the original colour of the text block – of course as needed adjustments are usually minor, it does not really make much difference if you use scale, tracking or hyphenation adjustments.

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