LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 27 minutes ago, Renzatic said: Linux's biggest weakness isn't that it's some also-ran OS only used by FOSS zealots Oh indeed. Including Linus Torvalds and his attitude towards Nvidia. The fact that Nvidia make well performing drivers really annoys him. Too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 22 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: Why are you so aggressively opposed to Linux? I am not. I have stated several times that Linux has its place. And on the desktop Linux is nowhere. 22 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: why Affinity has decided it's not worth the engineering effort It's the market for desktop Linux which is the most important. Even given the deficiencies of Linux it is possible to write software for Linux, that is clear. 23 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: Can you provide *any* credible data to back up your claims? Go and look up the market share for Linux on the desktop compared to Mac and Windows. 24 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: even small businesses and sole proprietorships can do everything (or almost everything) in a web browser Those are not desktop apps. 25 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: I mean, if you hate Linux, more power to you, but maybe don't poo in our sandbox over it? Linux is not your sandbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aronkvh Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 5 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Linux's biggest weakness isn't that it's some also-ran OS only used by FOSS zealots pretty sure that was irony there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aronkvh Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 honestly I can't imagine myself going on a Windows forum post just to tell everyone how bad Windows is and the deficiencies and how it's market share is sinking and doesn't do something I want to and why do they even want a Mac app to be ported to Windows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, aronkvh said: pretty sure that was irony there I disagree. Take Debian. Oooo we'll use Firefox but strip out all references to Firefox and call it Iceweasel instead. We don't like brand names boo hoo. We'll waste time rebranding things. It's totally pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, aronkvh said: honestly I can't imagine myself going on a Windows forum post just to tell everyone how bad Windows is and the deficiencies and how it's market share is sinking and doesn't do something I want to and why do they even want a Mac app to be ported to Windows And? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renzatic Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 16 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Oh indeed. Including Linus Torvalds and his attitude towards Nvidia. The fact that Nvidia make well performing drivers really annoys him. Too bad. What annoys Torvalds is how Nvidia does its own thing, and ignores everything else the Linux community tries to do. Like their refusal to do anything with Wayland until here recently being one of the bigger sticking points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, Renzatic said: ignores everything else the Linux community tries to do As though Nvidia owes Linux anything. Remember the desktop share: Linux is nowhere. It's unimportant to Nvidia. But you highlight, probably unintentionally, an important point: the Linux 'community' thinks the world revolves around them. I haven't seen anything that is actually 'new' in Linux that I have not seen in older versions of (real) UNIX, or on Windows or Mac. So Linux is hardly at the forefront of anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renzatic Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: As though Nvidia owes Linux anything. Remember the desktop share: Linux is nowhere. It's unimportant to Nvidia. Yet they spend the time and effort to release and support their hardware drivers right alongside Windows. 4 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: But you highlight, probably unintentionally, an important point: the Linux 'community' thinks the world revolves around them. I haven't seen anything that is actually 'new' in Linux that I have not seen in older versions of (real) UNIX, or on Windows or Mac. So Linux is hardly at the forefront of anything. It's not just the Linux community. Nvidia's kinda known to be a bit rude to everyone else. They did quite a bit to piss off Apple too, to the point that they now refuse to support any Nvidia hardware on their machines. Michael Tunnell and Vex 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vex Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: I am not. I have stated several times that Linux has its place. And on the desktop Linux is nowhere. But your entire role in this thread has been to derail it, insisting that there's no legitimate reason to even entertain a discussion about Affinity on Linux. That's dumb. Unless you have special insider information from Affinity on the subject, you're not actually contributing anything to the discussion; you're just posting so people have to pay attention to you. 30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: It's the market for desktop Linux which is the most important. Yes, and your understanding of that market, I'm guessing, is based on news articles and public data that doesn't actually deep-dive into industry research. I've done that second part. And I'm telling you your entire premise is flawed. 30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Even given the deficiencies of Linux it is possible to write software for Linux, that is clear. This alone shows how little you actually know or understand about Linux, and I'm betting you've also never actually written desktop software. You don't actually know what you're talking about on this one. 30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Those are not desktop apps. That wasn't my point though, was it? Why don't you re-read what I wrote and use context clues to understand why I mentioned this. 30 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Linux is not your sandbox. Is that what I said? You've come to a thread where people are discussing the merits and potential of Affinity on Linux, and your only contribution to this thread can be summed up as "shut up, nobody cares." Rude. 7 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: As though Nvidia owes Linux anything. Remember the desktop share: Linux is nowhere. It's unimportant to Nvidia. But you highlight, probably unintentionally, an important point: the Linux 'community' thinks the world revolves around them. I haven't seen anything that is actually 'new' in Linux that I have not seen in older versions of (real) UNIX, or on Windows or Mac. So Linux is hardly at the forefront of anything. Hahahahahahahahahahaha you are totally full of it, and this is enough evidence for me. Linux is a VERY popular operating system for crypto miners, and Nvidia's GPUs have been held captive by the crypto market for several years now. Nvidia also continues to release - and support - a solid Linux driver, and they have contributed to Valve's efforts to make Steam cross-platform. I know you really want to be the expert here, but you're not. m.vlad, Renzatic and Michael Tunnell 2 1 Pink Floyd was right. | Windows 10 · MacOS 10.14 · Arch Linux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vex Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 15 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: So Linux is hardly at the forefront of anything. A LOT of things YOU take for granted on Mac and PC started in Linux, many moons ago. Not everyone chooses an OS based on whether or not it has the latest greatest gimmick. Michael Tunnell 1 Pink Floyd was right. | Windows 10 · MacOS 10.14 · Arch Linux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Interactive Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 6 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Linux is nowhere. It's unimportant to Nvidia. More than 1 million Steam users are using Linux. Steam users (generally) use predominantly Nvidia GPU's. Crypto mining under Linux is popular. Can't put my finger on figures though. Machine Learning is also big under Linux.Nvidia have their own Linux distro 17 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: I haven't seen anything that is actually 'new' in Linux that I have not seen in older versions of (real) UNIX, or on Windows or Mac. So Linux is hardly at the forefront of anything. Same could be said for Windows and OSX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: insisting that there's no legitimate reason to even entertain a discussion about Affinity on Linux I have said that there is no point in Affinity providing software for an OS with such low market share. I am rather entertained watching people go on about Linux. I've seen it all before. 4 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: I've done that second part. And I'm telling you your entire premise is flawed. The statistics show otherwise. Linux is insignificant on the desktop. 5 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: You don't actually know what you're talking about on this one. Err, I do. 5 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: where people are discussing the merits and potential of Affinity on Linux There are merits for putting Affinity on Linux. There is almost no potential, given the market share. 6 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: Linux is a VERY popular operating system for crypto miner And? What does that have to do with Affinity on the desktop? I'll tell you: nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 12 minutes ago, Renzatic said: They did quite a bit to piss off Apple too, to the point that they now refuse to support any Nvidia hardware on their machines. Er, the news? Nvidia is buying Arm... If the deal goes through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, B-Interactive said: Same could be said for Windows and OSX. Except that practically all the 'features' you see on Linux desktops are copied from Windows and Mac, not the other way round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 5 minutes ago, ClairelyClaire said: A LOT of things YOU take for granted on Mac and PC started in Linux, many moons ago. Name two things which started in Linux... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Interactive Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 Just now, LondonSquirrel said: Except that practically all the 'features' you see on Linux desktops are copied from Windows and Mac, not the other way round. The entire industry has been copying the other guy since the beginning. Renzatic and Vex 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 Just now, B-Interactive said: The entire industry has been copying the other guy since the beginning. Now you change your argument. Linux copies from Mac and Windows, and before that UNIX. Not the other way round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renzatic Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Er, the news? Nvidia is buying Arm... If the deal goes through. That shouldn't effect any of the other high end ARM manufacturers like Apple, Qualcomm, et al. They're all grandfathered into ARM's highest tiered license agreement, practically giving them carte blanche to do what they want with the architecture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renzatic Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Name two things which started in Linux... Desktop compositing, virtual desktops, package managers/app stores... Vex 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vex Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 11 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: I have said that there is no point in Affinity providing software for an OS with such low market share. I am rather entertained watching people go on about Linux. I've seen it all before. And your claims aren't based on a good understanding of the industry. You're welcome to your opinions, but that doesn't make you objectively right, and you're continuing to insist you're authoritative on this. Again, unless you work for Affinity and have insider info, you're not the authority. Quote The statistics show otherwise. Linux is insignificant on the desktop. Market research regarding the platforms devs are targeting tell a different story. Quote Err, I do. No, you don't. You speak about software engineering as someone who doesn't have any professional (or even hobbyist) experience. "Despite its faults, people manage to write stuff for Linux" is a pretty bad take, and suggests you have no idea what it takes to write desktop software. Quote There are merits for putting Affinity on Linux. There is almost no potential, given the market share. According to you. But you aren't the expert. You aren't the decision-maker. You're just someone on a forum who is "entertained" by making himself the center of attention. Quote And? What does that have to do with Affinity on the desktop? I'll tell you: nothing. "Nvidia doesn't care about Linux" was your claim. Except Nvidia has the crypto market captive, and a lot of miners use Linux. You need drivers for your GPU to use it for mining. Ergo, you are wrong about Nvidia not caring about Linux. They do, as evidenced by their investment into support for the same. If they didn't care, and you were the authority on this, they wouldn't do that. Whoops. Pink Floyd was right. | Windows 10 · MacOS 10.14 · Arch Linux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vex Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 5 minutes ago, LondonSquirrel said: Er, the news? Nvidia is buying Arm... If the deal goes through. ARM is an architecture, not a specific brand, OEM, or product. lmao you're so full of it it's funny Pink Floyd was right. | Windows 10 · MacOS 10.14 · Arch Linux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, Renzatic said: That shouldn't effect any of the other high end ARM manufacturers like Apple, Qualcomm, et al. They're all grandfathered into ARM's highest tiered license agreement, practically giving them carte blanche to do what they want with the architecture. Future developments... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Interactive Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 Just now, LondonSquirrel said: Now you change your argument. Linux copies from Mac and Windows, and before that UNIX. Not the other way round. No change here, but perhaps misunderstood. The entire industry has been copying "the other guy", being anyone else (not Linux specifically) since the beginning. Vex 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonSquirrel Posted May 30, 2021 Share Posted May 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, Renzatic said: Desktop compositing, virtual desktops, package managers/app stores... Hahaha. You are having a joke, aren't you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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