TelFiRE Posted May 5, 2018 Share Posted May 5, 2018 I really, really don't understand that design decision. Having tools toggle on and off from their hotkey is like designing a steering wheel in a car to toggle between steering left and right, and you have no way to know which one it's going to do without trying it out. This violates some really fundamental and basic principles of user interface design. When I press a hotkey I need to know exactly what it's going to do. I really love this software overall, but this one flaw is enough to completely spoil it. I can't use this for production unless/until you fix it. CLC and c0ffee 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff MEB Posted May 7, 2018 Staff Share Posted May 7, 2018 Hey TelFiRE, Welcome to Affinity Forums They don't toggle on/off. When you press a shortcut you go to the corresponding tool. If you press the same shortcut again Affinity will return to the previous used tool. There's a exception here: if the shortcut you pressed matches a tool that belongs to a tool group, pressing that shortcut again will cycle through the tools of that group instead of going to the previous used tool. You can however customise all tool's shortcuts to suit your needs in Affinity Designer/Photo Preferences, Keyboard Shortcuts section (set the first dropdown to Photo and the second to Tools) setting them to different keys to prevent this second behaviour (group Tools) from interfering. Quote A Guide to Learning Affinity Software | Affinity Quick Reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pšenda Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 On 5. 5. 2018 at 10:40 PM, TelFiRE said: like designing a steering wheel in a car Why do you turn the steering wheel again to the left, when you're already going to the left? Quote Affinity Store (MSI/EXE): Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 2.4.0.2301 Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Intel NUC5PGYH, Pentium N3700 2.40 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics, EIZO EV2456 1920 x 1200, Windows 10 Pro, Version 21H1, Build 19043.2130. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 15 minutes ago, Pšenda said: Why do you turn the steering wheel again to the left, when you're already going to the left? To go more sharply to the left, perhaps? What you certainly don’t expect is that having previously turned it to the right, turning it to the left a second time makes the car turn right instead of left. I’m used to the behaviour in the Affinity apps, so it doesn’t bother me personally, but if the tool toggling feature were absent I don’t think many users would miss it! velarde and c0ffee 2 Quote Alfred Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for Windows • Windows 10 Home/Pro Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for iPad • iPadOS 17.4.1 (iPad 7th gen) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metajake Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 On 5/7/2018 at 3:40 AM, MEB said: They don't toggle on/off. Regardless of individual perception of this "feature", it remains confusing, jarring and frustrating for many page layout software users. My analogy (which I've explained before https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/56697-type-tool-to-move-tool-hotkey/&do=findComment&comment=289576 ) ... goes something like: If I'm working at my desk, and I reach for my pencil (use hotkey), should I have to look closely to make sure that my pencil is in my hand, and not my pen or scissors? No. In my mind, hotkeys primary purpose is speed. You reduce the speed by requiring me to keep track of which tool is chosen by a single hotkey. Klababa, Asemblance, CLC and 1 other 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pšenda Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 1 hour ago, metajake said: which tool is chosen by a single hotkey. As MEB wrote, it is not a problem to define a different shortcut for each tool. 9 hours ago, Alfred said: What you certainly don’t expect is that having previously turned it to the right, turning it to the left a second time makes the car turn right instead of left. On car no, turning is limited. But on bicycle? :-) Quote Affinity Store (MSI/EXE): Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 2.4.0.2301 Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Intel NUC5PGYH, Pentium N3700 2.40 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics, EIZO EV2456 1920 x 1200, Windows 10 Pro, Version 21H1, Build 19043.2130. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfred Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 32 minutes ago, Pšenda said: 10 hours ago, Alfred said: What you certainly don’t expect is that having previously turned it to the right, turning it to the left a second time makes the car turn right instead of left. On car no, turning is limited. But on bicycle? :-) Please watch this YouTube video: The Backwards Brain Bicycle garrettm30 1 Quote Alfred Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for Windows • Windows 10 Home/Pro Affinity Designer/Photo/Publisher 2 for iPad • iPadOS 17.4.1 (iPad 7th gen) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metajake Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 On 5/7/2018 at 3:40 AM, MEB said: You can however customise all tool's shortcuts to suit your needs in Affinity Designer/Photo Preferences. 2 hours ago, Pšenda said: As MEB wrote, it is not a problem to define a different shortcut for each tool. From what I see this does not prevent toggling (between the Move Tool and the Text Tool). When I "customize" the Move Tool hotkey to "v" and the "Frame Text Tool" to "t", using either hotkey will still toggle between the Move tool or the Frame Text tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pšenda Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 28 minutes ago, metajake said: From what I see this does not prevent toggling (between the Move Tool and the Text Tool). When I "customize" the Move Tool hotkey to "v" and the "Frame Text Tool" to "t", using either hotkey will still toggle between the Move tool or the Frame Text tool. Problem has two parts: - "toggling" back to origin tools, - and "switching" between more tools, about you write ("which tool is chosen by a single hotkey"). Switching is solvable by setting different shortcut, and setting options for toggling is discussed long time ago. For example: https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/39428-add-option-to-disable-toggling-between-last-tool-used-with-shortcut-of-other/ https://forum.affinity.serif.com/index.php?/topic/52437-just-a-simple-option/ Quote Affinity Store (MSI/EXE): Affinity Suite (ADe, APh, APu) 2.4.0.2301 Dell OptiPlex 7060, i5-8500 3.00 GHz, 16 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630, Dell P2417H 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Dell Latitude E5570, i5-6440HQ 2.60 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics 530, 1920 x 1080, Windows 11 Pro, Version 23H2, Build 22631.3155. Intel NUC5PGYH, Pentium N3700 2.40 GHz, 8 GB, Intel HD Graphics, EIZO EV2456 1920 x 1200, Windows 10 Pro, Version 21H1, Build 19043.2130. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metajake Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 7 hours ago, Pšenda said: Switching is solvable In the links that you posted, I do not see a way to solve the problem of: Disable "Return to previous tool". Am I missing the solution for that one problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff MEB Posted May 9, 2018 Staff Share Posted May 9, 2018 Hi metajake, There's no way to turn off the return (toggling) to previous tool behaviour. Only the "switching between tools of the same tool group" behaviour can be disabled giving each tool its own shortcut. Klababa 1 Quote A Guide to Learning Affinity Software | Affinity Quick Reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metajake Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 5 hours ago, MEB said: There's no way to turn off the return (toggling) to previous tool behaviour. Thanks for chiming in, MEB. In which case, I will stand behind my feedback for adding an option to disable "Return to Previous Tool Toggle". I'm embarrassed that I am not able to properly utilize the "Return to Previous Tool" toggle function. But I've been using Affinity for many months now, almost daily. And I still get occasionally tripped up by an unexpected tool, after using a hotkey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunny Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 On 5/9/2018 at 4:39 PM, metajake said: In which case, I will stand behind my feedback for adding an option to disable "Return to Previous Tool Toggle". I've been using Affinity Photo for a few weeks and this is definitely the most annoying thing I had encountered. When I'm painting I switch tools using hotkeys a lot and I don't look at the tools panel at all so I often end up using other tool then I wanted. I had already removed all hotkey groups but this option is sorely missed. I think that adding such option should not be that complicated...? =) Klababa and CLC 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThriveAndy Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 On 5/9/2018 at 10:39 AM, metajake said: Thanks for chiming in, MEB. In which case, I will stand behind my feedback for adding an option to disable "Return to Previous Tool Toggle". I'm embarrassed that I am not able to properly utilize the "Return to Previous Tool" toggle function. But I've been using Affinity for many months now, almost daily. And I still get occasionally tripped up by an unexpected tool, after using a hotkey. I 100% agree with @metajake. The biggest thing that trips me up in Affinity Designer is this "return to previous tool" toggle function. When I hit "V" I want the default move/arrow tool. When I hit "B" I want the brush tool. I may hit it multiple times to ENSURE I am on that tool. But instead, that is the worst thing to do in Affinity Designer, because instead you just ensured that you have no clue what you just selected. Really disruptive to work flow. I would be strongly in favor of a preferences option to disable this functionality. Then I would immediately disable it and forever be happy. One Workaround that feels silly to do but actually helps... If you want the brush tool (B) - and have been using (B) and (V) recently, don't click (B) First Click (H) or (Z) or (M) - anything you for sure have not used recently. Now click (B) Now & only now, you are guaranteed to have the brush tool. No matter what. Klababa and CLC 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomM1 Posted March 25, 2019 Share Posted March 25, 2019 On 5/7/2018 at 1:40 AM, MEB said: Hey TelFiRE, Welcome to Affinity Forums They don't toggle on/off. When you press a shortcut you go to the corresponding tool. If you press the same shortcut again Affinity will return to the previous used tool. There's a exception here: if the shortcut you pressed matches a tool that belongs to a tool group, pressing that shortcut again will cycle through the tools of that group instead of going to the previous used tool. You can however customise all tool's shortcuts to suit your needs in Affinity Designer/Photo Preferences, Keyboard Shortcuts section (set the first dropdown to Photo and the second to Tools) setting them to different keys to prevent this second behaviour (group Tools) from interfering. So I have turned off shortcuts for the pixel tool and color replacement tool so that "b" will select the brush tool only. Am I to understand that there is no way to disable "press the same shortcut again Affinity will return to the previous used tool"? Quote website Mac mini (2018) 3.2 GHz Intel Core i7 64 GB • Radeon Pro 580 8 GB • macOS Monterey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walt.farrell Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 50 minutes ago, TomM1 said: So I have turned off shortcuts for the pixel tool and color replacement tool so that "b" will select the brush tool only. Am I to understand that there is no way to disable "press the same shortcut again Affinity will return to the previous used tool"? In 1.7 you'll have an option that when selected will (a) require use of the shift key along with the tool's shortcut key to cycle among the different tools in a group and (b) disable the behavior of returning to the previous tool if you press the shortcut again. Quote -- Walt Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases PC: Desktop: Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Laptop: Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU. iPad: iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard Mac: 2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomM1 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 15 minutes ago, walt.farrell said: In 1.7 you'll have an option that when selected will (a) require use of the shift key along with the tool's shortcut key to cycle among the different tools in a group and (b) disable the behavior of returning to the previous tool if you press the shortcut again. Where do you see these options in 1.7? Sean Mandrake 1 Quote website Mac mini (2018) 3.2 GHz Intel Core i7 64 GB • Radeon Pro 580 8 GB • macOS Monterey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walt.farrell Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 17 minutes ago, TomM1 said: Where do you see these options in 1.7? garrettm30 and Sean Mandrake 1 1 Quote -- Walt Designer, Photo, and Publisher V1 and V2 at latest retail and beta releases PC: Desktop: Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 64GB memory, AMD Ryzen 9 5900 12-Core @ 3.00 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Laptop: Windows 11 Pro, version 23H2, 32GB memory, Intel Core i7-10750H @ 2.60GHz, Intel UHD Graphics Comet Lake GT2 and NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU. iPad: iPad Pro M1, 12.9": iPadOS 17.4.1, Apple Pencil 2, Magic Keyboard Mac: 2023 M2 MacBook Air 15", 16GB memory, macOS Sonoma 14.4.1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomM1 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 A bit different here but thanks. Sean Mandrake and walt.farrell 2 Quote website Mac mini (2018) 3.2 GHz Intel Core i7 64 GB • Radeon Pro 580 8 GB • macOS Monterey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
floflo Posted September 17, 2021 Share Posted September 17, 2021 I really dislike the "toggle with shift" behaviour, too. Please add an option to use the industry standard tool toggle behaviour. It also is buggy for me: CleanShot 2021-09-17 at 22.02.05.mp4 CLC 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
floflo Posted September 30, 2021 Share Posted September 30, 2021 Any answer about this? Toggeling tools is broken for me! On 9/17/2021 at 10:06 PM, floflo said: I really dislike the "toggle with shift" behaviour, too. Please add an option to use the industry standard tool toggle behaviour. It also is buggy for me: CleanShot 2021-09-17 at 22.02.05.mp4 3.78 MB · 0 downloads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff MEB Posted September 30, 2021 Staff Share Posted September 30, 2021 Hi @floflo, I've reproduced the issue here and I'm logging it. Thanks for your report. Quote A Guide to Learning Affinity Software | Affinity Quick Reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
floflo Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 Thanks, please fix it soon… it is driving me mad 🤪 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
floflo Posted October 26, 2021 Share Posted October 26, 2021 On 9/30/2021 at 2:51 PM, MEB said: Hi @floflo, I've reproduced the issue here and I'm logging it. Thanks for your report. Still not fixed for me in 1.10.3. This is slowing me down a lot, I am seriously considering switching to other apps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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