Affinity Publisher - Sneak Preview

[Wosven]

I'm sure that big companies — some still using old CS applications since CC licences for everyone is too much a cost — would be happy to upgrade tu APub.

They'll have to keep somme CC licences to check on illustrations and to keep on using their archived files, but if APub is good enougth it'll be a good choice.

If APub include regular expressions and easy scripting (as in ID with multiplatforms Javascript), it won't be a problem.

 

Another question is : will Affinity apps be teached in schools and when people will send Affinity files for better integration/modifications as they send .ai or .psd files ?

[Sam Neil]

I am surprised that the team have not provided any more details/videos and left everyone guessing, perhaps this is a marketing tactic but it does not help having one video teaser and 20 pages of a thread containing people guessing the features and the boring argument about Adobe being the king!!!!

 

More info/details (even screenshots) would be useful imho.

[SrPx]

14 minutes ago, Wosven said:

Another question is : will Affinity apps be teached in schools and when people will send Affinity files for better integration/modifications as they send .ai or .psd files ?

 

well, one step at a time...IMO is the moment of polishing AD and AP, and seems they are working in a very initial Apub, I understood the latter is more than anything a proof of concept, not a full product just yet. Keeping your expectations not so high might be healthy. 

 

In general I think the thing, globally, the suite, might mean a lot more than we are thinking now that it will...  (if allowing pros to do even just a 80% of what they can do with Adobe)

[SrPx]

5 minutes ago, Sam Neil said:

I am surprised that the team have not provided any more details/videos and left everyone guessing, perhaps this is a marketing tactic but it does not help having one video teaser and 20 pages of a thread containing people guessing the features and the boring argument about Adobe being the king!!!!

 

More info/details (even screenshots) would be useful imho.

 

in the past spreading more info than needed brought 'em problems of big magnitude. If ppl would had complained less in the previous times, maybe. 

[Sam Neil]

3 minutes ago, SrPx said:

 

in the past spreading more info than needed brought 'em problems of big magnitude. If ppl would had complained less in the previous times, maybe. 

 

This is not "Spreading" more info. A video that the software exists is not exactly spreading info. We all knew it existed. All I am saying a little NEW info would be nice.

[Alfred]

1 minute ago, Sam Neil said:

 

This is not "Spreading" more info. A video that the software exists is not exactly spreading info. We all knew it existed. All I am saying a little NEW info would be nice.

 

I agree. I think it was the wildly optimistic release dates, rather than the amount of information, that proved to be problematic when Publisher was originally announced.

[nitro912gr]

Well maybe everything is WIP at the moment with nothing finalized as to what will make it to the release version, so they don't want to say something that eventually will have to keep back because it was not ready.

As for teaching affinity in schools, this seems hard to happen. Schools are so slow to adapt, by the time they will find out about affinity we will all be dead from old age.

The thing is the right "school" doesn't teach you programs, the right school teach you design so you can apply it as you see fit with the tools you choose. They will teach you a program or two, but just so you can find a job once you are out there in the wild. From there on is up to you to learn the right tools for what you want to do and not just blindly follow some stupid mantras like "designers use macs and adobe only". Designers use charcoal and paper if they see they are more suited for what they want to design.

After all most of what I learned in college was for adobe CS3, most of the things from there does no longer apply and the books I have are only good for fire-starters in my bbq now.
Not to mention the obsolete programs like adobe flash and director.

Tools evolve, change, die, are remade from scratch. We simple can't be attached to them. I started playing with adobe programs that my uncle had in his mac when I was 15 years old back in 1996 , then I started playing with corel apps in my own pc that I was able to find in pirated cds, then I was testing every other possible program from macromedia, metacreations and all the other companies back then, in college I returned to adobe, I started using open source a few years back, now I turn to affinity, who knows tomorrow what I will find more suited to use?

Teaching specific programs is of no use to anyone, better learn design and go to a seminar or two to learn about the programs you want. Or learn them yourself, the internet is a huge resource if you use it wisely. I wonder what I could learn back then I was younger and had all this free time that I was spending trying to get as much info as possible from limited resources like printed publications, if I had access to the info I have today (or at least I wish I had the time now )

[Michail]

1 hour ago, Alfred said:

 

Serif has a dozen developers; Adobe has hundreds.

Too many cooks spoil the porridge. (German proverb)

[iMatt]

17 hours ago, nwhit said:

 

A key difference is/was that Adobe had already bought what was a very mature (at the time) PageMaker from Aldus (as well as FreeHand). During the transition, many of us kept on using PageMaker until InDesign caught up. But we always had a translator to go back and open PageMaker docs in InDesign for quite some time. Our work was not hugely interrupted nor did we face an issue where what we were doing and creating in PageMaker would be "lost" later when moving to the newer InDesign. Many of us weren't thrilled at the time about having to eventually move to ID, but at least Adobe did a somewhat reasonable job of helping the transition of PM files to ID.

 

Thus we have to hope that Affinity can/will be able to offer a similar path. We will have to eventually be able to bring our legacy files into their Publisher app, and sooner would obviously be better for a more rapid adoption of the new app. Just like many apps can open, read and save-as Word documents in word processing, ID files are critical to many pro designers and shops.

Yep, many (including myself) did keep using PM. I used it up to version 7.0x. However, Aldus had already lost this war with Quark. Most professional design studios, publishers and ad agencies had moved on to QXP long before ID came onto the scene. And were continuing to do so even when ID 1.x hit the scene. The real transition started when ID 2.0 came along esp for Mac users as it was OSX ready. QPX users had to wait till version 6.0 for this 'feature'. And with version 3.0 of ID, it was a no-brainer as it was part of the then new Creative Suite version 1.0. For the cost of Photoshop and Illustrator, you effectively got ID bundled for free at the same price os QXP, give or take a little. 

As far as Affinity Publisher is concerned, I think the main thing in the first version is first to get it ready. And then make sure it covers all the basics. I would not expect it to be as 'fully featured' as QXP or ID at this point. And it may never be if we were to bullet point EVERY feature. However, I also expect it'll do certain things quicker and better. Besides, perhaps we need to remember the 80/20 rule where only 20% of the features of many increasingly complex programs such as Word, Photoshop, Illustrator etc. are used by 80% of their customers.

What I would like to see perhaps is the development of plug-ins for Affinity. I guess enough users will have to employ Affinity progs in order for a plug-in developer to be interested. And even then, they may not be interested as Adobe casts such a loooong shadow.

P.S. Can Affinity Designer and Photo make use of Photoshop plug-ins?

[Michail]

I have taken the trouble to list the features that I think should be available in the first version of APub. It is not a matter of implementing as many functions as possible, but of creating a solid and stable layout program. I think most of these things Serif has already planned.

01. rulers and auxiliary lines
02. sample pages
03. page pagination and section numbering
04. basic graphic shapes (line, rectangle, ellipse, polygon)
05. the ability to edit objects and paths
06. boolean operators
07. concatenated text frames
08. paragraph and character formats (but better than in AD)
09. possibility to convert text to paths
10. Placing text in arbitrary objects (shape typeset)
11. place text on paths (text path)
12. place text around paths (contour guidance)
13. baseline grid
14. consideration of sentence errors (hurian children, cobbler's boys ...)
15. spell checking and hyphenation
16. Optical Margin alignment (Text)
17. tabs
18. search and replace
19. colours and colour gradients
20. effects (like drop shadows, 3D, etc. - like in AP and AD)
21. interpret transparent areas in images (TIFF)
22. automatic tables of contents and indexes
23. levels
24. tables
25. (IDML import)
26. PDF export

[wonderings]

4 hours ago, Michail said:

I have taken the trouble to list the features that I think should be available in the first version of APub. It is not a matter of implementing as many functions as possible, but of creating a solid and stable layout program. I think most of these things Serif has already planned.

01. rulers and auxiliary lines
02. sample pages
03. page pagination and section numbering
04. basic graphic shapes (line, rectangle, ellipse, polygon)
05. the ability to edit objects and paths
06. boolean operators
07. concatenated text frames
08. paragraph and character formats (but better than in AD)
09. possibility to convert text to paths
10. Placing text in arbitrary objects (shape typeset)
11. place text on paths (text path)
12. place text around paths (contour guidance)
13. baseline grid
14. consideration of sentence errors (hurian children, cobbler's boys ...)
15. spell checking and hyphenation
16. Optical Margin alignment (Text)
17. tabs
18. search and replace
19. colours and colour gradients
20. effects (like drop shadows, 3D, etc. - like in AP and AD)
21. interpret transparent areas in images (TIFF)
22. automatic tables of contents and indexes
23. levels
24. tables
25. (IDML import)
26. PDF export

Would add to that the ability to save PDF's with spot colours and pantone colours. There was an issue with that early on with Designer. I think it has been rectified with later updates, I rarely use it honestly as I am comfortable with Adobe and prefer knowing exactly how my jobs will turn out rather then jumping in to something new. I will buy Publisher... hate the name.... as soon as it is released as it would be nice to have competition for Adobe Indesign, but think this will be a MASSIVE uphill battle fighting against an app that has been updated and improved throughout the years. 

[Laserjunge]

A bit worrying to see serif's plans for another software although the community is still waiting for necessary features of AD. I remember very well that two years ago, it was said that the users shall remain patient with their requests due to the intense work on AP. Now, two years and only few AD features later, serif has another big project, where they have to focus on, and again no time to include the features into AD, which are on the road map since version 1.0. That's bad news. 

[MartinWales]

I assume AP will be able to use templates and files created by PagePlus?

[MEB]

Hi MartinWales,

Welcome to Affinity Forums

No, there's no plans to support the PagePlus format. The first version/release will not cover all PagePlus functionality, since we are building the whole Affinity line from scratch so there's no parity between (the features of) the two programs which means some features would be lost during the translation/import of the files. We advise you to continue using PagePlus for your current projects and move to Publisher for new ones or export your projects as PDF files and import them in Affinity Publisher.

 

[Tia Lapis]

Then the first version of APublisher will be no option for you.

 

i don't know how often Affinity have to say it: There will be NO PagePlus import.

[Michail]

28 minutes ago, Tia Lapis said:

i don't know how often Affinity have to say it: There will be NO PagePlus import.

Serif! Affinity can't talk. Not yet

[MartinWales]

I can't use PagePlus anymore as I've upgraded to Mac. I was hoping AP would enable me to pick up where I'd left off. If I export all my templates to PDF, will AP be able to edit them without problems, or should I just replicate the templates in AP?

[VIPStephan]

3 hours ago, Laserjunge said:

A bit worrying to see serif's plans for another software although the community is still waiting for necessary features of AD. I remember very well that two years ago, it was said that the users shall remain patient with their requests due to the intense work on AP. Now, two years and only few AD features later, serif has another big project, where they have to focus on, and again no time to include the features into AD, which are on the road map since version 1.0. That's bad news. 

That only shows that you don’t see the big picture. AP, AD, and APub are going to be a trinity where each program complements one another, and (it has been mentioned before) features of one program are also going to be implemented in the other two. I’m just speculating here but the time it takes now for new features in AP and AD is probably going to be made up twice once APub is out. Also, I seem to remember having read, that a lot of code for AD 1.7 is already in the current version, but it’s not active yet, in preparation for the release of APub.

But what’s the point in bad-mouthing Serif without knowing what they’re up to?

[Alfred]

12 hours ago, Michail said:

Too many cooks spoil the porridge. (German proverb)

 

The usual English version is “Too many cooks spoil the broth.”

 

Like most (if not all) proverbs, there’s another one which says the opposite: “Many hands make light work.”

[Bri-Toon]

2 hours ago, MartinWales said:

I can't use PagePlus anymore as I've upgraded to Mac. I was hoping AP would enable me to pick up where I'd left off. If I export all my templates to PDF, will AP be able to edit them without problems, or should I just replicate the templates in AP?

 

The compatibility won't be 100% of course because of features that will not yet be available to support the properties. Exporting works differently for each program too. I have files I made in both Illustrator and Microsoft Word that support pages and then saved as PDF. When bringing them into Designer, I get the pages as artboards and the text is still editable. However, the ones which were originally Illustrator files have lines of text in a paragraph as individual text layers, but the ones that were originally Word files have each paragraph as a single text layer (as I want it to be). So it's difficult to answer. It depends on how the program exports the properties. One similar problem I did catch with both, however, is difference of kerning (character spacing).

 

Can you test your exported PDF in Designer and see how that works?

[Wosven]

13 hours ago, SrPx said:

Keeping your expectations not so high might be healthy.

For me, that's not beginning from scratch, since the previous app PP gave a lot of trial and errors, to do/not to do, etc. for planning and thinking about what should be APub. Looking at other programs can help too. I don't think at APub as a beginner tool, or a new app to compare with other ones that do half the job too.
AP and AD are succesfull enought to proove that they are good programs and there's a public for them: for companies and people working on their own.

Such success (and expectations, as in this thread) should improve what was the first project for APub. 

I know I won't be able to do what I did on Xpress or what I do now with ID, since a lot of features can't be expected with a version 1, but I can hope for more

   

12 hours ago, nitro912gr said:

As for teaching affinity in schools, this seems hard to happen. Schools are so slow to adapt, by the time they will find out about affinity we will all be dead from old age.

[…] some stupid mantras like "designers use macs and adobe only".

I said "teaching", but "showing" is more what I was thinking. I wasn't teached Xpress at school, or other apps, I learned with books and doing my own work…But if we were curious and adventurous and able to test programs and OS because it was possible, I'm not sure people do this a lot today.

Here in France, they forget to teach about using tools but tend to teach to use specific applications from specific big companies. When I tried Affinity' apps, instead of curiosity, questions and such I was expecting from people doing the same job, I was told : "If 'they' make us change app at work, I'll quit".

(About the mantra: alas! it isn't dead yet… I hear it from lot of young — and not so young — people a lot)

Since some training centre/seminars (?) — "centre de formation" —  are planning to add Affinity's program in their sessions, I thougth it was logical that i.e. schools used those apps too: we expect people knowing how to use Adobe's products to easily use Affinity's products, why not the other way around ?

 

And like you nitro912gr, long ago we swithed between Windows and Linux, playing game on the 1st and testing, coding or using Gimp on the second… we used Mac too, all is only tools to play with

 

[MartinWales]

11 hours ago, Bri-Toon said:

 

Can you test your exported PDF in Designer and see how that works?

I don't have Designer, so no.

[nitro912gr]

17 hours ago, Laserjunge said:

A bit worrying to see serif's plans for another software although the community is still waiting for necessary features of AD. I remember very well that two years ago, it was said that the users shall remain patient with their requests due to the intense work on AP. Now, two years and only few AD features later, serif has another big project, where they have to focus on, and again no time to include the features into AD, which are on the road map since version 1.0. That's bad news. 

what do you mean? AD is getting updates and improvements, what is that you are still consider necessary and is not available? Personally I feel complete with the add of searchable font menu.

Sure I still want a couple of things added but with the current state of AD anything more will be a matter of polishing not necessity.

Also as mentioned above is about the holy trinity now, better to have APub out first and then refocus on improving everything, I was still able to use AD even without every tool I wanted till they add them, but I'm not able to use APub even in a premature form if they don't release it first.

 

11 hours ago, Wosven said:

I said "teaching", but "showing" is more what I was thinking. I wasn't teached Xpress at school, or other apps, I learned with books and doing my own work…But if we were curious and adventurous and able to test programs and OS because it was possible, I'm not sure people do this a lot today.

Here in France, they forget to teach about using tools but tend to teach to use specific applications from specific big companies. When I tried Affinity' apps, instead of curiosity, questions and such I was expecting from people doing the same job, I was told : "If 'they' make us change app at work, I'll quit".

(About the mantra: alas! it isn't dead yet… I hear it from lot of young — and not so young — people a lot)

Since some training centre/seminars (?) — "centre de formation" —  are planning to add Affinity's program in their sessions, I thougth it was logical that i.e. schools used those apps too: we expect people knowing how to use Adobe's products to easily use Affinity's products, why not the other way around ?

 

And like you nitro912gr, long ago we swithed between Windows and Linux, playing game on the 1st and testing, coding or using Gimp on the second… we used Mac too, all is only tools to play with

It is the same everywhere I guess, if I have to make a list I could say 8 out of 10 colleges or universities that say they are teaching graphic design, they actually just teach specific programs. It used to be worst, at least now they have added some classes for art history, free hand drawing, color theory etc, but they are still mostly machines for mass production of people who know the programs.

[PeanutsA]

12 hours ago, Alfred said:

Like most (if not all) proverbs, there’s another one which says the opposite: “Many hands make light work.”

There is also the German version "Many Hans make light arbeit" which is the slogan of the electrician's union.

[Bri-Toon]

21 hours ago, haakoo said:

Pitching in with a dutch saying;

"The best navigators are on shore"

So let the captain remain its course and you'll get to port.

 

_Hans

 

That is a really good way to put it, and I hope it's understood that my post wasn't meant as a complaint but to help out MartinWales with some of my experience. I am very confident in Affinity's result.