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GFS

Masking drives me nuts

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This is so annoying.  It wastes so much time.

 

When making a mask and using the Refine tool, the refined mask changes from the previewed mask, after the dialog is 'okayed/closed'.

 

Either there is a bug in the Mask Preview ... or ... there is a bug in the mask itself.  I think it's the mask and that the problem is in the mathematical calculation.  I suspect some tiny error of percentage, because the resultant mask layer seems to be slightly shifted to the left and slightly too large overall.  The consequence is time spent cleaning the mask up by hand.  Very slow process and AFPhoto doesn't have good tools for doing the job either.

 

Here's what happens :

 

AFP-MaskingBug.mp4


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Hi MEB.

 

The file is now uploaded.

 

NB.  This isn't new behaviour.  It's just that now that I'm beginning to understand AFP better, I'm narrowing it down.

 

( FWIW, this is visually very similar to a bug I found years ago in an old software, which turned out to be what I described above, namely a very small error in the maths.  I only realised it was in fact a bug as opposed to just an 'inconvenience' when I used an earlier version of the same software and discovered, much to my surprise, that its mask were perfect. )


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Just to confirm MEB ... 

 

This has been going on as long as I've been using AFP, but now I'm trying to understand exactly what is happening and looking at a new image/mask just now.

 

The mask is out both -x and -y.  Setting a Border of 1% and a Ramp of -30% in the Refine dialog does not help.  The resultant mask is still 'sticking out' to the left and top'.


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Thanks MEB.

 

___________________________

 

(I don't want to moan ... but it seems that Serif is maybe going too fast on some things and getting distracted on others and so loosing focus on quality control.

 

There are tons of little bugs that really need to be fixed before moving on.  A wander through the forum shows many things that have been 'logged' for up to 2 years and still not fixed.  The early days of things getting fixed for the next beta, maybe a few days later, seem to be long gone.  Something like this masking bug is crazy for anyone doing any sort of serious compositing work and frankly, it's got me wondering if I'm making the right decision going with Affinity tools.  This is basic stuff that you have to get right if you want pros to jump on board.  I mean ... masking hair?  How do you do that correctly with this bug?  I'm currently 'fudging' it by shifting and constraining the mask ... but it is guess work and hard to get right).


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Hi GFS,
Thanks for your patience. Do the following: instead of selecting a mask as the output for the Refine process, select New layer with mask. You should get a result similar to what you see in the preview, but there's still issues with the mask output only. I'm passing this to the dev team.

 

 

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Hi MEB,

 

thanks for checking it out and for the workaround.

 

However ...

 

1/ I don't see how it can be 'by design' unless it's 'by bad design'.  Why would you show a Preview that doesn't match the output?

2/ The mask is still OUT by a percentage -x and -y.  So this is still a bug.

 

However Too ...  ;)

 

Using the 'New Layer with Mask' option is ok (although may involve moving other layers around to get back to where you were) ... BUT ... it has its own bug (big sigh)

 

I've seen this one mentioned elsewhere, which is what I mean by all these long standing bugs, not getting fixed.  This is pretty bad too.  I think the whole Refine Mask tool needs to be re-examined and fixed.  It's a really basic tool that needs to work correctly.

 

The first image is the edge as it should be (unmasked)

The second image is after using 'New Layer with Mask'

 

This isn't around the entire mask, only in areas.  Still, it makes the tool useless/unusable.

 

AFP-MaskBUG-Border-1.png

 

 

AFP-MaskBUG-Border-2.png


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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So for the time being I'm back to using 'output to Mask' with a reduced Border (1%) and Ramp to ~ -20%.

 

I still have to shift the mask 1 pixel to the right.  It's not ideal, but it's the best AFP can offer.

 

This is on a 36mp file.  


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Hey MEB.

 

I live near Paris.  Lunch is important.  I was in Lisbon last summer.  What a fab town ... and I think lunch is important there too (so is dinner).  :)

 

Regarding passing it on to the Dev Team.

 

Don't pass it ... throw it!!!

 

:D


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Also ...

 

'New Layer with Mask' messes up the original pixel image, which is not ideal ... as I've just discovered.


Grumpy, but faithful (watch out all you cats)

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Same issue still exists as well.  I reported this last year (

) and it looks like the issue is worse.

Here's a screengrab working with both 8bit and 16bit TIF files in Adobe RGB.  After refining the mask, I set the output to New Layer with Mask. Hoping this gets fixed in the next release as this is a dealbreaker for composite photography.

refine-mask-issue.jpg

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