Jump to content
AK_CCM

Will Affinity Publisher open PagePlus X9 files?

Recommended Posts

Hello,

 

I've read this on your website:

 

 

We are working on a new Desktop Publishing application, Affinity Publisher, as part of our next generation Affinity Suite.

 

 

Will Affinity Publisher open PagePlus X9 *.ppp files?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Best regards from Germany

 

Andreas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Andreas,

Welcome to Affinity Forums :)

No, Affinity Publisher will not open/support .PPP files, sorry. Affinity uses a totally new/different codebase. You can either use the PDF import/export functionality to exchange data between the two apps (with some loss) or continue using PagePlus to work with legacy .PPP files.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please stop using the "Affinity uses a totally new/different codebase" reason.

 

InDesign and QuarkXPress have different code bases and, more to the point, different file formats and capabilities. Yet there are a few, very good converters available.

 

It is possible to do so with depreciation of unsupported properties. The same applies to DP to AD.

 

I appreciate Serif has no desire to do so, it's their choice.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I didn't say it wasn't possible. The different codebase is the reason why doesn't worth spend time developing an importer: it makes the process more complicated,  some features will not have parity with the new Publisher format and would be lost anyway and also because .ppp is now a legacy format which will not be developed anymore, contrary to InDesign or QuarkXPress formats. It would be way better to spend that time providing importers for InDesign and other current formats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One main difference is that at least Serif knows the file format of PP intimately unlike it does ID and QXP. As well, Serif knows the file format of WritePlus files, which would be a second-best option.

 

And while PP is a deprecated application not doing so leaves a large customer base with 4th/5th "best" options.

 

But, Serif isn't going to do so. My only objection was to the trite reason of different code bases...something that even more so applies to writing an import routine for unknown document formats like ID or QXP.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi MEB,

thanks for your fast response.

Do you know anything about the price range of the Affinity Publisher?

Is the program payable for private users?

Best regards

Andreas

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One main difference is that at least Serif knows the file format of PP intimately unlike it does ID and QXP. As well, Serif knows the file format of WritePlus files, which would be a second-best option.

 

It would be good if APh could be made to import WritePlus files saved to their native *.stt format, but I don't see this happening.

 

My only objection was to the trite reason of different code bases...something that even more so applies to writing an import routine for unknown document formats like ID or QXP.

 

All the more so since ID and QXP are still being developed, so (unlike PP) these are moving targets.

 


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer 1.7.0.367 • Affinity Photo 1.7.0.367 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.0.135 • Affinity Designer for iPad 1.7.0.9 • iOS 12.3.1 (iPad Air 2)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi MEB,

 

thanks for your fast response.

 

Do you know anything about the price range of the Affinity Publisher?

Is the program payable for private users?

 

Best regards

 

Andreas

 

I believe it shouldn't be much different than the current products (if not the same) but I can't assure you this at this point. It will still take some time until its ready for release.

Not sure what do you mean with "payable for private users"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...

All the more so since ID and QXP are still being developed, so (unlike PP) these are moving targets.

 

QXP's file format changes once in a blue moon, though has done so twice in 5 versions in order to handle the conversion of PDF and other vector elements into its internal native format, the adaptive resolution capabilities and a couple other things. As for any bitmaps contained in a PDF, once can also opt to save those out and link them.

 

Historically, InDesign's file format changed with every major version change. Adobe did this even though no new capabilities may have been added. But it did keep people updating all the time if they desired to properly collaborate. With CC that has not changed to the best of my understanding. IDML format also should be made to be imported. It has a better chance of long-term survivial as an import format, but it is not a panacea for ID file import. It's pretty good and would provide an intermediary if Serif cannot keep up with the ID native file format changes.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure what do you mean with "payable for private users"?

 

Certainly (he means) not more than EUR 200.

 

PagePlus is still sold … and advertised by Serif … so it is possible that there will be an importer or converter in some years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IDML format also should be made to be imported.

 

+1


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer 1.7.0.367 • Affinity Photo 1.7.0.367 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.0.135 • Affinity Designer for iPad 1.7.0.9 • iOS 12.3.1 (iPad Air 2)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PagePlus is still sold … and advertised by Serif … so it is possible that there will be an importer or converter in some years.

 

Possible, yes; likely, no. And more and more unlikely as the years roll by.


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer 1.7.0.367 • Affinity Photo 1.7.0.367 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.0.135 • Affinity Designer for iPad 1.7.0.9 • iOS 12.3.1 (iPad Air 2)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One main difference is that at least Serif knows the file format of PP intimately unlike it does ID and QXP. As well, Serif knows the file format of WritePlus files, which would be a second-best option.

Has it occurred to anyone else that it is because they know the file format (& code base) of the Plus apps so intimately, they know better than anyone else how good an Affinity importer actually would be vs. exporting to PDF in the Plus app?

 

Regarding an IDML importer, from section 5 of Adobe's own IDML File Format Specification pdf document:

IDML is intended for consumption by InDesign-family applications, including InDesign, InCopy, and InDesign Server. IDML is not intended as an interchange format for use with applications outside the InDesign family of products, and does not attempt to write or structure InDesign content in a manner that is compatible with other XML layout formats (such as Mars, XSL-FO, or SVG).

 

 

In general, importers are no better than interchange file formats when feature parity does not exist. If the underlying data structures of two apps are not compatible to begin with, there is no way to make them so without changing the code base of one or both of them. Importers alone cannot do this.


Affinity Photo 1.7.1, Affinity Designer 1.7.1, Affinity Publisher 1.7.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.1.143 & Affinity Designer 1.7.1.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

R C-R, you now know enough about the IDML format to *almost* be dangerous ;^)

 

There are plenty of IDML converters to other formats. It is a safer opton than .indd format. It is in Adobe's best interest to discourage it as a bridge to another application.

 

As regards in-company's conversion to another of its formats, Xara has always done so gracefully. Adobe's Photoshop also has done so in the past. If you have never pulled apart a PP file, it isn't rocket science as to how it all hangs together. A PP file is a Zip container for a collection of xml files and other asset files.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you have never pulled apart a PP file, it isn't rocket science as to how it all hangs together.

 

If you have ever pulled apart a PP file, it's relatively easy to see how it all hangs together. If you have never pulled one apart, it might be quite difficult. :P


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer 1.7.0.367 • Affinity Photo 1.7.0.367 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.0.135 • Affinity Designer for iPad 1.7.0.9 • iOS 12.3.1 (iPad Air 2)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll blame dashing off posts using my phone, Alfred.

 

(But we all know know that sometimes I have thought dyslexia.)


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Importing is not just about 'pulling apart' a file's format. That is only a small part of the process. It is mostly about what to do with the data after that is done. When there is no corresponding or equivalent data structure there isn't much that can be done other than ignore it & try to fit the raw data into an existing structure. When there is no good fit, there may be no viable alternative other than to  discard the data, particularly if it pertains to or is dependent on procedures that no feature of the importing app supports.

 

This is why the differences in code bases really do matter, & why interchange formats like PDF were invented in the first place.


Affinity Photo 1.7.1, Affinity Designer 1.7.1, Affinity Publisher 1.7.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.1.143 & Affinity Designer 1.7.1.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First, PDF is in not an interchange format. It is a fixed presentational representation. That some applications can open a pdf for editing is beside the point.

 

And yes, some items in one format may have to be deprecated when translated into another format. Isn't that what I wrote above?


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Argh. Hit the post button...

 

Look, if Serif builds an import filter for the mature InDesign, I can guarantee you they could with the PP format.

 

PagePlus, while having lived longer than ID is in many functions less capable than ID.

 

Just what so you think is going to happen to all those bits and pieces that will have zero correspondence in the infantile APub? But Serif is still likely to write the so-called converter anyway.

 

Mike


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll blame dashing off posts using my phone, Alfred.

 

(But we all know know that sometimes I have thought dyslexia.)

 

Nah, let's blame it on your phone, Mike!

 

Better yet, let's blame it on me for commenting. Please accept my apologies.


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer 1.7.0.367 • Affinity Photo 1.7.0.367 • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.7.0.135 • Affinity Designer for iPad 1.7.0.9 • iOS 12.3.1 (iPad Air 2)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First, PDF is in not an interchange format. It is a fixed presentational representation. That some applications can open a pdf for editing is beside the point.

??? The PDF file format provides a highly structured way to encode text, graphics, & other data objects independently of application software, hardware, or operating systems. It is defined by the ISO 32000-1 standard, which intentionally does not specify any specific methods of rendering PDF documents, nor does it limit its use to presentations or place any restrictions on how software may interpret or use the structured data contained in the files.

 

It is this standardized structure that makes it so portable & usable by so many different apps as an interchange file format.

 

Look, if Serif builds an import filter for the mature InDesign, I can guarantee you they could with the PP format.

 

1. Importers, at least useful ones, are not merely "filters."

2. What makes you so sure Serif will attempt to build an importer for InDesign documents, or if it does that would have any bearing on the feasibility of building a PP importer?

3. We currently know nothing about Publisher's capabilities, but it is a safe bet that the developers want to preserve cross-platform & native Affinity file format compatibility with Photo & Designer. Among other things, that means not relying on anything not supported by both Windows & Apple's OS's. It also means feature development must be at least partially tied to the capabilities of all three apps (& the DAM, whenever that finally is released), which in turn will have a direct bearing on import capabilities. I don't think any of us have any idea how they will accomplish this, so any "guarantees" are really nothing more than conjecture.


Affinity Photo 1.7.1, Affinity Designer 1.7.1, Affinity Publisher 1.7.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.1.143 & Affinity Designer 1.7.1.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

interchange file format.

 

 

Because it destroys some original structures it is or is not an interchange file format.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Look, R C-R, pdfs were never meant for editing. That's plain and simple. It took 10 version of PP to get its pdf import to be as good as it is and it still stumbles on, wait for it, InDesign pdfs.

 

At the same time, PP's export of pdfs grew better.

 

But there is no in-built facility to actually reconstruct the contents of a pdf to the state it was in the originating application. Pdf looses all structural ties.

 

Pdf import is a decent fallback to moving a design into an application capable of opening one for editing. If it is a simple pdf and one doesn't mind the extra work that will be required to truly reconstruct a working file. But it is not a good replacement for an import filter.

 

For some of us, none of this is theory, sitting behind a keyboard postulating about such things. We face these issues every day in real life.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But there is no in-built facility to actually reconstruct the contents of a pdf to the state it was in the originating application. Pdf looses all structural ties.

That is the point. It is a set of structures any app can use for any purpose. It does not matter what it was meant for when Adobe owned it. By the time it became an open ISO standard with a well defined structure, it had already become much more than just a fixed format for presentation.

 

This is not just theory. I have literally thousands of files containing data extracted from PDFs by various apps, which I use in different ways, many having nothing to do with presentation, printing, or display. Data is data. As long as its structure can be parsed, there are no limits on how it can be used. It is just information.


Affinity Photo 1.7.1, Affinity Designer 1.7.1, Affinity Publisher 1.7.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.6 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM
Affinity Photo 1.7.1.143 & Affinity Designer 1.7.1.1 for iPad; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 12.3.1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll repeat: PDF is not meant for editing. I know the architect of PDF at Adobe, I know some people on the GHENT Workgroup. These same people are on the ISO committee. They would heartily disagree that PDF is an interchange format in the sense of opening for editing for any reason.

 

And again I'll repeat: That a given application can open a PDF for editing means nothing. The PDF format was never intended, and is not currently intended, for editing purposes.

 

I'll leave you to your delusional thinking about what PDF is meant for, R C-R.


My computer is a nothing-special Toshiba laptop with unremarkable specs running Windows 10 64-bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×