Overlapped forms

[Glyphs]

I have created this design using two groups of moon layers. Each group contains two layered moons with a shadow effect. I duplicated the first group, inverted the two moons' placement in the top group, then applied a mask on it to obtain this overlapped forms design. But the shadows are wrong in the masked part, because the shadows' intensities of each layer are automatically added (the masked part now displays only one set of shadows instead of two). Is there a way to do this with effects completing each other instead of being added?

 

[JimmyJack]

Probably several ways to cook this dish.

A little hard to describe so I just attached a solution you can play with and see where it differs.

(I used a simple crop to isolate  parts of the crescents ....the shapes where amenable to that quick option. Hand made masks may be needed on more "complex" shapes.)

 

Cheers.

 

overlapping shapes with shadows.afdesign

[Glyphs]

Thanks! The shadows seem to work better. It would be simpler if we could just used some kind of "cropped layers", but it doesn't seem possible yet.

[JimmyJack]

Thanks! The shadows seem to work better. It would be simpler if we could just used some kind of "cropped layers", but it doesn't seem possible yet.

 

You can do that too!  :)

And yes, the crop needs to be applied to a Layer containing the shape. Cropping the shape itself will not crop the drop shadow. (be careful of abutting two shapes though (cropped or not). You run the risk of a thin line bleeding through where they meet. You can see it a tiny bit in my screen capture....)

 

overlapping shapes with shadows II.afdesign

[Glyphs]

You can do that too!  :)

And yes, the crop needs to be applied to a Layer containing the shape. Cropping the shape itself will not crop the drop shadow. (be careful of abutting two shapes though (cropped or not). You run the risk of a thin line bleeding through where they meet. You can see it a tiny bit in my screen capture....)

 

Screen Shot 2017-01-22 at 1.04.50 PM.png

 

Can I do that in the same document, or do I have to crop the document, then place it in a new document containing the same shapes?

[JimmyJack]

Can I do that in the same document, or do I have to crop the document, then place it in a new document containing the same shapes?

 

Are you in AP or AD? (in both sases though, to answer your question.... it can be done all in the same document)

BUT....In AP I'd just use a clipping shape......(since there aren't any layers, and cropping is a very different tool as in AD) 

 

Come to think of it.... That's probably easier in AD too  :D .

 

 

No cropping, no "layers"

[Glyphs]

Are you in AP or AD? (in both sases though, to answer your question.... it can be done all in the same document)

BUT....In AP I'd just use a clipping shape......(since there aren't any layers, and cropping is a very different tool as in AD) 

 

Come to think of it.... That's probably easier in AD too  :D .

 

Screen Shot 2017-01-22 at 1.37.30 PM.png

 

No cropping, no "layers"

 

I am using both, but I tend to use AD for vector shapes. When I first tested this kind of design, I only used two duplicates groups and a mask. It was the fastest way I could find to do this, but as a result, the shadows were less intense in the mask part than in the other part, since I erased a set of shapes with shadows. Is there a way to work as fast (or even faster) with a clipping shape without erasing shadows?

[JimmyJack]

Hmmm. Well it's hard for me to say what you would find a fast or easy way to work. 

Is it better to draw 4 rectangles as clipping objects or spend time crafting a custom shape in order to have only one? There would ultimately be more elements but could possibly take less time to complete...

Up to the individual I guess.

 

That being said, I've distilled this particular overlapping shape dynamic down to the fewest # of elements that I can muster (I think ;) ).

Two original shapes and one duplicate/clipped shape.

 

overlapping shapes with shadows III.afdesign

[Glyphs]

Yes, the clipped shape is visible on the canvas, but it does look pretty simple to do:) Actually I don't think the method I need exist yet. I believe the simplest way to do this would be to create the first group with the two forms, then duplicate it and switch the positions of the forms, then use some kind of "crop layer" tool to just crop the top group like you would the document. This way, everything would be editable very quickly. For now, there is a crop tool to crop the whole document, but not individual parts or layers (at least I think so. If it already exists, I must have missed it).

[JimmyJack]

This is why I asked if you're in AD or AP.

In AD you can crop individual objects. This is what I've been doing all along (...did you open any of the .afdesign files I posted? It's up to you to determine how you want to group items. Your "ideal" method mentioned above is absolutely doable, except for the fact that (imho) you need a crop on both groups to avoid the double up on shadows.... which is the whole problem in the first place.)

 

In AP, yes, cropping is is global. But that really doesn't matter. Clipping/masking does the exact same thing..... but much much better. It's infinitely more flexible and powerful.

 

In this particular case cropping works (in AD) because the shape situation is very simple. Drawing a rectangle as a clip does the same thing (and is just as fast). But.... when using the crop tool you're limited by the rectangular format. With masking you can do just about anything.

[Glyphs]

This is why I asked if you're in AD or AP.

In AD you can crop individual objects. This is what I've been doing all along (...did you open any of the .afdesign files I posted? It's up to you to determine how you want to group items. Your "ideal" method mentioned above is absolutely doable, except for the fact that (imho) you need a crop on both groups to avoid the double up on shadows.... which is the whole problem in the first place.)

 

In AP, yes, cropping is is global. But that really doesn't matter. Clipping/masking does the exact same thing..... but much much better. It's infinitely more flexible and powerful.

 

In this particular case cropping works (in AD) because the shape situation is very simple. Drawing a rectangle as a clip does the same thing (and is just as fast). But.... when using the crop tool you're limited by the rectangular format. With masking you can do just about anything.

Sorry about it, I did look at the files, but I confused clipping and masking. Clipping both groups works, and the shadows look right, but a fine line is still visible at the position where both clipping forms meet. It is visible in your latest file too. Is there a way to get rid of this?

[jer]

JJ, thanks for this highly instructional and helpful tutorial. I am constantly getting myself confused between AP & AD functions/differences/etc and I like your comparison references. Funny, I never had this problem with PS and AI, maybe because they didn't have such overlap in ver 3 where I started with them - and I was able to grow with them.

[JimmyJack]

Glyphs:

Really? The last file? named "....... III.afdesign". I'd actually like to see that can you post a screen grab?

That's the only one where a gap, I believe, is impossible. The crop shape is on top of a fill with the same color. So there is no gap.

 

But for the others, yes. It's an issue when abutting shapes (as I mentioned in post #4). 

You can avoid it by having a color fill under the "gap" (as I think I did in III). You can also try and compensate with stroke settings (just not inside), but that starts to get "messy".

Other than that, I think the answer you will find is that this is an inherent problem across all vector graphic programs...... but we're working on improving it. Take that as you will...It's been mentioned many many many times on the forums.

 

jer:

Glad you getting something out of it. I'm learning myself working through it :) .

Yeah, the crop difference, in particular, between the two apps has been the subject of several "hot" topics  :D .

Keep pushin' pixels!

[Glyphs]

Glyphs:

Really? The last file? named "....... III.afdesign". I'd actually like to see that can you post a screen grab?

That's the only one where a gap, I believe, is impossible. The crop shape is on top of a fill with the same color. So there is no gap.

 

But for the others, yes. It's an issue when abutting shapes (as I mentioned in post #4). 

You can avoid it by having a color fill under the "gap" (as I think I did in III). You can also try and compensate with stroke settings (just not inside), but that starts to get "messy".

Other than that, I think the answer you will find is that this is an inherent problem across all vector graphic programs...... but we're working on improving it. Take that as you will...It's been mentioned many many many times on the forums.

 

jer:

Glad you getting something out of it. I'm learning myself working through it :) .

Yeah, the crop difference, in particular, between the two apps has been the subject of several "hot" topics  :D .

Keep pushin' pixels!

 

Of course I can post a screen grab :) If I couldn't, I wouldn't write it. That said, I reread post 4 like you told me, and it looks exactly like what you explained. Sorry for the trouble, and thank you very much for the files and the tutorial :)

[JimmyJack]

Ah, that's the one thing I forgot! Turn on Use Precise Clipping in Preferences > Performance.

That will help a lot (but not eliminate) the issue. It should clear that last line completely.

[Glyphs]

Ah, that's the one thing I forgot! Turn on Use Precise Clipping in Preferences > Performance.

That will help a lot (but not eliminate) the issue. It should clear that last line completely.

 

Yes! It works! Thanks!