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Affinity Photo for Linux

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Hi all,

 

I would like to give my opinion on how I see the market. So considering Adobe does not have interest in the Linux market, you guys could at least take the opportunity and make a version of Affinity Photo for Linux, which would be a really nice alternative to Photoshop.

I've tested and looked at a few Photoshop for Linux (mainly open source ones), but unfortunately none of them really stand that well. I've been using Photoshop since 2007 while I was in college, and I still use it at work, so it is really challenge to find out one to use at home that functionality wise, shortcuts, and everything fits to my pace.

 

Best regards,

Antonio Neto.

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There is already a long & ongoing discussion about this. They say they have no plans to develop any Linux versions unless & until they believe it will be profitable. Currently, they say they do not believe this to be the case.


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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I really would like to see Affinity Photo and Designer to go with Linux too. There a lot´s of people in the CG community which want to switch to Linux but they don´t do it because of the lack of the Adobe products.

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Antonio & lichtwerk,

 

Welcome to the Serif Affinity forums :)

 

You are not alone, but we are a small company and they his would be a huge undertaking that we aren't planning on at the moment


Patrick Connor

Serif (Europe) Ltd.

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Same here. I followed the progress for the Windows versions and bought Designer and Photo as an encouragement for Affinity because I think Adobe's arrogant pricing model really needs some competition. But don't plan on using it much. I still have a year of Adobe CC. I find myself often resorting to open source tools for raw photo processing and simple tasks because I'm a developer and full time Linux user. Honestly, they bleak in comparison to Adobe and Affinity products. However, only when I really need to do serious design for the whole day, I reluctantly boot to Windows. It feels a bit like working from a camping site because I'm missing all the conveniences of "my" operating system. I will purchase the first serious Photo editor that comes to Linux.

 

When I read that Windows and MacOS share the same code base for Affinity projects, for a minute I had a smile on my face thinking the effort of porting to Linux would be "simple" enough to be worth it, both for idealistic reasons and the joy of having a unique selling poing that Adobe does not. I understand now this will not happen in the foreseeable future. Which saddens me, but from a commercial point of view I understand.

 

The day that Affinity Photo comes to Linux, I will gladly purchase it again.

 

 

There is already a long & ongoing discussion about this.

 

Could you, for our entertainment, provide a link to this discussion?

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Could you, for our entertainment, provide a link to this discussion?

 

Try [Multi] Linux. Seriously now. (five pages) or Affinity for Linux (three pages).

 

Tip: you can often get better (& faster) search results using the "site" option with a web search engine to restrict the results to this site. In the search field enter something like this:

 

Linux site:affinity.serif.com

 

That works with Google & Bing. I have not tried it with any other search engine.


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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Linux +1

  • I would terminate my Win 8 dualboot system if AP and AD would get a Linux Version.
  • Also I would buy it for up to 200€ per program to help to get the Linux Version off the ground.
  • Maybe Serif can calculate the cost and start a Kickstarter for a Linux Version, so the financial risk is eliminated?


As short term solution:
With a KVM (kernel virtual machine or hardware passthrough ) you should be able to get AP and AD to work as native Windows Version under Linux. The Adobe Progies allready work with hardware passthrough. But I didn't tried to get AP and AD to work this way now.

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5 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

Linux +1

<snip>
As short term solution:
With a KVM (kernel virtual machine or hardware passthrough ) you should be able to get AP and AD to work as native Windows Version under Linux. The Adobe Progies allready work with hardware passthrough. But I didn't tried to get AP and AD to work this way now.

 

You've just reminded me of something that might be worth looking at - Wine.  It's been around for decades and might solve your problem.  From the intro on their About page:

 

Wine (originally an acronym for "Wine Is Not an Emulator") is a compatibility layer capable of running Windows applications on several POSIX-compliant operating systems, such as Linux, macOS, & BSD. Instead of simulating internal Windows logic like a virtual machine or emulator, Wine translates Windows API calls into POSIX calls on-the-fly, eliminating the performance and memory penalties of other methods and allowing you to cleanly integrate Windows applications into your desktop.

 

Disclaimer: the last time I tried anything with Wine was 10 to 15 years ago on my Mac at work.  I haven't used it since then, but neither have I heard anything bad about it since then.


——Gary——

Affinity Photo 1.6.7  •  Affinity Designer 1.6.1  •  macOS Sierra, 10.12.6  •  last updated April 2018

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5 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

Maybe Serif can calculate the cost and start a Kickstarter for a Linux Version, so the financial risk is eliminated?

This has been suggested more than once in the (very long) [Multi] Linux. Seriously now. topic in the Feature Requests, Suggestions and Feedback forum (where requests like this one really should be made).

 

In that topic, Serif has made it very clear that they are not interested in anything like a Kickstarter campaign because it does not fit their business model,  & the decision not to develop Linux versions at this time is not just about the development costs or how many people would be likely to buy them, but also among other things about the resources that would have to be diverted from finishing the current 1.x roadmaps & bringing the other apps in the suite to market.


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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On 5/2/2018 at 8:28 PM, GaryLearnTech said:
On 5/2/2018 at 2:55 PM, Hartmut Doering said:

Linux +1

<snip>
As short term solution:
With a KVM (kernel virtual machine or hardware passthrough ) you should be able to get AP and AD to work as native Windows Version under Linux. The Adobe Progies allready work with hardware passthrough. But I didn't tried to get AP and AD to work this way now.

 

You've just reminded me of something that might be worth looking at - Wine.  It's been around for decades and might solve your problem.  From the intro on their About page: 

 

Wine (originally an acronym for "Wine Is Not an Emulator") is a compatibility layer capable of running Windows applications on several POSIX-compliant operating systems, such as Linux, macOS, & BSD. Instead of simulating internal Windows logic like a virtual machine or emulator, Wine translates Windows API calls into POSIX calls on-the-fly, eliminating the performance and memory penalties of other methods and allowing you to cleanly integrate Windows applications into your desktop.

 

Disclaimer: the last time I tried anything with Wine was 10 to 15 years ago on my Mac at work.  I haven't used it since then, but neither have I heard anything bad about it since then.

Hi,

AP has currently no maintainer for Wine, that's why it does not work flawlessly like PS in Wine. But I found a way to make it work. Instead of Wine which "emulates" Windows and needs a Maintainer who asks Serif which Libraries AP needs and puts them in the AP-Wine-emulation, I use Virtualbox.
Virtualbox is a complete Virtual Machine, I had to install Windows in it.
I found out AP worked flawlessly in Virtualbox when I give the Virtual Machine (VM) 8 GB of RAM and a separate SSD from Mint. Also, 3D Acceleration needs to be turned on. 
- The downside for some people is, you need a Windows Licence Key for this approach.
+ The upside is you have for example a super sturdy Mint Workstation, and Windows runs controlled inside it, with drag and drop and all the good stuff.
+ Also, you can snapshot the VM, so when I start it, it does not boot Windows and such. It just opens a Window with the Windows 8.1 Desktop and AP already open and ready to use. I just have to drag my file over in AP, hit fullscreen and get stuff done.
+ All these, Windows-Registry stability problems or updates that interfere with my schedule are gone.
+ Also, I can use 8.1 far beyond its support cycle because I can manage what access to the Internet I allow the VM specifically.

1839906909_Screenshotfrom2018-06-0410-28-43.thumb.png.715d5fa706068dc74bfae1842303368f.png

So till Serif makes a proper Linux Version this is my solution.
Good news also is with Flatpacks Developers now only have to make one Linux Built, and it workes on all Distros and their versions, so the maintenance of Linux Programs is as easy as making a .exe file now. Even easier, because you can put the version of each Library inside the Flatpack and have no maintenance of versions. So maybe Serif will change its policy in the future.

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Corel attempted this with CorelDraw for Linux back in 2000 or so I think. They were not able to make this work even though it was free at the time. Affinity Designer and Photo may possibly fare better. However,  developing for Linux will not only cost more up front for Serif, but also in terms of support too. The same goes for Adobe, Corel and Xara of course.

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Posted (edited)
On 6/4/2018 at 11:39 PM, iMatt said:

Corel attempted this with CorelDraw for Linux back in 2000 or so I think. They were not able to make this work even though it was free at the time. Affinity Designer and Photo may possibly fare better. However,  developing for Linux will not only cost more up front for Serif, but also in terms of support too. The same goes for Adobe, Corel and Xara of course.

There are more complicated creative tools on Linux then AP, for example, Houdini, Blender, Maya, Unreal Engine 4. Also, there are tools that are similar to AP like Darktable, Gimp, Krita. So if the Coral team wasn't able, that does not mean it always is not possible.

It's not that hard to make Apps multi-platform when you architect them well from the start. You then just have one guy sitting there and refitting the parts that "talk to the OS". When the App is well done, most of the parts of your program don't need to be touched for another OS these days. I suspect that most of AP is created with Multi-Platform in mind otherwise they would have a ton of extra work to do for Windows and Mac that could be done once for both.

I worked in a games company and would argue linuxusers in general are more educated when it comes to fixing problems and using forums. In general, a user answered even complicate problems before we could do it in the forum. I guess the reason is when you have an open OS, you basically "can screw every piece apart and look at it". I had Windows for 20 years and Mac for two, but in two years of using Linux I learned much more than in the 20 years before because it all comes naturally to you when you can look at every part when you want a better understanding of it.

Edited by Hartmut Doering
Didn't answered the second point

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Quote

I worked in a games company

I worked at 4 ! Nice to see another one around...

Quote

and would argue linuxusers in general are more educated

As a lot of us don't have English as a first language, I guess some would understand this as Linux users having more training/academic studies (sources for that? :o ), but for similarity with other languages (ie, not really 'thinking in English', happens to me every day) it could be meaning that in Linux communities people is more polite....  No offense, but both cases are tremendously wrong archetypes. I have been a member, very active at times, at Blender Artists (ye good old Elysiun) forums,  also at Wings 3D forums, and many others. And I have seen very savage attacks in all of those in about the same number of also other outstandingly polite and helpful posts. Just like in every forum where people with a great interest on whatever the matter tends to behave. Mature people and others not so much.  There are forums, usually of more general talk, very specially about politics, where you can see politeness, and even depth of the content, pretty absent from them. Not the usual case in graphic software forums, luckily. Closed source, or not, IMO is not the determinant factor. And this one (the whole Affinity boards) is among the most tolerant and kind forums I've ever found, specially their admins, but also the people in general, and very patient with the Linux users demands , and to newbies, inexperienced artists, among the best that I have seen to date. And at my age and due to my profession, I've been in too many. I think generalizing is dangerous. In 3DS Max forums, while I worked, like you, in several game companies, a mate would help me in the very critical moment of delivering a demo at the following day, no sleep in 18 hours, 2 AM, but the guy was hanging there, and had struggled with same issue at some point of his life, would use all the time needed to point us in the right direction (often it was an undocumented bug, sigh) This did tend to happen often, and the fact is, we helped a lot when we could, too. But those forums were not about free open source software at all, in any way. And it was quite a constant , and it is today, that you get a ton of help in any commercial software forum. If you'd say the opposite, then you would have been in too few ones...

And that's as closed and monopolistic software as you can get... bang, cheerful people, generous, helpful and polite. And the more pro, usually the more gentle...And if it was refered to the other sense, heck, that people is really trained and educated....

So I think that about open source community people  being more gentle, or polite, or prepared/educated, I believe is quite an archetype.  Yes they are particularly helpful. I agree, but so you find a lot of people in closed source apps' forums.

Quote

when it comes to fixing problems and using forums. In general, a user answered even complicate problems before we could do it in the forum. 

Then maybe...you have not been in enough closed source software technical forums, or not in enough number to make such stats/conclusions about commercial software forums....

None of the communities have solid data/real stats to make such kind of statements, and anyway, would be sth extremely subjective and arguable. We all have our own experience "stats"...but all what is little more than a perception, has little value for a statement like that.  This is a similar situation than the scenario of certain Linux users pushing here to convince about numbers and business decisions (or 'moral' pressure, which is....) without solid enough statistical data, to convince a company to take a business direction. And instead, putting on the table very subjective reasons to go for that. You don't get anywhere doing so... with any company.

In a lot of open source communities I've read tons of threads (and participated) like the longest Linux related one here, and certainly, one like that would have rarely ever been allowed after certain level of heat and attack, or disrespect by a bunch of  Linux users (I can easily point you to some of the "kindest" posts, and then you would clearly see what I mean, as you seem to be very polite, thankfully), after the tone of the discussion and accusations of  certain 1-post members wanting a Linux version made asap. Indeed, in most forums on internet, that would have been an automatic thread closed, and a bunch of bans, have no doubt about that. And yes, also in open source ones too, or specially in open source ones. I have even seen it very often.  Here instead, they let you talk all what you want. But a bunch of these newcomers from Linux (with a nice percentage of brilliant exceptions) ) dislike that other forum members don't think exactly like them, and those (besides wishing that the company would focus first in polishing AP, AD and releasing APub...and having a life....) are in bigger numbers...sorry, that's democracy...  

Being someone that likes Linux and hopes it keeps growing, I will tell you that my major worry here is that the manners of many (not you) , are kind of leaving around a bad fame/impression and name for indeed the linux and open source community. And this is terrible for the actual Linux success and propagation !, as I know the real community , and indeed, is very far from this style . So, maybe the younger generation is printing a very different "style" , or these are some very specific particular groups that shout quite, and, as usual, one can't make generalizations with with so small samples, with what arrives here to protest or claim things for which they have no rights to claim for... The bad part of it is, tho some seasoned ones here  know that it is not the case, it couldn't ever be as well, yet general perception in people, in general, can become negative towards the Linux community itself ! (as if  the numbers of users compared to Windows/Mac in the world weren't already bad to make it worse) These kind of pushy users are not realizing this terrible side effect, that this can back-fire to the entire platform..... I mean, this, they don't realize it, either.....


Graphic artist and tech professional specialized in several fields. 
Windows 7, old core i7 860 (2009), 8gb RAM, GTX 275. AD license.

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2 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

I suspect that most of AP is created with Multi-Platform in mind otherwise they would have a ton of extra work to do for Windows and Mac that could be done once for both.

There’s no need to suspect anything! Serif have been quite open about the fact that the core functionality of the Affinity apps was designed to be ‘platform agnostic’ from the very beginning.


Alfred online2long.gif
Affinity Designer (1.6.4.104) • Affinity Photo (1.6.4.104) • Windows 10 Home (4th gen Core i3 CPU)
Affinity Photo for iPad 1.6.7.76 iOS 11.4 (iPad Air 2)

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2 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

It's not that hard to make Apps multi-platform when you architect them well from the start.

Among other things, that depends on how much you care about taking advantage of OS-provided APIs to optimize performance & to reduce memory & other system resource requirements, conforming to platform-specific security models, & how seamlessly you want your app to interoperate with other existing apps optimized for one or another OS. That is, or at least should be, all part of 'talking with (not to) the OS.'

2 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

You then just have one guy sitting there and refitting the parts that "talk to the OS".

There are not enough caffeinated beverages in the entire world for "one guy" to do even that much in a reasonable period of time, even he worked 24/7 until he died of exhaustion.


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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11 minutes ago, αℓƒяє∂ said:

There’s no need to suspect anything! Serif have been quite open about the fact that the core functionality of the Affinity apps was designed to be ‘platform agnostic’ from the very beginning.

True, but they have never explained exactly what they mean by "core functionality." It should be fairly obvious that does not include 'under-the-hood' implementations of things like Apple's Metal or Metal 2 frameworks or the different sandboxing models Apple & Microsoft use. Then there are platform-specific things like Apple's Media Browser or Windows' integrated touch interface to consider.


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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14 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

I worked in a games company and would argue linuxusers in general are more educated when it comes to fixing problems and using forums.

I worked for a company providing tech support for games - the "more educated tag" very definitely doesn't apply to a lot of the users!  

 

14 hours ago, Hartmut Doering said:

I guess the reason is when you have an open OS, you basically "can screw every piece apart and look at it"

I don't think so - Linux users are more likely to be a self-selecting group who are already knowledgeable and enjoy unscrewing the OS.  Most license paying customers aren't like that - they want a turnkey system that works straight out of the box, and if everything is held in place with torx screws, so much the better.


AP user, running Win10

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23 minutes ago, IanSG said:

Most license paying customers aren't like that - they want a turnkey system that works straight out of the box, and if everything is held in place with torx screws, so much the better.

That has been my point too about business customers. What business wants to spend hours fiddling around with Linux for a dozen computers. Much preferable to just lease a few PCs that are delivered fully working with guarantees and technical back-up.

Most home users  don't want the hassle either. Just buy one from a local store with guarantee and technical backup.

That is the Achilles heel of Linux. Too much hassle, unless you are a geek who likes that sort of thing xD


Windows PCs. Photo and Designer, latest non-beta versions.

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1 hour ago, IanSG said:

... Linux users are more likely to be a self-selecting group who are already knowledgeable and enjoy unscrewing the OS.

I think it goes deeper than that. They typically enjoy 'unscrewing' everything they can, including how the OS interacts with apps, & even the apps themselves, so they can figure out how everything works. IOW, they basically want everything to be open source so they can play with it however they want.

That makes me wonder if the majority ever would fully embrace closed source, proprietary software apps, or complain endlessly about opaque code they would be unwilling to trust.

Just something else to think about....


Affinity Photo 1.6.7 & Affinity Designer 1.6.1; macOS High Sierra 10.13.5 iMac (27-inch, Late 2012); 2.9GHz i5 CPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660M; 8GB RAM

AP for iPad 1.6.7.76; 6th Generation iPad 32 GB; Apple Pencil; iOS 11.4

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I think the people referred to are the "call it GNU/Linux/Pop!" folks but that seems to be a very loud/ active minority. I think AP and AD are more targeted at creatives with a Mint, Fedora or Pop! Workstation who want to get stuff done. A lot of them use closed-source if they see value in it, for example, Substance, Houdini, ... and I never saw anyone of them complain about the fact that they have to pay for them. A lot of them think Adobe is crazy money expensive but I think that is a reasonable opinion. I also never got the feeling they are all tinkerers, some just buy there System 76 Workstation and do their stuff. With more "educated" (sorry my English is bad I know) I mean that a lot of them are the PC Gamers from 10-20 years ago which now moved from Windows because they don't like the walled garden approach, or they also code and need a System that is more suited for that but don't want to pay extra for a Mac. But they modded some games or such before and have a basic understanding of how Computers work and how to get them to do what they want.

 

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