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Canceling Develop Persona Darkens Image?


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When I open a raw file in develop persona and I cancel it, the image becomes darker. Is this a bug or am I supposed to always remember to click on the Develop button? Going back to the develop persona doesn't reload the image properly.

 

I've uploaded a short video showing this here https://goo.gl/DN9Uih

 

Also, loading image really is very slow as you can see in the video. This is using a machine with i7 6700k, 32gb ram, gtx970 gpu, and loading from ssd. I hope this is not the case in the final release.

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What happens is that you didn't develop your image, so you end up with the raw pixel data without any tonemapping applied, so it seems very much like an image in linear-space-viewing-in-srgb.

 

You actually see kinda how it works behind the scenes. The raw is opened as a sort of 32bit HDR image, you apply tone mapping to get it to 'normal 16bit' or 8bit.

If you cancel the Develop persona, you're stuck in the 32bit HDR space without any auto-brightness, so all the data available in the raw file displayed, pure, without any gamma correction or other stuff :)

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What happens is that you didn't develop your image, so you end up with the raw pixel data without any tonemapping applied, so it seems very much like an image in linear-space-viewing-in-srgb.

 

You actually see kinda how it works behind the scenes. The raw is opened as a sort of 32bit HDR image, you apply tone mapping to get it to 'normal 16bit' or 8bit.

If you cancel the Develop persona, you're stuck in the 32bit HDR space without any auto-brightness, so all the data available in the raw file displayed, pure, without any gamma correction or other stuff :)

 

Hi Jorismak

 

So how is that helpful to your workflow?

 

Kind regards.

C.

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Hmm.. you're really expecting something useful to happen when you click cancel ?

 

In most other programs you end up with nothing then and no settings saved. I don't see an issue here with this.

 

'oh, I clicked cancel by accident. Reopen the file and start again'.

In acr it's exactly the same...

 

The way to 'fix' it seems to be then to just close the file if you click cancel instead of showing the raw undeveloped data. It still makes you go 'grrr stupid me should not have clicked cancel' :)

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Hmm.. you're really expecting something useful to happen when you click cancel ?

Yes.

In most other programs you end up with nothing then and no settings saved. I don't see an issue here with this.

 

'oh, I clicked cancel by accident. Reopen the file and start again'.

In acr it's exactly the same...

No, it's not. Sorry.

Aside that a "cancle" in ACR means not to touch the RAW (means also its metadata is untouched), it's not like this in ACR.

 

Even with all values set to zero (except whitebalance and tint) we get different results. I either expect those zero values being applied or - even better - that the image is not opened at all when cancle is clicked.

Combined with the actual behavior the metadata might get changed, in case they decide in future to write them to a sidecar file or a database (as ACR does).

post-41044-0-14164100-1480315229_thumb.png

regards,

Ablichter

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It's a bug. The document is supposed to close when you press Cancel.

 

Are you sure? Because you can switch to the Develop Persona at any point from the other Personas such as Photo and you wouldn't water it to close your image but return to the Photo Persona or where you invoked it from ...

Both PC’s Win 11 x64 System with Intuos Pen & Touch 
PC1 ASUS ROG Strix - AMD Ryzen 9 6900X CPU @ 3.3GHz. 32GB RAM

- GPU 1: AMD Radeon integrated. GPU 2: NVIDIA RTX 3060, 6GB
PC2 HP Pavilion - 
Intel® Core™ i7-7700HQ CPU @ 2.80GHz (8 CPUs), 16GB RAM
 - GPU 1: Intel HD Graphics 630, GPU 2: NVIDIA GTX1050, 4GB

iPad (8th Gen) 2020

 

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It's a bug. The document is supposed to close when you press Cancel. 

Why would that be the correct behaviour?  Surely canceling just means don't apply the changes? It seems that the bug is the Develop persona's different behaviours when it's entered via opening a RAW file and when it's selected - a persona's behaviour should be consistent.

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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Are you sure? Because you can switch to the Develop Persona at any point from the other Personas such as Photo and you wouldn't water it to close your image but return to the Photo Persona or where you invoked it from ...

 

In that case, it wouldn't close. It should only if you opened a RAW file. 

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Why would that be the correct behaviour?  Surely canceling just means don't apply the changes? It seems that the bug is the Develop persona's different behaviours when it's entered via opening a RAW file and when it's selected - a persona's behaviour should be consistent.

If you select Develop Persona and then cancel, you're cancelling the develop operation. 

If you load a RAW file and then cancel, you're cancelling the file load. 

Seems consistent to me. 

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If you select Develop Persona and then cancel, you're cancelling the develop operation. 

If you load a RAW file and then cancel, you're cancelling the file load. 

Seems consistent to me. 

I'm not cancelling the load operation, I'm canceling the changes I made in the Develop persona. My idea of consistency is that the persona should apply the same changes (or lack of them) regardless of how it's entered. 

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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I'm not cancelling the load operation, I'm canceling the changes I made in the Develop persona. My idea of consistency is that the persona should apply the same changes (or lack of them) regardless of how it's entered. 

Well, I do cancle the load op - or rather this is what I'd like to happen when clicking cancle.

regards,

Ablichter

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@IanSG:

When you press Cancel, you're returning to whatever state you were in before you entered Develop Persona.

When you load the RAW file, Develop Persona is opened automatically - these two things are treated as a single operation, so it wouldn't make sense for Cancel to return to a useless, half-way "loaded but not yet in Develop" state. 

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Well, I do cancle the load op - or rather this is what I'd like to happen when clicking cancle.

At the top right of the image there's a "close image" button - why not use that (perhaps with a warning if any changes have been made)?  As things stand, if I click on "close image" AF insists that a cancel first, regardless of any changes.  

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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@IanSG:

When you press Cancel, you're returning to whatever state you were in before you entered Develop Persona.

When you load the RAW file, Develop Persona is opened automatically - these two things are treated as a single operation, so it wouldn't make sense for Cancel to return to a useless, half-way "loaded but not yet in Develop" state. 

I take your point, but I'm being forced to cancel because I want to use a different persona.  If I cancel, the image available going forward into Photo isn't the same as the one I get by Developing but not making any changes in the Develop persona.  

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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At the top right of the image there's a "close image" button - why not use that (perhaps with a warning if any changes have been made)?  As things stand, if I click on "close image" AF insists that a cancel first, regardless of any changes.  

As an IT guy I see it as Jon does. A cancel button (should) stop the current action and return me to the state I was before (which was Photo Persona) - without the need to press any other button.

regards,

Ablichter

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Yes I agree that the operation should be cancelled,in PS you are not cancelling ACR but the file open action.

 

In this case the close file option is there after you have opened a file, entered Develop, then cancelled the operation.

Both PC’s Win 11 x64 System with Intuos Pen & Touch 
PC1 ASUS ROG Strix - AMD Ryzen 9 6900X CPU @ 3.3GHz. 32GB RAM

- GPU 1: AMD Radeon integrated. GPU 2: NVIDIA RTX 3060, 6GB
PC2 HP Pavilion - 
Intel® Core™ i7-7700HQ CPU @ 2.80GHz (8 CPUs), 16GB RAM
 - GPU 1: Intel HD Graphics 630, GPU 2: NVIDIA GTX1050, 4GB

iPad (8th Gen) 2020

 

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As an IT guy I see it as Jon does. A cancel button (should) stop the current action and return me to the state I was before (which was Photo Persona) - without the need to press any other button.

I'm an IT guy too, and I completely agree with you - but returning to the Photo Persona isn't my concern.  Unless I've horribly misunderstood him, Jon believes that cancelling the develop persona from a freshly loaded RAW file or one which has been changed should close that file.  I respectfully disagree!  I believe the cancel button should discard any changes but the user is left in the Develop persona.  Selecting a different persona should then be an option without having to explicitly Develop first.  If the user wants to close the image then press the close image button.

AP, AD & APub user, running Win10

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